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Review 2016.

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Seeds said:
With the list we had at our disposal and the trading away of the future it was premiership or bust. Thus season was a bust and serious questions need to be asked of the players, coaches and board.
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Yes because the 7 debutantes we had can't possibly improve and neither can the likes of cockatoo, Lang, Gregson, or Thurlow who missed the entire season, or Kolo, or Menzel who had his first full season in 5 years.
Danger, Henderson, Smith and Scott Selwood can't possibly forge better combinations. It was this year or bust because ALL those factors were bound to reach their peak level in 2016 and not a moment later.
 
Seeds said:
With the list we had at our disposal and the trading away of the future it was premiership or bust. Thus season was a bust and serious questions need to be asked of the players, coaches and board.
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So you don't rate our chances over the next few years?
We have areas to work on admittedly but I wouldn't write us off. It may seem as if we have traded our future but let's see what magic Wells can weave this trade and draft period. Our back office always seems to be well planned - let's see what develops
 

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iameviljez said:
Ergo...?
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Thought you weren't counting players who didn't play for us last year. If you were then how did you miss the player who kicked 2 goals a game for us resulting in a total of 33 after only two games last season? Or smith, cowan, dangerfield and henderson for that matter who all had better seasons? Cockatoo also improved albeit from a low base. Questionable whether Kolo improved. Best games were last season.
 
Farmer2Goggin said:
So you don't rate our chances over the next few years?
We have areas to work on admittedly but I wouldn't write us off. It may seem as if we have traded our future but let's see what magic Wells can weave this trade and draft period. Our back office always seems to be well planned - let's see what develops
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We may have one more shot next year. Enright, bartel, lonergan are all about to go or have one more season at best. Taylor and mackie are declining rapidly and there is talk we are about to trade one of our only two decent non key forwards in motlop. There only looks to be real improvement in cockatoo , Thurlow and Menzel if he can build more strength in his knee. Was expecting to see improvement in the 24-25 year olds but they all look like they have peaked now (exception possibly with menegola). Don't see any other youth coming through. Don't rate Lang and gregson.
 
Seeds said:
Thought you weren't counting players who didn't play for us last year. If you were then how did you miss the player who kicked 2 goals a game for us resulting in a total of 33 after only two games last season? Or smith, cowan, dangerfield and henderson for that matter who all had better seasons? Cockatoo also improved albeit from a low base. Questionable whether Kolo improved. Best games were last season.
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Do you mean Shane Kersten? If so, it's just that I forgot about him.
 
I think we will see improvement next year; at least from a general team perspective. I am not sure if that will be enough to quell a team like gws who are just going to improve dramatically.

Our midfield is still quite young - we don't have to worry about retirements happening there anytime soon and I expect to see improvement from Menegola and Guthrie who with thurlow back spends more time in the middle.

Our forward line remains the biggest concern. I thought kersten was fine but unless they stick with him getting help for Hawkins is a must. Menzel and McCarthy will both be better next year.

We will be fine.
 

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Duskfire said:
Our forward line remains the biggest concern. I thought kersten was fine but unless they stick with him getting help for Hawkins is a must. Menzel and McCarthy will both be better next year.

We will be fine.
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I think that we could do with a player who can play as a genuine KP forward. (Obviously the Mitch Clark thing has not and will not work).

I don't see Stanley as a real KPF, and I think that we need someone other than just Hawkins as a major target. We are just too predictable with the ball going to Hawkins so often. It would probably help to free up the smalls and medium forwards too with another genuine KPF to target.

We could also do with a good strong bodied small forward who knows how to crumb a ball from the packs. I cannot see anyone on our list who could fill those roles. I like McCarthy and Gregson but they just don't seem to get to the fall of the ball.

Parsons looks the most likely kid in the VFL to make it as a forward @ 189cm / 82 kgs and is a nice kick of the footy with good pace. But he is a rookie and one LTI could end any chances of him progressing to AFL level. But he looks the best of the listed kids as a future forward prospect. Could possibly make a nice HFF.
 
The rabbi said:
I think that we could do with a player who can play as a genuine KP forward. (Obviously the Mitch Clark thing has not and will not work).

I don't see Stanley as a real KPF, and I think that we need someone other than just Hawkins as a major target. We are just too predictable with the ball going to Hawkins so often. It would probably help to free up the smalls and medium forwards too with another genuine KPF to target.
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Obviously the big problem is finding these sorts of players just isn't that easy as you'd well know. To get a good one you have to either give something up to get him or you have to develop one for a few years (and the young talls usually require a decent draft selection because the quality big kids usually get taken early).

In many ways it is why we took the punt on Clark. He was relatively cheap (although there are still Varcoe fans who would argue it cost too much...and they'd probably win that debate 2 years down the track) and if he could recapture even half of his best he'd have been a decent foil for Hawkins.

Like McIntosh, the Clark trade didn't work out but I understand why we rolled the dice.

The rabbi said:
We could also do with a good strong bodied small forward who knows how to crumb a ball from the packs. I cannot see anyone on our list who could fill those roles. I like McCarthy and Gregson but they just don't seem to get to the fall of the ball.
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Despite not liking him much I feel Smedts could fill that forward role. He clearly ain't strong bodied but his best footy has been played up forward and he could add another dimension to the forward line which was very one dimensional in the end.

Smedts ain't worth anything on the trade front and is, I think, contracted, so lets get him fit over the pre-season, light a fire under him and then give him an opportunity in the position he looks best suited.

If he doesn't fire a shot, he gets moved on at the end of 2017.

The rabbi said:
Parsons looks the most likely kid in the VFL to make it as a forward @ 189cm / 82 kgs and is a nice kick of the footy with good pace. But he is a rookie and one LTI could end any chances of him progressing to AFL level. But he looks the best of the listed kids as a future forward prospect. Could possibly make a nice HFF.
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Possibly but I have him pencilled in at the other end of the ground.

He still has a little way to go but I think he could be a really useful back flank with his size, running and kicking ability.

Time will tell but I am very bullish on him (Cunico is the other one I have some high hopes for if he can shake the injury issues).
 
PhatBoy said:
Garbage.

Blaming good players and leaders for the deficiencies of others is a joke.

I guess it was Steve Smith's captaincy that made all his teammates bat like busted ring holes in Sri Lanka.
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I'm not laying it all on the "good players". But good leaders will put their foot down when players in the team aren't pulling their weight. It wouldn't be the first AFL captain who has told his coach he does not want a certain player in the team the next week. It might sound extreme, but the captain has been put there on trust. I never saw that kind of leadership. Never saw this.
 
RegHickeyStand said:
I'm not laying it all on the "good players". But good leaders will put their foot down when players in the team aren't pulling their weight. It wouldn't be the first AFL captain who has told his coach he does not want a certain player in the team the next week. It might sound extreme, but the captain has been put there on trust. I never saw that kind of leadership. Never saw this.
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Unless you are part of the team.or staff how the hell would you know?
 
RegHickeyStand said:
I'm not laying it all on the "good players". But good leaders will put their foot down when players in the team aren't pulling their weight. It wouldn't be the first AFL captain who has told his coach he does not want a certain player in the team the next week. It might sound extreme, but the captain has been put there on trust. I never saw that kind of leadership. Never saw this.
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Or in the case of Tom Harley and Steve Johnson, the next 5 weeks.
 

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