List Mgmt. 2015 Trade, Draft, Rookie Draft and FA Megathread

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From 45

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For everybody saying we should get Bennell, you are effectively saying that you have no interest in us getting any new big sponsors, or quite seriously keeping some of the ones we already have. The sponsorship team, including Finnis, have bent over backwards to assure sponsors, "We've changed! We've changed! We won't destroy your brand, trust us!"

Seriously, how anybody could even consider this is just astonishing to me. Our brand is awful, awful, awful. This year, FINALLY, we've actually had media dip their toe in the water to say, "Hmm, Saints aren't as bad as they used to be... seem to be doing well at this rebuild thing." Those same media would jump on something like this and go back to the classic cliches about our club's "party culture"... and who could blame them?

Let the Suns be irresponsibly wasting their talent, the Dons be cheats, the Blues be a basketcase, the Lions be full of unrest, the Giants be a club without a soul, etc, etc. Let THEM be the ones to be ripped to shreds by the media for a change. Don't hand our enemies a free hit.
And let us be the upstanding role models , squeaky clean and do everything by the book.Be conservative and not take a chance and be bold whilst we watch our competitors pass us to the ultimate prize, a premiership.. Let's be controlled by the corporate dollar.

Let's grow some balls and take the chance,again, and back ourselves in . Let's trust ourselves knowing what we have put in place can assist a player like Bennell. Let's not be dictated by our past.

i know our club will leave no stone un turned and if want Bennell , we are backing ourselves in and they have my full support
 

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Persevering Saint

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Just so we're clear here. How many of you crying out the cause for grace and compassion to Bennell would give two flying fruitbats about him if he was a rookie listed 0-gamer who'd done nothing in the Suns' seconds? How much of your overwhelming concern that poor Harley gets a fair go, how much of that has to do with his ability to kick a piece of pigskin? If he couldn't, would you be as quick to uphold his right to go out on the town and have ANOTHER incident?

Seems all can be forgiven if you're good enough at kicking around your body, right?
 

Joffaboy

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Forgive me for being a little incredulous about our ability, after years of stuff ups in terms of player behaviour. And heck, maybe you're right, and we are. Are you willing to risk 10,000 members, or a million dollar sponsor? Because I'm telling you right now, if Bennell is on our list and stuffs up, that's what it'll cost us. If you don't believe me, just ask Nettlefold after the Lovett thing went down.

And it would be totally unfair. It was unfair back then, too. The guy never even put on the Saints jumper. But that didn't matter. It doesn't matter that it's unfair either. It just matters that we'd be up the creek - even more than we are - if things went pear shaped, which there is a high potential that they will.
Could you quantify that? You reckon it would cost us 10k members? Where in hell did you pull that figure out of? And I'll give you some advice for free from the business world. Sponsors look at success and exposure, otherwise Emirates would have flicked Collingwood long ago.

They have two drug cheats gone for two years who got the illegal drug while on the illicit gear.

Please don't make BS up. We had our biggest memberships through the Milne and St.Kilda schoolboy scandal. We are down to 32k because we are not winning.

Don't delude yourself.

it is laughable to use figures like 10k members or millions in sponsorship. Mate sorry but you haven't got a clue and are just making shit up.

But hey cool story.
 

Joffaboy

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Just so we're clear here. How many of you crying out the cause for grace and compassion to Bennell would give two flying fruitbats about him if he was a rookie listed 0-gamer who'd done nothing in the Suns' seconds? How much of your overwhelming concern that poor Harley gets a fair go, how much of that has to do with his ability to kick a piece of pigskin? If he couldn't, would you be as quick to uphold his right to go out on the town and have ANOTHER incident?

Seems all can be forgiven if you're good enough at kicking around your body, right?
Of course. I couldn't care less about Bennell personally just like the other 38 on the list. As long as he can play football and help us win games, this is all that matters.

Don't know where you get this compassion stuff.
 

kernelT

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Forgive me for being a little incredulous about our ability, after years of stuff ups in terms of player behaviour. And heck, maybe you're right, and we are. Are you willing to risk 10,000 members, or a million dollar sponsor? Because I'm telling you right now, if Bennell is on our list and stuffs up, that's what it'll cost us. If you don't believe me, just ask Nettlefold after the Lovett thing went down.

And it would be totally unfair. It was unfair back then, too. The guy never even put on the Saints jumper. But that didn't matter. It doesn't matter that it's unfair either. It just matters that we'd be up the creek - even more than we are - if things went pear shaped, which there is a high potential that they will.
It's a cool dramatic story, unfortunately it doesn't really stack up

We had roughly 32,000 members when we drafted Lovett in 2009, he was gone 2 months later.

2010 39,021
2011 39,276

So we actually increased 7,000 members after the incident.

The numbers have come down as our wins have dried up over the past 4 years.
 

Persevering Saint

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Could you quantify that? You reckon it would cost us 10k members? Where in hell did you pull that figure out of? And I'll give you some advice for free from the business world. Sponsors look at success and exposure, otherwise Emirates would have flicked Collingwood long ago.

They have two drug cheats gone for two years who got the illegal drug while on the illicit gear.

Please don't make BS up. We had our biggest memberships through the Milne and St.Kilda schoolboy scandal. We are down to 32k because we are not winning.

Don't delude yourself.

it is laughable to use figures like 10k members or millions in sponsorship. Mate sorry but you haven't got a clue and are just making shit up.

But hey cool story.
Fine, I made a basic ballpark estimate - I didn't know you needed a survey and thesis to get my overall point. Fine. It will cost us LOTS AND LOTS of memberships, and it will cost us sponsors worth LOTS AND LOTS of money (there you go). And I know it will do that, because there is every indication that it did last time we were in any situation like what could happen here. Just ask the insiders. Just ask Nettlefold. Just ask MATT FINNIS. They'll tell you the same story - and they sure as hell don't think it's cool.
 

Joffaboy

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Fine, I made a basic ballpark estimate - I didn't know you needed a survey and thesis to get my overall point. Fine. It will cost us LOTS AND LOTS of memberships, and it will cost us sponsors worth LOTS AND LOTS of money (there you go). And I know it will do that, because there is every indication that it did last time we were in any situation like what could happen here. Just ask the insiders. Just ask Nettlefold. Just ask MATT FINNIS. They'll tell you the same story - and they sure as hell don't think it's cool.
History suggests your are wrong. See dragits post above.

Oops :oops::oops:
 

Ian Dunross

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I'm torn b/w the obvious talent of Bennell & the commercial reality of our brand.

We have no major sponsors essentially. Even Port has three or four major national brands on its sign board.

We really do need to be squeaky clean for a decade & win a flag or 2 just to get back to middle ground sponsorship wise imo.
 

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Persevering Saint

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It's a cool dramatic story, unfortunately it doesn't really stack up

We had roughly 32,000 members when we drafted Lovett in 2009, he was gone 2 months later.

2010 39,021
2011 39,276

So we actually increased 7,000 members after the incident.

The numbers have come down as our wins have dried up over the past 4 years.
Wow, in one of the most successful periods in our club's history, lots of people signed up. Well they didn't sign up BECAUSE of that incident - they signed up IN SPITe OF IT. And other clubs who went through that kind of purple patch got MORE members than that, and more importantly KEPT more of them when they went down. We all talk about how, after the GF years, we should have had 50,000 steady members, given our large supporter base. Well, there's a reason we don't. You might have other theories as to why. I'm putting it down to this ALL this stuff.
 
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Guys we all need to chill out a bit here. There'll be a lot of things about HB that we aren't privy to. We need to trust Trout, Bains and Richo (and maybe Finnis) to make the right informed decision. Which I'm confident they will. If we don't draft him it doesn't mean the club is weak, and if we do draft him it doesn't mean the culture will be stuffed. The boys will make an informed decision that'll be in the best interest of our club.
 

Persevering Saint

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Of course. I couldn't care less about Bennell personally just like the other 38 on the list. As long as he can play football and help us win games, this is all that matters.

Don't know where you get this compassion stuff.
Well, I actually do care about what's best for Bennell, as well as for the club. I think he needs to go to a strong club with a good support network. I don't think we've shown much indication of being capable of that right now.
 

Persevering Saint

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Guys we all need to chill out a bit here. There'll be a lot of things about HB that we aren't privy to. We need to trust Trout, Bains and Richo (and maybe Finnis) to make the right informed decision. Which I'm confident they will. If we don't draft him it doesn't mean the club is weak, and if we do draft him it doesn't mean the culture will be stuffed. The boys will make an informed decision that'll be in the best interest of our club.
Fine. I've given us a bit of fire for the last couple of pages, to make things interesting. I'll quit on it for now. :)
 

Joffaboy

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Wow, in one of the most successful periods in our club's history, lots of people signed up. Well they didn't sign up BECAUSE of that incident - they signed up IN SPITe OF IT. And other clubs who went through that kind of purple patch got MORE members than that, and more importantly KEPT more of them when they went down. We all talk about how, after the GF years, we should have had 50,000 steady members, given our large supporter base. Well, there's a reason we don't. You might have other theories as to why. I'm putting it down to this ALL this stuff.
Give it away mate, you are beginning to embarrass yourself.

You made up BS figures then dragit showed you that the EXACT OPPOSITE happened.

Now we should have 50k members. You sure you aren't related to eleventy Joe Hockey? Throwing numbers about that are ludicrious.

So because you are putting it down to a couple of incidents and not winning a flag for 50 years, it is the truth - lol.

OK mate ;)
 

Joffaboy

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Well, I actually do care about what's best for Bennell, as well as for the club. I think he needs to go to a strong club with a good support network. I don't think we've shown much indication of being capable of that right now.

Bullshit. Gardiner, for a start, Mav Weller is another. Also up to Bennell to sort himself out, with some periphery help. Look at the help Cousins got and he is still a mess.
 

kernelT

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Wow, in one of the most successful periods in our club's history, lots of people signed up. Well they didn't sign up BECAUSE of that incident - they signed up IN SPITe OF IT. And other clubs who went through that kind of purple patch got MORE members than that, and more importantly KEPT more of them when they went down. We all talk about how, after the GF years, we should have had 50,000 steady members, given our large supporter base. Well, there's a reason we don't. You might have other theories as to why. I'm putting it down to this ALL this stuff.
All I did was address your claim that we lost 10,000 members because of one incident… the numbers say our membership actually rose.

Are you seriously suggesting that we are now 20,000 members down because of a guy that was dtraded and delisted 2 months later without playing a single game 6 years ago?
 

Persevering Saint

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Give it away mate, you are beginning to embarrass yourself.

You made up BS figures then dragit showed you that the EXACT OPPOSITE happened.

Now we should have 50k members. You sure you aren't related to eleventy Joe Hockey? Throwing numbers about that are ludicrious.

So because you are putting it down to a couple of incidents and not winning a flag for 50 years, it is the truth - lol.

OK mate ;)
Okay man. I'll quit there. Apparently having rape charges, drug use on camps, sex with minors, our captain's penis on google, and a burning dwarf didn't put anybody off us at all. I stand corrected. Thanks for your enlightening me.
 

andy_cav

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Didn't Bennell just hit a cigarette out of a bouncers hand? How is that even news..

Also I want all the Harley's this offseason
While I have absolutely no info on the incident, I think you'll find that there is more to the story than just knocking the cigarette out of his hand. As you say, you don't get issued with a public nuisance notice just for that... will be interesting to see what/if other things emerge...
 

BigMonty

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Re Bennell,

I would grab him as we need class on the field. However as I have never met him, I will leave it to those that get paid to make that decision and talk to him eye to eye, Trout and co seem to be getting it more often right than wrong.

Am worried by Melbourne paying overs as they have indicated they will trade picks. They have show an inclination to draft indigenous players.

So whilst our risk reward leads me to think of not using pick 5 but a 2nd round pick, I reckon Melbourne with the extra pick last year to get two jets in Brayshaw and Pretracca will be in a position to gamble a bit more and use Pick 6 and swap later picks with GCS, maybe even throw in Jack Watts. If it doesn't work the AFL will give them a PP in a year or two!

Just feel in the bidding war someone will pay more than us. Also the way Jake Carlisle played on Sunday I would also reckon his currency weakened, give me Cale Hooker anyday!
 

Persevering Saint

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All I did was address your claim that we lost 10,000 members because of one incident… the numbers say our membership actually rose.

Are you seriously suggesting that we are now 20,000 members down because of a guy that was dtraded and delisted 2 months later without playing a single game 6 years ago?
No, not just that incident. See the list I just gave JB. See my overall argument throughout, about the collective damage to our brand. But hey, you two know best. I bask in your higher wisdom.
 
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