Analysis 2017 List Management Discussion Part II

[1981]

So our highest pick going into the draft would be 28? Well depending on other deals though

Rubbish draft remember

 

[BringBackSimmo]

Rubbish draft remember

Yeah i know, but isn't the top 10 is still decent?

 

[1981]

If this is the general feel of Carlton supporters then Gibbs will be staying. Which will be fine by me as I still think contracts mean something and he had his chance to come home a few years ago. Adelaide won't give up more than their first and second. Certainly not what they get from Lever.

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But you don't know that for sure do you? Neither do I mind you. But I'm surprised how you talk in absolutes.

 

[1981]

Yeah i know, but isn't the top 10 is still decent?

I don't know.

Someone the other day said nobody in top ten would be in last years top ten. But that could be crap.

TO be honest I think it's a very poor draft. Hardly any of the kids present as elite to my eye.

It's the type of draft to trade away picks.

 

[BringBackSimmo]

I don't know.

Someone the other day said nobody in top ten would be in last years top ten. But that could be crap.

TO be honest I think it's a very poor draft. Hardly any of the kids present as elite to my eye.

It's the type of draft to trade away picks.

Well i wouldn't have a clue tbh, but if that's the case trade away those picks... and draft as few as we can

 

[Pafloyul]

But you don't know that for sure do you? Neither do I mind you. But I'm surprised how you talk in absolutes.

Yeah, must be one of those nasty Sith I keep hearing about.

 

[My name geoff]

Pick 3 > st.kilda pick 7,8
Gibbs > crows lever pick (maybe 9)

Pick 7 > Stringer
Pick 8 > Scully
Pick 9 > Kennedy

Out: Gibbs, Pick 3
In: Stringer, Scully, Kennedy

Plowman Jones Weitering
Docherty Marchbank Byrne
Scully Cripps Cuningham
Pickett Casboult Curnow
SPS McKay stringer

Kruezer Murphy Kennedy

 

[HARKER]

There will be fallout if/when Kelly signs with GWS.
We're clearly in the best position to be able to make the most of it, as GWS have the history with us and don't see us as an immediate threat.

Someone like Scully only really works for us if we get him cheap (relatively cheap) as part of a bigger deal.
Remember what Trigg said: We want to be active in the draft whilst still attracting quality young players to the club. That's the template.

 

[Jimmae]

Pick 3 > st.kilda pick 7,8
Gibbs > crows lever pick (maybe 9)

Pick 7 > Stringer
Pick 8 > Scully
Pick 9 > Kennedy

Out: Gibbs, Pick 3
In: Stringer, Scully, Kennedy

Plowman Jones Weitering
Docherty Marchbank Byrne
Scully Cripps Cuningham
Pickett Casboult Curnow
SPS McKay stringer

Kruezer Murphy Kennedy

 

[inyourcool]

This is true. Hopefully something can be worked out behind the scenes.

Not if the crows approach it the way roo confirmed on 5aa last year "we just expected Carlton to roll over..."

IMO you don't need him. The Crouch bros have more than filled the midfield void leading into this year. what do you have to gain?

 

[Soapy V]

Pick 7 > Stringer
Pick 8 > Scully
Pick 9 > Kennedy

IMO that is massively over paying

 

[Soapy V]

Remember what Trigg said: We want to be active in the draft whilst still attracting quality young players to the club. That's the template.

Seems to fall on deaf ears on here even though it has been said numerous times

 

[My name geoff]

View attachment 413831

Just to make clear why I would happily trade picks for players who don't look like clear wins for us..

We need players who are ready to perform. Going to the draft is nice but continuously going to the draft will result in an endless rebuild.

We have young talent. Awesome young talent. If we got some 'birds in hand' we will enable our young talent to flourish.

Players like Stringer and Scully are both proven performers, able to play premiership footy next year and the year after and the year after.

Getting Kennedy, Scully, and Stringer gives us a net gain. A two for three deal which sees us trade a player turning 30 in 2019 and an 19 year old for 3 players who will all be in their peak years aged between 22-28 in 2019.

Not saying it's the best value, but it's awesome value for what we need.

 

[F_therest]

Pick 3 > st.kilda pick 7,8
Gibbs > crows lever pick (maybe 9)

Pick 7 > Stringer
Pick 8 > Scully
Pick 9 > Kennedy

Out: Gibbs, Pick 3
In: Stringer, Scully, Kennedy

Plowman Jones Weitering
Docherty Marchbank Byrne
Scully Cripps Cuningham
Pickett Casboult Curnow
SPS McKay stringer

Kruezer Murphy Kennedy

Very unrealistic.

St Kilda would not trade pick 7 and 8 for pick 3 alone...we would need to throw in a sweetener.
Crows unlikely to give up a top 10 pick for Gibbs given their stance last year.
Scully is not worth pick 8...more like a late 1st/early 2nd.
Kennedy is not even close to being worth pick 9...that's higher than when he was drafted. More like an early-mid 2nd.

 

[Soapy V]

Just to make clear why I would happily trade picks for players who don't look like clear wins for us..

We need players who are ready to perform. Going to the draft is nice but continuously going to the draft will result in an endless rebuild.

We have young talent. Awesome young talent. If we got some 'birds in hand' we will enable our young talent to flourish.

Players like Stringer and Scully are both proven performers, able to play premiership footy next year and the year after and the year after.

Getting Kennedy, Scully, and Stringer gives us a net gain. A two for three deal which sees us trade a player turning 30 in 2019 and an 19 year old for 3 players who will all be in their peak years aged between 22-28 in 2019.

Not saying it's the best value, but it's awesome value for what we need.

NO. It's a 66 game rebuild that hasn't finished

NO. Plus they take the spots of developing kids. Culturally Stringer must be a question mark as well.

NO. Definitely not a net gain over picks 7, 8 & 9. Kennedy will probably cost about a second round pick at most. Scully is contracted and won't happen and Stringer has major question marks.

NO. Shocking value IMO. Sounds like a Wayne Hughes/Shane Rogers deal

 

[My name geoff]

NO. It's a 66 game rebuild that hasn't finished

NO. Plus they take the spots of developing kids. Culturally Stringer must be a question mark as well.

NO. Definitely not a net gain over picks 7, 8 & 9. Kennedy will probably cost about a second round pick at most. Scully is contracted and won't happen and Stringer has major question marks.

NO. Shocking value IMO. Sounds like a Wayne Hughes/Shane Rogers deal

Stringer is worthy of pick 3
Scully + Kennedy are more valuable to us than Gibbs.

 

[Soapy V]

Stringer is worthy of pick 3
Scully + Kennedy are more valuable to us than Gibbs.

Not IMO

No way any club would give Pick 3 for Stringer at the moment. At best 10-20 and it would have to be after some serious research and discussions.
Kennedy we will get for a second round or later & Scully won't happen and even then it is not in our recruiting plans to trade for a 26-27 year old player

Sorry but makes absolutely no sense to me. We are still in the middle of a rebuild. Patience!

 

[1981]

Um NO to Stringer.

 

[My name geoff]

Not IMO

No way any club would give Pick 3 for Stringer at the moment. At best 10-20 and it would have to be after some serious research and discussions.
Kennedy we will get for a second round or later & Scully won't happen and even then it is not in our recruiting plans to trade for a 26-27 year old player

Sorry but makes absolutely no sense to me. We are still in the middle of a rebuild. Patience!

Pick 3 will have to be a hell of a player in his first 5 years to match what Stringer has achieved. To us Stringer is worthy of pick 3, if pick 3 is kicking 60 goals in seasons, winning all-Australian, Premierships by the time he's Ciaran Byrnes age, we will be laughing.

I will say it now. Pick 3 in this years draft won't be as good as Stringer until at least the year 2022, if ever. During that time, under Bolton, Stringer could kick 300 goals, claim two All-Australians and be in the top 20 players in the comp and still not be at his peak.

 

[Jimmae]

Pick 3 will have to be a hell of a player in his first 5 years to match what Stringer has achieved. To us Stringer is worthy of pick 3, if pick 3 is kicking 60 goals in seasons, winning all-Australian, Premierships by the time he's Ciaran Byrnes age, we will be laughing.

I will say it now. Pick 3 in this years draft won't be as good as Stringer until at least the year 2022, if ever. During that time, under Bolton, Stringer could kick 300 goals, claim two All-Australians and be in the top 20 players in the comp and still not be at his peak.

What you seem to be missing is that Stringer needs to return to that level to be worthy of that value.

You shouldn't be paying for what someone could be worth or was worth; you pay for what they are currently worth and what they could reasonable be expected to do in the future.

 

[My name geoff]

What you seem to be missing is that Stringer needs to return to that level to be worthy of that value.

You shouldn't be paying for what someone could be worth or was worth; you pay for what they are currently worth and what they could reasonable be expected to do in the future.

At 23 I'm sure he can come out of his form slump within the next 8 years.

 

[Soapy V]

Pick 3 will have to be a hell of a player in his first 5 years to match what Stringer has achieved. To us Stringer is worthy of pick 3, if pick 3 is kicking 60 goals in seasons, winning all-Australian, Premierships by the time he's Ciaran Byrnes age, we will be laughing.

I will say it now. Pick 3 in this years draft won't be as good as Stringer until at least the year 2022, if ever. During that time, under Bolton, Stringer could kick 300 goals, claim two All-Australians and be in the top 20 players in the comp and still not be at his peak.

Massive call. I would be amazed if any club would give a Top 5 pick for Stringer at the moment. The other major factor is attitude. Apparently lazy and lacks real committment. Given what SOS and Bolts are building and what their criteria is I just don't see it

 

[My name geoff]

Massive call. I would be amazed if any club would give a Top 5 pick for Stringer at the moment. The otehr major factor is attitude. Apparently lazy and lacks real committment. Given what SOS and Bolts are building and what their criteria is I just don't see it

I'm basing my views on Stringer off the proviso that SOS and Bolton believe they can get the best out of him

 

[Soapy V]

I'm basing my views on Stringer off the proviso that SOS and Bolton believe they can get the best out of him

or they completely change their minds on what their criteria is

 

[thylacine60]

great point