Analysis 2016 Draft...

[Sanders]

There was a debate on whether anyone thought Angwin is a player to avoid drafting and the posts I linked to indicate (if as secondhand opinions) that people did know - eg. Harper needing to be vigilant, etc.

Those opinions were from BF posters some years after the event.

Even if Phil Harpers alleged and uncited comments are taken as read: needing to be vigilant certainly doesn't imply anything at all about not drafting him or suggesting others wouldn't have.

He was a top of the draft prospect and we couldn't believe our luck. In his first preseason there was talk of being as good as rehn and one of the best players we ever drafted.

We were fizzing with excitement after the event, and for most of the first year.

 

[Mego Red]

Sorry you can't make a long distance casual observation like that

Angwin was borderline sociopathic.

99% of the population would be more level headed than him, so it's a safe assumption.

Do you have any evidence otherwise?

 

[Mego Red]

Those opinions were from BF posters some years after the event.

Even if Phil Harpers alleged and uncited comments are taken as read: needing to be vigilant certainly doesn't imply anything at all about not drafting him or suggesting others wouldn't have.

He was a top of the draft prospect and we couldn't believe our luck. In his first preseason there was talk of being as good as rehn and one of the best players we ever drafted.

We were fizzing with excitement after the event, and for most of the first year.

We weren't fizzing with excitement. This draft was years before the level of coverage that happens now. There was one article in the Age most years.

Everyone of those links have some anecdotal background to the widely held view that people knew of Angwin's background. Clearly we underrated its impact and thought we could manage it.

I don't think there's ever been any coverage of Angwin that said it was a surprise how things unfolded with him.

In any event - the only coverage of Cox has been people talking about how GOOD his prep and commitment is.

All of this "we have to watch out" re him just doesn't stack up.

Now, if you want to make the case that he doesn't seem like what we need - that I agree with.

 

[Jeffcrowe]

Just finished watching the U18 All-Stars match. Unfortunately Brodie and Setterfield were late withdrawals from Team O'Loughlin, meaning that Team Judd was far more stacked and the game was a bit one sided, but it was still enjoyable to watch.

As far as the prospects go, McCluggage and Taranto stood head and shoulders above the rest. Both were so clean with the ball and damaging by foot, kicking 4 goals apiece. It was evident why they're so highly rated.

Standouts:
McCluggage - As above
Taranto - Ditto
Florent - Was really a one-man show for Team O'Loughlin. Seems very composed in traffic and has good hands.

Above Average:
Bowes - Probably 4th best on ground behind the above 3 but was more of an accumulator than a game-breaker. On what I've seen I prefer Brodie to Bowes, but he'll be a good pick-up for Gold Coast.
McGrath - Didn't stand out like McCluggage and Taranto but probably had less opportunities playing in defence. Didn't make many mistakes when he had the ball.
Petrevski-Seton - Wasn't anywhere near as effective as Florent. Still clearly one of the better talents in the game, but didn't break the game open.

Better than expected:
Hayward - Wasn't named in the bests but looked dynamic. I wasn't a huge fan before watching this but I liked what I saw. Seems to have good speed and a long kick.
Bolton - I wouldn't draft him with our first pick, but he definitely had an impact in this game. Line-breaker but has a strange kicking action.
Battle - I thought he looked dangerous around goals. Again, I wouldn't pick him with our first pick, but he should be a solid pick-up for a team in the 20's.

Average:
Powell-Pepper - Solid but overshadowed by the rest of the midfield. He's a bit scrappy. I wouldn't take him with our first pick.
Drew - Not a first rounder, but seems to know what his limitations are and play to his role. Would be a solid second pick if he's still there.

Worse than expected:
Scrimshaw - Was under siege a bit due to playing in defense in the clearly inferior team, but he didn't excite me. Looked slow and didn't really do anything impressive with ball in hand.
Perryman - Didn't like his game at all, thought he got beaten a lot 1-on-1.
Ainsworth - He had one nice play where he showed some good speed but apart from that looked down on form and made a few mistakes.
Berry - Just wasn't in the play enough, but at least he was generally clean when he got it.

Poor:
Gallucci - Didn't have much impact and seemed to butcher it every time he got a kick. He looks small and I wouldn't take him with our first pick.
Marshall - Hardly sighted, which is pretty damning considering he was a forward on the dominant team.
English - If I was going to pick a ruckman in the 1st round I'd want him to be special. English didn't show elite traits in this setting.
Cedric Cox - Doesn't get the ball enough. No way I'd spend pick 13 on him. We need someone who can impact the game much more often.
Jarman - Looked decent early on but fell out of the game and didn't impress. Obviously clean with the ball but his lack of speed and size is an issue. Late pick.

be carful judging too much off one game , a lot of those guys were cooked esp the ones hat played tac GF 5 days earlier

 

[Captain Furious]

be carful judging too much off one game , a lot of those guys were cooked esp the ones hat played tac GF 5 days earlier

For sure. Was also more a showcase of skills, the level of pressure and defensive tactics that you'd normally see in a game wasn't there.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

You're saying he can't say that as he hasn't interviewed him or know him personally which is fair but you say due to family history he would be a huge risk. Now I take it you know him personally or interviewed him to make such statements right?

Do we accept at face value that Berry is of outstanding character and a leader? .......if so then we also accept at face value that Cedric Cox has had a troubled past, correct

Now if i say ....no, my view is that Berry is not a particularly good leader or a good character ....i dare say people would question me on that observation the same as i challenged Danger in Texas ....would you not agree?

 

[Danger in Texas]

I still thonk we might be calling out Daniel Venables with our first pick. He seems to tick a lot of the boxes we are looking for.

Some serious match winning ability there too.

I would really like to think so

 

[Danger in Texas]

Says exactly who????

Nowhere have i seen any Crows club official say they're interested in any player ......cmon, you following media, rumor, and inuendo way too much now

Come on, it's come from three different sources that we're interested in him. Now whether they're strong or not is unknown to me, but there's obviously some interest there (unless it's a smokescreen to get North/WCE to take him so that we get a slider, but that seems unlikely to me). Note that I say 'reportedly', too.

If it comes from a number of sources, of course I'm going to believe it. We're two days out from the draft, of course the leaks are going to be coming out now.

 

[Danger in Texas]

Do we accept at face value that Berry is of outstanding character and a leader? .......if so then we also accept at face value that Cedric Cox has had a troubled past, correct

Now if i say ....no, my view is that Berry is not a particularly good leader or a good character ....i dare say people would question me on that observation the same as i challenged Danger in Texas ....would you not agree?

Just a quick question, where's your evidence he's had a 'troubled' past? Now there probably is something that I've missed, but I'd like to see it?

Btw I'd define troubled along the lines of himself, or parents, being ratbags

 

[Danger in Texas]

Also, happy Twomey Day everyone

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Just a quick question, where's your evidence he's had a 'troubled' past? Now there probably is something that I've missed, but I'd like to see it?

Btw I'd define troubled along the lines of himself, or parents, being ratbags

From the exact same sources that have said Berry is an outstanding leader and character .....so it's all taken at face value

BTW you do realise that once one media outlet reports something, then it gets on the media merry go round ......plagiarism at it's best

Just watch this week McCluggage go back to #1 favourite with experts, after a week everyone said McGrath .......sheep

 

[FAITH]

Also, happy Twomey Day everyone

time?

 

[Danger in Texas]

From the exact same sources that have said Berry is an outstanding leader and character .....so it's all taken at face value

BTW you do realise that once one media outlet reports something, then it gets on the media merry go round ......plagiarism at it's best

Just watch this week McCluggage go back to #1 favourite with experts, after a week everyone said McGrath .......sheep

I want to see the evidence. I haven't seen anything that's said he's had a troubled past. Difficult, maybe, but not troubled.

Yes, but where did that one media outlet get the source from? It has to come from somewhere. Bishop was the first to say it, and now CF has heard (albeit second-hand) the same. Tend to think the interest is definitely there.

 

[Danger in Texas]

time?

Late afternoon, IIRC

 

[The Sloane Ranger]

I'm no recruiter however my guess is that Angwin is no chance to be selected with our first selection

 

[StonesThrow]

I'm no recruiter however my guess is that Angwin is no chance to be selected with our first selection

Nor Doedee or Himmelberg.

 

[marty36]

I want to see the evidence. I haven't seen anything that's said he's had a troubled past. Difficult, maybe, but not troubled.

Yes, but where did that one media outlet get the source from? It has to come from somewhere. Bishop was the first to say it, and now CF has heard (albeit second-hand) the same. Tend to think the interest is definitely there.

You're so hypocritical you want to see the source that a media outlet gets it info, on this one yet, you want to be believe the media and not question there source when talking about who the crows are interested in. And yet we all know there is only one source to that question, and again we all know the crows are a closed book.

 

[Danger in Texas]

You're so hypocritical you want to see the source that a media outlet gets it info, on this one yet, you want to be believe the media and not question there source when talking about who the crows are interested in. And yet we all know there is only one source to that question, and again we all know the crows are a closed book.

You've got me wrong. I just want to see the article where they've said he's had a 'troubled' past. I'm not going to question the information. That's far from being a hypocrite.

Besides, the information about who we're chasing has to come from somewhere. We've been linked to a number of players (Berry, Hayward, Cox to name a few). Now, some of this is obviously smoke and mirrors, but there's no way it can all be that.

 

[Captain Furious]

Do we accept at face value that Berry is of outstanding character and a leader? .......if so then we also accept at face value that Cedric Cox has had a troubled past, correct

Now if i say ....no, my view is that Berry is not a particularly good leader or a good character ....i dare say people would question me on that observation the same as i challenged Danger in Texas ....would you not agree?

I'd also like to see some evidence of this. Have heard nothing of the kind. Close and supportive family. He moved around a bit, as you do for school and football if you live somewhere as far away as Halls Creek. That's hardly troubled.

 

[Jeffcrowe]

The psych interviews and background checks are way more advanced than previous eras although not infallible

I'd say moving from far north WA to Melbourne on your own accord to better your life as an 18 or 19 yr old is more impressive character wise than being sent to an exclusive private school by your parents and angling toward wanting to stay in your home state to play AFL football

Trust the recruiters in the character stuff I'd say

Then it's down to whether they pick the right player talent wise

 

[CrowinNT]

Ref: Cedric Cox
I haven't read anything that suggests he has a "troubled" past.
Remote community life is very different and presents a complex array of challenges.

What I am hearing said is:
He wants the opportunity to reach his AFL dream & this has meant leaving Halls Creek.
That he is very "driven" to be successful
If he is drafted he would be "proud"
Cox wants to make his family and community proud of him.

 

[betterthanu]

Has Emma Quayle put out her Phantom yet? Shes usually the one with the most inside gossip isnt she? Or does Cal have her beat these days..

 

[EddieWalker]

There was a debate on whether anyone thought Angwin is a player to avoid drafting and the posts I linked to indicate (if as secondhand opinions) that people did know - eg. Harper needing to be vigilant, etc.

I don't remember hearing anything pre-draft or even pre-season about Angwin having issues.

I do remember very clearly though watching his first game for the Bays on the ABC, I think we played Sturt, and you could just see the kid had talent and the potential to become a star. I remember excitedly going to talk to a fellow Bays supporter at work on the Monday to ask him what he thought from watching him at the ground. First words out of his mouth were "the kid is nuts" apparently he'd grabbed a bottle of wine and was up dancing on one of the tables. I quickly gave up hope for him after that.

 

[Danger Zone]

Are you serious? He posted some links where Himmelberg wasn't mentioned and that's proof he wasn't? It's like saying Tom Cruise has never been in a movie and naming 10 movies he wasn't in as 'proof'.

Guess you already feel stupid after WW and DiT found proof he was. You deserve it.

Why would I feel stupid? I just said that if you are going to attack someone for not providing evidence then you need to provide evidence yourself. Which they then did.

Edit: Just caught up on the last few pages and noticed people have moved on so I will too.

 

[GreyCrow]

The only talk around Angwin and the AFC in that draft year was similar to Dangerfields year and that was the Local Boy v Interstate. Most talk in 2000 was around Kane Cornes and how the Crows missed a father-son by 1 year ( rule since changed) and how we should have selected him at 7 instead of Angwin. The second lot of commentary on Angwin was about his connection to Ayres and that WAS brought up early but after we drafted him once it was recognized.