Analysis 2017 List Management Discussion Part II

[1shay]

Also, there is some players you just want to have around your club.

Rowie is one of them. Might mot be the most gifted footballer, but gives the impression that he has pretty good values and is a good leader for the young boys.

I doubt he is on hollwood dollars, so for me is worth holding on to until he calls time.

 

[HARKER]

Do we quickly forget that Rowe is still only 29 and was easily best 22 before doing his knee?

He's 30 at years end and unlikely to see much action in his 31st. year.

No problem if he stays but would understand if he doesn't

 

[TheHeatleyStand]

Actually I think the defense functions better now that the big Rowe isn't in the side
Might be a nice role for him off field. He seems like a special character but knee injury or not I think he would have been struggling to play atm

 

[HARKER]

Actually I think the defense functions better now that the big Rowe isn't in the side
Might be a nice role for him off field. He seems like a special character but knee injury or not I think he would have been struggling to play atm

Re-re-inventing him into a forward because Casboult may/will go?

Is that a step in the right direction for 2019? I don't think so.

 

[Azul]

Do we quickly forget that Rowe is still only 29 and was easily best 22 before doing his knee?

No but with Liam and Alex plus Lachie, Jacob and Caleb it'll be a hard task breaking back in. And that MacReadie kid looks all right.

 

[Soapy V]

No but with Liam and Alex plus Lachie, Jacob and Caleb it'll be a hard task breaking back in. And that MacReadie kid looks all right.

Like I said he can fill numerous roles and is a handy list player whilst the kids develop. Most importantly the club has said they look forward to him being back playing in Navy Blue in early 2018

 

[Iamcarlton]

Listening to Trigg and the expected List changes at years end I can see us going backwards in terms of wins next year.

By the start of next season we will have a probable best 22 with

Silvagni SPS Cuningham Fisher Williamson Marchbank Charlie Byrne Sheehan Pickett Sumner (maybe Hopper) with around 20 games or less
Polson McKay Kerr LeBois Macreadie will have less than 5-10 games under them
We will then add another 5-6 kids that will be yet to debut and maybe some other young talent from other clubs with less than 20 games. These kids will need to play to get experience and learn what is expected and then start to influence games.

On top of this Murphy Gibbs Kruezer Simpson Docherty Cripps are in career best form and if we lost one or two to injury it would really make a difference.

I love what the club is doing in nearly every regard but the reality is I believe we will step back before moving forward.

Think i heard the going to be going backwards in wins call this time last year . Excuses are running out cant keep playing the youth card imo .

 

[DangerousD]

You stated his value as being 7 and 7, the second pick was a floating pick, could of been anything. I was saying Collingwood assumed they would finish higher, if they had of known it was going to be 7 n 7 they would of asked for something a bit sweeter than a late 20s pick

Possibly, the fact the Pies stuffed the pick is what hurt. If we paid 7 and 7 for Kelly and got fisher as the player at 28 I'd be happy.

 

[Soapy V]

Think i heard the going to be going backwards in wins call this time last year . Excuses are running out cant keep playing the youth card imo .

Not an excuse. I think it's just logic.

We are only 18 months into a full list rebuild. At the end of the year we will bring in more kids that will need time and games. The kids we have still will only average less than 20 games each. Next year our list could easily be younger than this year. Clubs that have rebuilt like St Kilda Melbourne or the Bulldogs have taken a minimum 3-4 years before they start moving back up the ladder.

Not a negative or a critcism it's just the way the system works and nothing more than is to be expected. This year we will be bottom three and I expect next year to be the same. During that time Murphy Gibbs Simpson & Kruezer will be into their 30's and it would be hard to expect them having the influence on games they currently are. There will be a transition period. It's not until 2019 or most probably 2020 that I expect our kids to really start influencing games and making us a genuine finals contender. As the club has consistently stated this is about building long term success and there will be no quick fix

 

[DangerousD]

Negative? I see it as a realistic positive. All part of rebuilding and shows we have brought in the right kids to take us forward. Reality is these kids will need games and time to step up but when they do I believe we will have the talent to threaten for the flag for many years to come

Yes, thinking that a team that improved in 2016 and have improved in 2017 will go backwards in 2018 before knowing who's in and out, in my opinion is negative.

If we lose Gibbs and Cas and have injuries then yes it can happen. But if not then there should be continual improvement even before factoring in any additions.

 

[Juddrockz]

Also, there is some players you just want to have around your club.

Rowie is one of them. Might mot be the most gifted footballer, but gives the impression that he has pretty good values and is a good leader for the young boys.

I doubt he is on hollwood dollars, so for me is worth holding on to until he calls time.

If Casboult leaves,i'd expect Rowey to be kept and put in the forward line and used as back up ruck when needed. Phillips is starting to get a few injuries and our ruck stock is thin.

 

[Iamcarlton]

Not an excuse. I think it's just logic.

We are only 18 months into a full list rebuild. At the end of the year we will bring in more kids that will need time and games. The kids we have still will only average less than 20 games each. Next year our list could easily be younger than this year. Clubs that have rebuilt like St Kilda Melbourne or the Bulldogs have taken a minimum 3-4 years before they start moving back up the ladder.

Not a negative or a critcism it's just the way the system works and nothing more than is to be expected. This year we will be bottom three and I expect next year to be the same. During that time Murphy Gibbs Simpson & Kruezer will be into their 30's and it would be hard to expect them having the influence on games they currently are. There will be a transition period. It's not until 2019 or most probably 2020 that I expect our kids to really start influencing games and making us a genuine finals contender. As the club has consistently stated this is about building long term success and there will be no quick fix

Externally i agree internally no but a lot will depend on what happens at the trade table regarding Gibbs and Casboult . Cannot afford to lose both but do expect to lose one of those two . If Gibbs stayed and we happened to nab Kelly and Hopper together with the enormous upside and improvement of our younger players finals will be firmly in boltons mind .
However if we lose both Casboult and Gibbs you may be right .

 

[TheHeatleyStand]

Re-re-inventing him into a forward because Casboult may/will go?

Is that a step in the right direction for 2019? I don't think so.

Forwards need to make the play. He's playing in the backline because he couldn't make the play in the forward line
Extracted heaps out of himself while we were a bottom club
Need to start looking forwards mister Harker.
No point in keeping a limited footballer on the books just because we think he's a nice guy.
Easily can find him a role off field that would impact the squad and results more

 

[ferrisb]

Do we quickly forget that Rowe is still only 29 and was easily best 22 before doing his knee?

I haven't forgotten, Harry.

But that was before the Liam Jones reinvention.

The world will never be the same again...

 

[Soapy V]

However if we lose both Casboult and Gibbs you may be right .

Not even in my thinking. I'm just going on the clubs direction and comments that they will only bring in young talent at the end of the year. At the moment we currently have around 18 kids with less than 20 games. At the end of the season we could easily add another 6-8 more draftees oyr players under 20 years old. It is a full List rebuild and I fully support the direction but I'm just saying it takes time

JMO and only time will tell

 

[HARKER]

Forwards need to make the play. He's playing in the backline because he couldn't make the play in the forward line
Extracted heaps out of himself while we were a bottom club
Need to start looking forwards mister Harker.
No point in keeping a limited footballer on the books just because we think he's a nice guy.
Easily can find him a role off field that would impact the squad and results more

Pretty much, as would be the case for any player nearing the end.
Rowe won't be back fit and firing to take over from Jones or ASilvagni, come round one next year.

I don't think the CFC have to come down hard on Rowe, because he'll likely see what's in front of him.
We can't open up a role for every ex-player, but can see Rowe hanging around.....and if there is a role for White also, then all good.....but let's not manufacture one, just because.....they have to earn it.

 

[HARKER]

I haven't forgotten, Harry.
But that was before the Liam Jones reinvention.
The world will never be the same again...

The world will need a re-set. No one was ready for Jones................not even Jones himself.

Keep saying this but when Liam starts taking those monster marks he was in the VFL..................just watch.

 

[Iamcarlton]

Not even in my thinking. I'm just going on the clubs direction and comments that they will only bring in young talent at the end of the year. At the moment we currently have around 18 kids with less than 20 games. At the end of the season we could easily add another 6-8 more draftees oyr players under 20 years old. It is a full List rebuild and I fully support the direction but I'm just saying it takes time

Doubt there will be many of next years draftees playing senior football next year maybe our first pick if we have a first rounder and thats it imo .
Football department - CEO speak is to appease supporters sponsors and potential boardroom challengers . Internally is a different story i believe .

 

[Wickzki]

Would be terribly disappointed to see Sam delisted.

If he makes the decision himself, however, then all of the power to him. But shouldn't be pushed.

Re-re-inventing him into a forward because Casboult may/will go?

I think that's a tad overstated, Harks. We already know what he's capable of playing forward and that wont have changed much if at all.

My big thing against him playing forward is that the days of the limited mobility power forwards seems to be disappearing fast. He doesn't have the agility required down there for the modern game now let alone when he returns from injury.

Good hand for our VFL side if he doesn't retire on his own merits.

 

[Soapy V]

Doubt there will be many of next years draftees playing senior football next year maybe our first pick if we have a first rounder and thats it imo .
Football department - CEO speak is to appease supporters sponsors and potential boardroom challengers . Internally is a different story i believe .

I don't believe that. I reckon the club are doing exactly what they been saying all along. It's been a consistent message from Trigg Bolton & SOS. A 3 year rebuild focusing on youth that will take time with no quick fix looking for long term success.

As for draftess playing the following year Williamson Fisher SPS Macreadie Polson have all played in this year. Last year Silvagni Charlie Cuningham Weitering all played in their first year. Bolton will play them if they put in the effort

 

[HARKER]

I think that's a tad overstated, Harks. We already know what he's capable of playing forward and that wont have changed much if at all.

My big thing against him playing forward is that the days of the limited mobility power forwards seems to be disappearing fast. He doesn't have the agility required down there for the modern game now let alone when he returns from injury.

Good hand for our VFL side if he doesn't retire on his own merits.

A failed forward. Sam wouldn't have gone into the backline should have he been a forward success.

I'll leave it at that, but putting the numbers together, as was the case with Walker & Jamison, I feel Rowe will give it away and all in good will.

 

[BrisbaneCFC]

Do we quickly forget that Rowe is still only 29 and was easily best 22 before doing his knee?

Dont you know Soapy, we don't need Rowe now, Liam Jones has surpassed him and is now the best defender we have.

 

[Soapy V]

I haven't forgotten, Harry.

But that was before the Liam Jones reinvention.

The world will never be the same again...

ASOS has been impressive as well. Nice to have depth and options.

 

[Wickzki]

A failed forward. Sam wouldn't have gone into the backline should have he been a forward success.

I'll leave it at that, but putting the numbers together, as was the case with Walker & Jamison, I feel Rowe will give it away and all in good will.

I don't disagree. But the decision needs to be his own and he shouldn't be pushed.

 

[HARKER]

I don't disagree. But the decision needs to be his own and he shouldn't be pushed.

Never punished. That's not the way to treat those that have put all they have to the club.

Rewarded......and rewarded in a caring and considered fashion. Wouldn't want it any other way.