Analysis 2017 Non-Crows Discussion Thread - Part V for Vendetta

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subaru

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pretty disingenuous to pretend there are no clear and important differences between Sloane being knocked off balance by a regulation tackle around the hips and falling badly, and either driving your shoulder into someone else's face or their head into the ground.
What's disingenuous is you making an all encompassing statement and then not having the plums to admit you were wrong.

As I posted earlier ... the fines should still apply to all games, but the penalty for accumulating fines should only be served in regular season games. So you get fined for a third strike, you miss round 1 next year, 2 fines miss two games next year etc...

The change that is needed for finals is something like this:

View attachment 420830

Just add a column for finals, get rid of the early plea stuff for post-season games because everyone will take that in a finals series ... and make anything that would be 2 matches or worse in the regular season go straight to the Tribunal.

The Tribunal can then hear all the excuses and the physics debates etc... and make a decision based on what the outcome produces and what the player would miss as a result.
Agree.


Are you deliberately missing the point?

The "rule", such as it is, is that if you elect to bump a player and they get concussed, you have a case to answer. It almost always results in a suspension, occasionally a fine.

Neither occurred in this case. Why do you think that is? It's because the next match is "worth more" in the eyes of the AFL. So they orchestrated a result which is different from the one they have arrived it time and time again.

If it was Sloane in the identical situation, with two fines and a concussed opponent, and he got suspended, of course I'd be upset. But it would be consistent with the decisions that have been made over the last few years. The Cotchin decision was not.
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-09-24/five-questions-for-the-mrp-on-cotchin-clash


Maybe all the laughing at Port over the last few weeks has taking its toll on Subi, - quite understandable as its been ******* hilarious.
Well, now I know how Sanders feels ...put it that way !
:)
 

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Roovolution

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The realisation must be sinking in that this is the end of the road for a while a far as grand finals are concerned for Geelong. Too much reliance on Dangerwood, speculative trades (e.g. Stanley), underperforming senior players (Hawkins, Motlop etc) and veterans on their last legs. Cupboard bare as far as draft picks are concerned so no trade currency. Ablett (if he gets there) and Devon Smith won't go anywhere close to righting the sinking ship.
Ablett will get there, the AFL will ensure it happens (good for footy lol).
 

Crowked

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Geelong needed to begin the rebuild 2-3 years ago. They spent all the rebuild currency bringing in established players to top up, and now have a bigger rebuild to do. With virtually nothing to draft with already, bringing in Ablett would be a waste of time, effort and the little they have to work with.

I think Geelong won't be genuinely challenging again for a long time. Hope Danger enjoys the Brownlow and Moggs, because winning a flag in his career seems very unlikely now.
 

Kristof

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Of course not
But this wasn't about that is it?

I haven't see anyone claim it was deliberate - careless - perhaps, although Cotchin was going for the ball.

And I'll ask again - a question none of you are keen to answer

If this was a Crows player and the GF - would you feel the same?

I be betting this board would be in full melt mode !
So, are you arguing that it wasn't a bump that caused a concussion?

Or are you arguing that people have a bias towards their club?

If we had a player who had done two foolish acts through the year, I'd be sitting on the edge of my seat if they chose to bump a player while contesting for the ball.

I'd probably be shitty now if that was Sloane - partly at the system and partly at the player. About as shitty as I was last year when Sloane was suspended for contesting the ball with Ebert.
 

Mr_Moogle

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Geelong getting Ablett back doesn't bother me. What annoys me is he is a contracted player at GC and shouldn't be able to move back to the Cats cheaply and yet even with bugger all picks and players worth trading they will somehow get him anyway.
 
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Just to divert the conversation again - anyone else getting sick of the Geelong supporters that are claiming they had as good a year as us if not better because they were only second by %, and had less home games than we did?

We rested players where we needed to as we had the top 2 sewn up early.

During the regular season Geelong played:
  • 16 X VIC (4 EH, 5 MCG, 7 SS)
  • 2 X WA
  • 2 X QLD
  • 1 X NSW
  • 1 X SA
6 interstate trips - Poor darlings !!
Meh, let them have their salt. I'd say the better metric is playing in the GF, after having just handed the cats their ass in the prelim.
 

subaru

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So, are you arguing that it wasn't a bump that caused a concussion?

Or are you arguing that people have a bias towards their club?

If we had a player who had done two foolish acts through the year, I'd be sitting on the edge of my seat if they chose to bump a player while contesting for the ball.

I'd probably be shitty now if that was Sloane - partly at the system and partly at the player. About as shitty as I was last year when Sloane was suspended for contesting the ball with Ebert.
I was furious with that ! Ebert clearly got concussed prior to the Sloane spoil and just coz he bled like a stuck pig, that injury was what determined the penalty.
I don't agree with that.
Some players go down like a bag of shit - others get up and play on.
Shiel plays on - there's not even a question asked.
There is even doubt that it was the Cotchin bump that caused the concussion. See link above.
If Sloane got rubbed out for a similar thing in similar circumstances can you see everyone on this board going "well, thems the rules"?
There'd be more melts than you could poke a stick at.

It was a borderline decision whether he even GOT reported, let alone a penalty, and as my POV is the same as the MRP ..well....

Anyway
I really have to leave this alone now.
Anyone else wanting to have a crack at me, do it on the Bay.
 

DD#23

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What's disingenuous is you making an all encompassing statement and then not having the plums to admit you were wrong.
I knew Sloane was concussed and nobody was reported. Lets add a word for clarification shall we?

"every negligent action directly responsible for a concussion that causes a player to miss the rest of the game this year has resulted in a report."

pinning someone's arms and riding them face-first into the ground is negligent. Cannoning yourself into the head of an opponent who's in possession of the footy is negligent. A regulation tackle that's low and hard around the hips is not.
 

DD#23

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If Sloane got rubbed out for a similar thing in similar circumstances can you see everyone on this board going "well, thems the rules"?
There'd be more melts than you could poke a stick at.
how is our hypothetical collective reaction even remotely relevant to a discussion about whether or not the Cotchin decision is a consistent application of the rules by the MRP?
 
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Thread starter #2,211
Geelong getting Ablett back doesn't bother me. What annoys me is he is a contracted player at GC and shouldn't be able to move back to the Cats cheaply and yet even with bugger all picks and players worth trading they will somehow get him anyway.
Where do you sit on the idea to trade Gibbs back to Adelaide?
 

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DD#23

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The realisation must be sinking in that this is the end of the road for a while a far as grand finals are concerned for Geelong. Too much reliance on Dangerwood, speculative trades (e.g. Stanley), underperforming senior players (Hawkins, Motlop etc) and veterans on their last legs. Cupboard bare as far as draft picks are concerned so no trade currency. Ablett (if he gets there) and Devon Smith won't go anywhere close to righting the sinking ship.
its glorious ain't it?
 

Sanders

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And it would have only been a fine apart from his 2 previous incidents

Are you seriously saying he deserved to sit out a Grand Final for an incident that at worst was only going to attract a fine?
The game was in the balance until midway through the 3rd quarter

If Shiel wasn’t taken out illegally then their might not be a grand final to miss for cotchin

He took out arguably GWS’ best player, that could have changed the result
 

Mr_Moogle

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Where do you sit on the idea to trade Gibbs back to Adelaide?
Not really that interested in Gibbs. Would've liked to get him a couple of years ago but I don't think it's prudent to spend two first rounders on a 29 year old. If we could get him for a first and second it might not be so bad but I'm still lukewarm to that idea.

Tbh at the start of the year, getting another seasoned mid seemed like a good idea but we aren't as weak there as I thought. I didn't expect that "organic growth" strategy to actually work.
 

chazwazza

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I like this bit of delusion.

"Why would you want to hide a fundamental weakness? Isn't the whole point of Port Adelaide to create a system of development that churns our premiership quality players every year?

Pre-seasons 1-4 - increase aerobic capacity and endurance, building up the tank required to power increased muscle mass without compromising running ability needed to break lines

Pre-seasons 5 and 6 - increase strength capacity and power required to break tackles

Rinse, repeat.

People reckon we were miles off this year. Well, if we had taken our chances against Richmond, we'd be in their position right now. We are in pursuit of football mastery, and once we get there, it's going to take opposition sides years to establish the same systems we have.

It's why I couldn't care less about who wins the flag this year. We are thinking about the next ten, twenty, fifty flags and how we are going to be able to compete for them. But to do that, we need to establish a great development system first.

Adelaide plays a system designed around the weaknesses of their players. We play a system designed to correct those weaknesses. It's like in football (soccer) - if one team focuses on skill and playing out from the back while the other just focuses on long balls and scoring, the long ball team is going to win almost all the time at the start. But as the first team develops and actually learns the system, suddenly the long ball team won't be able to get near them because they never learned how to play any other way."

Anyway, everyday when I drive past the brewery on STURT Rd, Thebarton, I'll be thinking "now THAT is what I call football mastery".
:D
IMG_0914.JPG
 

Roovolution

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Indeed. You roll the dice and occasionally you get lucky. Danger in Bucks territory. Lots of personal accolades, awards but no premiership. Hope we emulate the Lions.
How bloody good would that be! My god it would be something. Rub all the Port noses in it and stick it up Danger! I'm going to dream about it tonight.
 

GreyCrow

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Ok
With your comment in mind, how does that equate with the Sloane decision ?
Sure, Sloane at worst is a Fine. Fine him. Does that then take him past 3 strikes? No, he plays in the GF

I am with DABM, this is going to backfire big time
 
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I like this bit of delusion.

"Why would you want to hide a fundamental weakness? Isn't the whole point of Port Adelaide to create a system of development that churns our premiership quality players every year?

Pre-seasons 1-4 - increase aerobic capacity and endurance, building up the tank required to power increased muscle mass without compromising running ability needed to break lines

Pre-seasons 5 and 6 - increase strength capacity and power required to break tackles

Rinse, repeat.

People reckon we were miles off this year. Well, if we had taken our chances against Richmond, we'd be in their position right now. We are in pursuit of football mastery, and once we get there, it's going to take opposition sides years to establish the same systems we have.

It's why I couldn't care less about who wins the flag this year. We are thinking about the next ten, twenty, fifty flags and how we are going to be able to compete for them. But to do that, we need to establish a great development system first.

Adelaide plays a system designed around the weaknesses of their players. We play a system designed to correct those weaknesses. It's like in football (soccer) - if one team focuses on skill and playing out from the back while the other just focuses on long balls and scoring, the long ball team is going to win almost all the time at the start. But as the first team develops and actually learns the system, suddenly the long ball team won't be able to get near them because they never learned how to play any other way."

Anyway, everyday when I drive past the brewery on STURT Rd, Thebarton, I'll be thinking "now THAT is what I call football mastery".
:D
View attachment 420920
That's next level delusion.
 
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