2017 Draft thread

[jjami15]

Can I just say booo (in lieu of using stronger language) at Cal Twomey.

On Twomey's podcast today, just casually mentions Jaidyn Stephenson is a Lions fan. The one top end kid I don't want for the Lions purely based on others such as LDU, Lochie O'Brien or Darcy Fogarty being a better fit.

Just getting a little worked up there briztoon. All of them have a team that they follow but 99% don't care where they get to go (just those who don't want to go North).

 

[M Malice]

Can I just say booo (in lieu of using stronger language) at Cal Twomey.

On Twomey's podcast today, just casually mentions Jaidyn Stephenson is a Lions fan. The one top end kid I don't want for the Lions purely based on others such as LDU, Lochie O'Brien or Darcy Fogarty being a better fit.

I notice that Jayden Stephenson is number 1 on the 2 latest phantom draft boards to be updated briz, I think he would be a great fit for us and could in time graduate into a 70mid/30fwd player, he has X factor which we need.

 

[briztoon]

I notice that Jayden Stephenson is number 1 on the 2 latest phantom draft boards to be updated briz, I think he would be a great fit for us and could in time graduate into a 70mid/30fwd player, he has X factor which we need.

I guess I just want a hard nosed first to contest player.

I've been talking myself more and more in to Darcy Fogarty. I like the idea of having two large, 192cm plus bookends to our midfield in Berry and Fogarty.

Also pretty keen on Jack Higgins as defensive small forward.

As always, there are some players in the draft I like, and others I'd rather Brisbane pass on.

 

[Carlos Danger]

I guess I just want a hard nosed first to contest player.

I've been talking myself more and more in to Darcy Fogarty. I like the idea of having two large, 192cm plus bookends to our midfield in Berry and Fogarty.

Also pretty keen on Jack Higgins as defensive small forward.

As always, there are some players in the draft I like, and others I'd rather Brisbane pass on.

Can't wait to see Fogarty play in the carnival. Watched him the last 2 weeks live & he struggled a bit, but does some nice things at the same time.

Pretty hard to get a read on him playing as a 17yo in the best state league in Australia. And out of position, although he got some more midfield minutes last weekend.

But just on the size of him & his inside mid style he would be a great addition to our team.

Plus he's country SA going home will still see him 3hrs from family - a big selling point given our current retention issues

 

[lions27]

Can't wait to see Fogarty play in the carnival. Watched him the last 2 weeks live & he struggled a bit, but does some nice things at the same time.

Pretty hard to get a read on him playing as a 17yo in the best state league in Australia. And out of position, although he got some more midfield minutes last weekend.

But just on the size of him & his inside mid style he would be a great addition to our team.

Plus he's country SA going home will still see him 3hrs from family - a big selling point given our current retention issues

Best state league at the moment is WAFL, been a while since that... anyway sounds like a gun I'll have to keep an eye out for him

 

[Carlos Danger]

Best state league at the moment is WAFL, been a while since that... anyway sounds like a gun I'll have to keep an eye out for him

That's probably pretty debatable, think wafl & SANFL have both only lost 1 origin match since 09 & has been to each other. Only thing we can say for sure is it has the VFL covered

I'm not professional youth talent scout. But he is showing a little bit each week. Has to be good for his development playing against men where others are playing a lower standard.

The carnival will be a real chance for him to show how good he is.

 

[bhys16]

We need more top end athletes on our list. We must have the slowest team in the league..

Sure you gain speed with strength as you grow and we are young as can be but only players on our list that I would consider above average athletes are Keays, McCluggage, Mayes, Martin, Zorko, Robertson, McStay, Cox, Paparone, Hipwood, Archie Smith and William. When you consider only Zorko and Mayes are established players, it shows why we get smashed as soon as a clearance goes against us..

This is compounded by having a few downright liabilities in the athleticism department such as Lester, Rockliff, Andrews who are crucial members of the team for other reasons.

Every week we watch our small defenders get turned inside-out and our small forwards unable to chase anyone down and it would completely change our team to have 2 or 3 more players that can physically dominate their opponent through speed/endurance.

Last year's draft was a step in the right direction with McCluggage, Berry and Cox but I would love us to get a few players in the draft who were top in the agility testing to balance our list out.

Speed brings shutdown defence, quicker spread out of stoppages and more effective pressure, all of the main deficiencies in our game at the moment. Speed can also cover a lack of strength in a number of positions on the field were we currently have neither..

 

[lions27]

That's probably pretty debatable, think wafl & SANFL have both only lost 1 origin match since 09 & has been to each other. Only thing we can say for sure is it has the VFL covered

I'm not professional youth talent scout. But he is showing a little bit each week. Has to be good for his development playing against men where others are playing a lower standard.

The carnival will be a real chance for him to show how good he is.

Yeah just read his draft profile sounds like a weapon.

 

[a mayes ing]

We need more top end athletes on our list. We must have the slowest team in the league..

Sure you gain speed with strength as you grow and we are young as can be but only players on our list that I would consider above average athletes are Keays, McCluggage, Mayes, Martin, Zorko, Robertson, McStay, Cox, Paparone, Hipwood, Archie Smith and William. When you consider only Zorko and Mayes are established players, it shows why we get smashed as soon as a clearance goes against us..

This is compounded by having a few downright liabilities in the athleticism department such as Lester, Rockliff, Andrews who are crucial members of the team for other reasons.

Every week we watch our small defenders get turned inside-out and our small forwards unable to chase anyone down and it would completely change our team to have 2 or 3 more players that can physically dominate their opponent through speed/endurance.

Last year's draft was a step in the right direction with McCluggage, Berry and Cox but I would love us to get a few players in the draft who were top in the agility testing to balance our list out.

Speed brings shutdown defence, quicker spread out of stoppages and more effective pressure, all of the main deficiencies in our game at the moment. Speed can also cover a lack of strength in a number of positions on the field were we currently have neither..

Wasn't Allison one of the quickest players in the draft last season?

 

[briztoon]

We need more top end athletes on our list. We must have the slowest team in the league..

Sure you gain speed with strength as you grow and we are young as can be but only players on our list that I would consider above average athletes are Keays, McCluggage, Mayes, Martin, Zorko, Robertson, McStay, Cox, Paparone, Hipwood, Archie Smith and William. When you consider only Zorko and Mayes are established players, it shows why we get smashed as soon as a clearance goes against us..

This is compounded by having a few downright liabilities in the athleticism department such as Lester, Rockliff, Andrews who are crucial members of the team for other reasons.

Every week we watch our small defenders get turned inside-out and our small forwards unable to chase anyone down and it would completely change our team to have 2 or 3 more players that can physically dominate their opponent through speed/endurance.

Last year's draft was a step in the right direction with McCluggage, Berry and Cox but I would love us to get a few players in the draft who were top in the agility testing to balance our list out.

Speed brings shutdown defence, quicker spread out of stoppages and more effective pressure, all of the main deficiencies in our game at the moment. Speed can also cover a lack of strength in a number of positions on the field were we currently have neither..

Unfortunately we can't cover every weakness in a single draft. There is one elite talent in this years draft with speed to burn, outside midfielder Lochie O'Brien. For an inside mid, LDU possess good speed. And from Vic City, Jack Petruccelle another outside mid, is the fastest player in the TAC cup, but is somewhat of a project player being relatively new to the game.

 

[Nick Lions]

He is a mid sized Forward/Mid I believe.
Tom Bell hasnt really set the world on fire in that position and we dont really have anyone to fill that role. Jack Gunston type maybe? We could do with players of that ilk.
Granted, the others on your list are more a requirement. And we need to look at mids first, both inside and out.

Stringer type would be nice.

 

[dizzysquizz]

Unfortunately we can't cover every weakness in a single draft. There is one elite talent in this years draft with speed to burn, outside midfielder Lochie O'Brien. For an inside mid, LDU possess good speed. And from Vic City, Jack Petruccelle another outside mid, is the fastest player in the TAC cup, but is somewhat of a project player being relatively new to the game.

Yeh Jack Petrucelle is the one im really looking forward to in champs, has pace to burn.
Only had 5 touches in U18 trial matches on weekend.

Britzoon ( or any draft experts) do you think Jack could become a full time midfielder in time ?

 

[jjami15]

Unfortunately we can't cover every weakness in a single draft. There is one elite talent in this years draft with speed to burn, outside midfielder Lochie O'Brien. For an inside mid, LDU possess good speed. And from Vic City, Jack Petruccelle another outside mid, is the fastest player in the TAC cup, but is somewhat of a project player being relatively new to the game.

I haven't hitched my wagon to anyone yet but Lochie O is one that I do like. Has speed, endurance and silky skills by hand and foot. We definitely need his type as well as others and as he's not projecting as a No 1 pick so there is the advantage of moving back a spot or two, getting another pick in the early teens and doing like we did last year in more or less getting two kids for the price of 1. GWS aren't afraid to target a specific player and go get them as seen by last year so are always a viable trade partner and can see their stocks being pilfered again this year so will have likely have some early picks.

 

[13Beast]

I haven't hitched my wagon to anyone yet but Lochie O is one that I do like. Has speed, endurance and silky skills by hand and foot. We definitely need his type as well as others and as he's not projecting as a No 1 pick so there is the advantage of moving back a spot or two, getting another pick in the early teens and doing like we did last year in more or less getting two kids for the price of 1. GWS aren't afraid to target a specific player and go get them as seen by last year so are always a viable trade partner and can see their stocks being pilfered again this year so will have likely have some early picks.

You'd think this strategy would then be an almost certainty if Schache leaves - we get our man on draft night plus having extra late picks may well be the sweetener the Lions have to throw in to get the best return for a Schache deal (presuming they'd gun for a marquee player or very high draft pick)

 

[13Beast]

I haven't hitched my wagon to anyone yet but Lochie O is one that I do like. Has speed, endurance and silky skills by hand and foot. We definitely need his type as well as others and as he's not projecting as a No 1 pick so there is the advantage of moving back a spot or two, getting another pick in the early teens and doing like we did last year in more or less getting two kids for the price of 1. GWS aren't afraid to target a specific player and go get them as seen by last year so are always a viable trade partner and can see their stocks being pilfered again this year so will have likely have some early picks.

Swans currently have #4 and #22...makes you wonder how a lot of interstate clubs (especially those in NRL heartland), as soon as the success wanes, the cracks show. I could see Sydney doing something bold and having a think about trading for our #1, as it sells hope and could be a great play for them. Could even have one of their older, more experienced players added who may be surplus to Sydney moving forward, but can help add some wise heads and maturity. McVeigh is a possibility, though he does look pretty cooked.

 

[briztoon]

I'm interested to see how many list spots and there fore draft picks we take to the draft.

Unless we pay out a couple of contracts, we might only take 4 picks to the draft.

Will make it hard to fit academy kids with later draft picks if there are not spots for them.

 

[lionshine]

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/leader/...s/news-story/2a36d9e6327fa9d92543a8e243c29297

 

[Dalions]

Top draft contender set to prove his versatility - http://m.afl.com.au/news/2017-05-31/top-draft-contender-set-to-prove-his-versatility

 

[Carlos Danger]

I'm interested to see how many list spots and there fore draft picks we take to the draft.

Unless we pay out a couple of contracts, we might only take 4 picks to the draft.

Will make it hard to fit academy kids with later draft picks if there are not spots for them.

You're right looking at the list off contract there's not heaps going out. But 5 spots almost isn't enough. If we do get a PP and a pick for schache if he leaves that's 5 picks in the 1st 20
Would be silly not to use pick 40 & there's academy kids we may want to add later on.

With the cap going up there's prob plenty of space to pay out contracts of an unwanted 2018 player - you don't hear it happening too often though

Has there been any further talk of abolishing the rookie list for just extra list spots? Would be a handy time for that to happen as upgrading of 1-2 players would potentially be on the cards next year as well

 

[briztoon]

You're right looking at the list off contract there's not heaps going out. But 5 spots almost isn't enough. If we do get a PP and a pick for schache if he leaves that's 5 picks in the 1st 20
Would be silly not to use pick 40 & there's academy kids we may want to add later on.

With the cap going up there's prob plenty of space to pay out contracts of an unwanted 2018 player - you don't hear it happening too often though

Has there been any further talk of abolishing the rookie list for just extra list spots? Would be a handy time for that to happen as upgrading of 1-2 players would potentially be on the cards next year as well

You also have to look at rookie upgrades.

Hammelmann, Hanley and Eagles have to be promoted to the main list or de-listed. Others have posted that we can always de-list a player such as Freeman with a commitment to pick him up in the rookie draft. I am not sure if that means we have first rights to re-drafting Freeman, or another team can draft him in the open draft or rookie draft before we do.

I would not be surprised if we did receive a PP and a high pick for Schache, we look to trade for a first round pick next year.

2017 Out Of Contract Players:
Tom Rockliff
Nicholas Robertson
Michael Close
Daniel McStay
Claye Beams
Jonathan Freeman
Ryan Harwood
Jarrad Jensen
Josh Schache
Ben Keays
Josh Clayton
Cian Hanley (R)
Matthew Hammelmann (R)
Reuben William (R)
Matt Eagles (R)
Blake Grewar (R)
Jake Barrett (R)
Mitchell Hinge (R)
Oscar McInerney (R)

 

[Carlos Danger]

You also have to look at rookie upgrades.

Hammelmann, Hanley and Eagles have to be promoted to the main list or de-listed. Others have posted that we can always de-list a player such as Freeman with a commitment to pick him up in the rookie draft. I am not sure if that means we have first rights to re-drafting Freeman, or another team can draft him in the open draft or rookie draft before we do.

I would not be surprised if we did receive a PP and a high pick for Schache, we look to trade for a first round pick next year.

2017 Out Of Contract Players:
Tom Rockliff
Nicholas Robertson
Michael Close
Daniel McStay
Claye Beams
Jonathan Freeman
Ryan Harwood
Jarrad Jensen
Josh Schache
Ben Keays
Josh Clayton
Cian Hanley (R)
Matthew Hammelmann (R)
Reuben William (R)
Matt Eagles (R)
Blake Grewar (R)
Jake Barrett (R)
Mitchell Hinge (R)
Oscar McInerney (R)

I did say re rookies. Personally I think Barrett should be upgraded. Mcinerny & hammelman a chance but doubt the rest will be.

Might only be 5 cut from the main list - that's not enough spots for mine if we are transitioning a list.

I'm a bit against trading for another future 1st round again. At some point we need to get these kids into the team & stop delaying development for an extra year.
Next year id almost be in favour of trading 2019 first round for a 2018 first round & get another gun in soon...but that's a long way off

If Fagan really has drawn a line through someone off contract next year in not against paying out one early.

We might gets bit lucky, it's an old article but does forecast rookie list change for 2018

http://m.afl.com.au/news/2016-07-29/rookie-list-set-to-remain-for-another-season

 

[briztoon]

I did say re rookies. Personally I think Barrett should be upgraded. Mcinerny & hammelman a chance but doubt the rest will be.

Might only be 5 cut from the main list - that's not enough spots for mine if we are transitioning a list.

I'm a bit against trading for another future 1st round again. At some point we need to get these kids into the team & stop delaying development for an extra year.
Next year id almost be in favour of trading 2019 first round for a 2018 first round & get another gun in soon...but that's a long way off

If Fagan really has drawn a line through someone off contract next year in not against paying out one early.

We might gets bit lucky, it's an old article but does forecast rookie list change for 2018

http://m.afl.com.au/news/2016-07-29/rookie-list-set-to-remain-for-another-season

I understand about wanting to get kids in to the team and get their development underway. But their just might not be the available list spots. Also we have to look at the depth of the draft and the talent tiers in this years draft, and project the depth of next years draft class.

I believe we are likely to see many more underage kids playing in this years TAC cup than we saw last year. This is as much a reflection on this years draft class, as much as what it says for next years group.

 

[cubansombrero]

Might only be 5 cut from the main list - that's not enough spots for mine if we are transitioning a list.

Looking at the list, you'd say Jansen, Clayton and C Beams are unlikely to be at the club next year. Rockliff and Schache might leave but it's basically a 1:1 swap in terms of list spaces as they leave and a draftee comes in. We need to upgrade Hammelmann as he's been on the rookie list for 3 years, and I assume we'd want to upgrade Barrett rather than relying on guys to get injured for him to get a game. That means we either need to get tough and trade out/delist Harwood, Close or Freeman just to be able to draft three top 25 picks (our round 1 and 2 plus Port's pick) and then hope to pick up some quality in the rookie draft. Things get even more tricky if we start looking at a 2:1 swap for Schache (two picks or a pick + a best 22 player) or we want to bring in some mature quality by picking up a DFA etc.

 

[M Malice]

Looking at the list, you'd say Jansen, Clayton and C Beams are unlikely to be at the club next year. Rockliff and Schache might leave but it's basically a 1:1 swap in terms of list spaces as they leave and a draftee comes in. We need to upgrade Hammelmann as he's been on the rookie list for 3 years, and I assume we'd want to upgrade Barrett rather than relying on guys to get injured for him to get a game. That means we either need to get tough and trade out/delist Harwood, Close or Freeman just to be able to draft three top 25 picks (our round 1 and 2 plus Port's pick) and then hope to pick up some quality in the rookie draft. Things get even more tricky if we start looking at a 2:1 swap for Schache (two picks or a pick + a best 22 player) or we want to bring in some mature quality by picking up a DFA etc.

Agree with those, Jansen, Clayton and C.Beams are gone, I would have said Eagles too but he has been really good the last few weeks in the NEAFL. Unless Harwood gets a regular spot in the firsts for the bulk of the rest of the year he is gone too IMO.

Of the others listed as OOC above (post 695) those under pressure would be Freeman, Grewar and Hanley. I would also not be against trading Stefan Martin out if possible. You can also count the possible departure of Schache opening up a spot.

I think we will quite easily be able to de list 5 off the primary list and 2 off the rookie list.

 

[cubansombrero]

Of the others listed as OOC above (post 695) those under pressure would be Freeman, Grewar and Hanley.

Agree on Grewar and Hanley, but I didn't count them as they're rookies (so don't really impact our drafting ability anyway). I wouldn't mind trading Freeman to a club like Richmond or Collingwood who are desperate for forward depth for a 2018 pick, given that it's meant to be a pretty deep draft next year.