Analysis 2017 List Management Discussion

[FairKouta]

Better than Cripps, Weitering, SPS, Hopper and Shiel?

Would be amazed.

Sheil and Hopper are not even on our list yet.
But i get your point. Let us just say he will be starting 22

 

[Smegger]

And isn't nice to have this option.

For so long players have got away with half arsed efforts because there wasn't a better option in the VFL.

Those days are gone now!

Sure is Funk. We do have promising options but it's still a long way to go before we build tested and reliable depth. Perfectly understandable in a rebuild and looking forward when that time will come. Good sign last week when Weitering went off, the team kept it together. Last year it was a massive hole when he was out. Different position i know, but just goes to show the talent coming in.

 

[BluesRule]

Taken from AFL.com.au

Carlton's out of contract players come seasons end. If anyone was under any doubts that we wouldn't have another big clean out then this list may change your mind.

Dennis Armfield (free agent) - Probably retires
Blaine Boekhorst - Up to BB to prove he deserves a spot.
Dylan Buckley - Up to Dylan as he is quick, determined and smart. Needs to improve disposal to become a real asset.
Levi Casboult (free agent) - Has improved each year and is a solid mark and ruck relief. Given our ruck depth he is needed. Keep unless a good FA offer emerges that nets us a top 25 pick.
Charlie Curnow - Will get a new contract.
Ed Curnow - Will get a new contract.
Kristian Jaksch - Last chance season. Time to shine.
Liam Jones - likely delisting.
Matthew Kreuzer (free agent) - Must keep for me, unless he is offered an over the top $ deal that nets us a first round FA (top 5) pick. Key member of the team and just hitting his prime. Will give us 100 good games. No obvious replacement.
Jed Lamb - injured but has been good depth so far. Keep unless an upgrade is available.
Harry McKay - Will get a new contract, but would like to see him play AFL soon.
Andrew Phillips - Will get a new contract.
Sam Rowe - Will get a new contract. Playing the best footy of his career.
Kade Simpson (free agent) - hope he shows enough to stay on . 400 Gamer?
Dale Thomas (option for 2018) - he will probably retire in frustration with his body?
Simon White (free agent) - keep for depth. Love his attitude and his skills are improving.
Matthew Wright - Will get a new contract.

Of those only 7 look likely outs to me, but depends on compensation and how the year goes, refer above. Also Sheehan needs to get on the park, Gallucci has shown something but needs to make it to AFL, Gowers?, Gorringe?, Smedts?, Graham? Palmer?

 

[Smegger]

Of those only 7 look likely outs to me, but depends on compensation and how the year goes, refer above. Also Sheehan needs to get on the park, Gallucci has shown something but needs to make it to AFL, Gowers?, Gorringe?, Smedts?, Graham? Palmer?

That list from AFL.com had a "Notable Out-of-Contract Blues" heading. Wonder why they didn't just do all?

 

[Soapy V]

Of those only 7 look likely outs to me, but depends on compensation and how the year goes, refer above. Also Sheehan needs to get on the park, Gallucci has shown something but needs to make it to AFL, Gowers?, Gorringe?, Smedts?, Graham? Palmer?

?

 

[Malifice]

The proof will be in this year's draft when we have only one pick in the top 40 and still another 10 players to turn over.

From the sounds of it will looks like will be looking to trade our future first for Hopper and Smith from GWS.

Trading Gibbs gives us an extra first round pick and upgrades our 3rd to a 2nd.

Kruezer leaving as F/A gives us an end of first round draft pick.

That leaves us with picks at around 3, 16, 19, 34, 57, 75, a rookie or two, plus Hopper and Smith.

We lose Gibbs and Kruezer, and delist eight.

 

[Aphrodite]

Taken from AFL.com.au

Carlton's out of contract players come seasons end. If anyone was under any doubts that we wouldn't have another big clean out then this list may change your mind.

Dennis Armfield (free agent)
Blaine Boekhorst
Dylan Buckley
Levi Casboult (free agent)
Charlie Curnow
Ed Curnow
Kristian Jaksch
Liam Jones
Matthew Kreuzer (free agent)
Jed Lamb
Harry McKay
Andrew Phillips
Sam Rowe
Kade Simpson (free agent)
Liam Sumner
Dale Thomas (option for 2018)
Simon White (free agent)
Matthew Wright

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-04-13/time-to-send-an-sos-27-blues-remain-in-limbo


Also to note:-

Over the past 4 season we have made 51 list changes, those most of any Club.

Up to 17 unsigned Blues are yet to play a senior game in 2017, including Dylan Buckley, Liam Jones, Blaine Boekhorst, Kristian Jaksch, Liam Sumner and Nick Graham. Ciaran Byrne (knee), Andrew Phillips (foot) and Jed Lamb (knee) are in the same boat, but all have been returning from injury.

Since Stephen Silvagni took over as list manager in 2015, Carlton has added 27 new players to its list – 15 in 2015 and 12 last season.

 

[Smegger]

?

Didn't he play rnd. 24 last year?

 

[Malifice]

We then go into 2018 without a first round draft pick, but with Ben Silvagni available as a father son, and a massive warchest for free agents.

In 2018 and 2019 we should be targeting free agents heavily.

 

[1981]

From the sounds of it will looks like will be looking to trade our future first for Hopper and Smith from GWS.

Trading Gibbs gives us an extra first round pick and upgrades our 3rd to a 2nd.

Kruezer leaving as F/A gives us an end of first round draft pick.

That leaves us with picks at around 3, 16, 19, 34, 57, 75, a rookie or two, plus Hopper and Smith.

We lose Gibbs and Kruezer, and delist eight.

Be very interesting to see what happens with Bryce at end of year. Will he still want out? Will he ask to go? Will will dig heels in again? Will the pick offer be better than last year? Or will he decide he's happy here now and want to be a one club man? One thing I'll say about him is he has proven to be a durable player, he could play for another five years IMO. Part of me wants to retain Murphy, Gibbs and Kreuzer LT. We need experience and maybe they're the guys. But with same token I can see how we could potentially get decent picks back if BG and MK leave. But at what risk to culture? Hawks have fallen in a hole with SM and JL gone, can't be a coincidence surely. At the end of the day BG and MK are in our top 5 players right now.

 

[ParapMarkets]

From the sounds of it will looks like will be looking to trade our future first for Hopper and Smith from GWS.

Trading Gibbs gives us an extra first round pick and upgrades our 3rd to a 2nd.

Kruezer leaving as F/A gives us an end of first round draft pick.

That leaves us with picks at around 3, 16, 19, 34, 57, 75, a rookie or two, plus Hopper and Smith.

We lose Gibbs and Kruezer, and delist eight.

That's the first I've heard about Smith on our radar. Where did you hear about that?

 

[1981]

Get the distinct impression Bucks and Boek are being frozen out and might be up for trade though don't think we'd get a thing for the latter and maybe only a late pick for the former. Graham too but he won't get us a thing.

 

[1981]

That's the first I've heard about Smith on our radar. Where did you hear about that?

Ed Zachary!

 

[Blue Doormat]

This year we must trade Gibbs, Casboult and perhapsKreuzer.
We need to get a first round for Gibbs. This year you'd take a third round as well. We need a second round for Casboult.
Ideally we have our first round, Adelaide's first round, somebody's second round, Adelaide's third round and our own third round. I'm guessing Kreuzer would get us a second round.
We must keep our pick in the first round. I'd love Hopper plus a pick for Adelaide's first.
We need to then recruit a ruck to replace Kreuzer. Longer?

Can you please explain the logic for letting Kruez go for a second rounder and then recruiting (trading for) Longer? I'd think it would be either net equal or even net loss (given we would be letting a club stalwart go). Surely Longer would not be let come to us for less than a second rounder.
And do you propose that we get Fyfe as a FA? Because if so then we get nothing for Kruez (ala Eddie/Daisy)
If the big American is a bust and we're not using harry mac as a ruck then we are left with Phillips (Gorringe isn't a ruck).
Just asking because it seems some people are advocating for change for what seems changes sake. We need to get something we need and don't have out of a trade scenario don't we?

 

[Blue Doormat]

We then go into 2018 without a first round draft pick, but with Ben Silvagni available as a father son, and a massive warchest for free agents.

In 2018 and 2019 we should be targeting free agents heavily.

So no free agents this year in that scenario? That makes some sense. So we benefit from losing Kruez as FA (I hope we are still considering keeping him - hope his papers aren't stamped)

 

[Coona Blues]

At what point do we worry about SOS's licking for goal? He is 2:6 at the moment and without knowing the stats he was not that great last season from his limited shots. His technique looks solid to an untrained eye so is it a confidence thing, is he trying shots outside his skill level?

I agree with your questioning young SOS. The young fella has a great technique, but has (to date) a minor issue missing what a "go to" forward
should kick. Certainly not something to dismiss, is a trying too hard type of thing which could correct very quickly, but is less than
reliable at the moment. Even Weitering missed a "should kick" shot on Sunday, it is amazing how these kids put so much pressure
on themselves. Certainly not technique issue.

 

[Malifice]

At the end of the day BG and MK are in our top 5 players right now.

I wholeheartedly agree.

My view is they wont to be in our top five players from 2020 onwards when it matters.

Trading Gibbs and letting Matty go as a free agent nets us an extra first round draft pick and an end of first round draft pick, plus a later pick upgrade, Adelaide's second round pick next year or an extra third rounder this year.

Assuming Adelaide finished third, and we get band two for Kruezer, thats pick 16 and 19 and Adelaide's 2018 second rounder for points to pay for Ben Silvagni next year.

Factoring in one hit and one miss between picks 16 and 19, that nets us one more gun young player in the side when the window opens.

 

[Malifice]

So no free agents this year in that scenario? That makes some sense. So we benefit from losing Kruez as FA (I hope we are still considering keeping him - hope his papers aren't stamped)

We use our money this year to get Hopper and Smith to agree to nominate us. We trade next year's 1st for them.

Lose Gibbs to Adelaide for 1st this year and 2nd next year. Lose Kruezer for band 2.

Take picks 3, 19, 39, 57, 75 to the draft and pick up 2 rookies and PSD for a player. Add Hopper and Smith.

After accounting for Gibbs and Kruezer we can delist 8 more.

Next year we have no 1sts but have a massive war chest for FA plus an extra second to pay for Ben Silvagni.

 

[Smegger]

Any interest for Jarrod Brander?

 

[Salt Lake Cities]

I don't particularly want to trade Kreuze as he's the heart and soul type we still need, certainly see merit in it though.

Question then becomes who do we get to replace him? No use making a sideways move, any ideas for some gold out there with a later pick? A Nankervis type? (Pick 46)

 

[Malifice]

I don't particularly want to trade Kreuze as he's the heart and soul type we still need, certainly see merit in it though.

Question then becomes who do we get to replace him? No use making a sideways move, any ideas for some gold out there with a later pick? A Nankervis type? (Pick 46)

Phillips looks serviceable at least for a few years. Presuming his body holds up.

We get another ruck in as a rookie and target one as a FA as a last resort.

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

We use our money this year to get Hopper and Smith to agree to nominate us. We trade next year's 1st for them.

Lose Gibbs to Adelaide for 1st this year and 2nd next year. Lose Kruezer for band 2.

Take picks 3, 19, 39, 57, 75 to the draft and pick up 2 rookies and PSD for a player. Add Hopper and Smith.

After accounting for Gibbs and Kruezer we can delist 8 more.

Next year we have no 1sts but have a massive war chest for FA plus an extra second to pay for Ben Silvagni.

We would also have Adelaide's first in this years draft but you are dreaming if you think GWS do that trade

 

[Smegger]

I don't particularly want to trade Kreuze as he's the heart and soul type we still need, certainly see merit in it though.

Question then becomes who do we get to replace him? No use making a sideways move, any ideas for some gold out there with a later pick? A Nankervis type? (Pick 46)

Not sure what North will do with Goldstein's future and Preuss looks great. Would we look at Majak?

 

[Salt Lake Cities]

Phillips looks serviceable at least for a few years. Presuming his body holds up.

We get another ruck in as a rookie and target one as a FA as a last resort.

Oh I like Phillips, don't get me wrong. Hasn't proven to be very durable as yet though so I'd want one more plus a rookie project type.

 

[Salt Lake Cities]

Not sure what North will do with Goldstein's future and Preuss looks great. Would we look at Majak?

They have a lot of money tied up in Goldy, tough spot they're in as Preuss looks more than handy. Majak could be an option with a later pick I spose.