Vic 2017 Northcote By-Election - GREENS GAIN

[Gough]

I didn't want the vote either, but it was the only way it was getting done in 2017.

Most of us were happy to wait but Turnbull is so s**t scared of his own party that he bent over and let those who would still have homosexuality made illegal f*** him. It was pathetic.

 

[The Punter]

But now you don't have to wait. You waited through 2007-2013. It's been long enough. I helped a local YES campaign and made a financial contribution as well.

 

[madmug]

There's no part of my post that could be reasonable construed to blaming the Greens.

We don't have an ETS in Australia. For that I blame the Greens for their pigheadedness, but more importantly the fact that incredibly they ignored one of the truisms of history; that change happens in excruciatingly small increments. But hey, continue to let the good be the enemy of the pure.

We also would almost certainly have had same-sex marriage already in Australia if the plebiscite happened in the first half of 2017.

Sorry, I was just making a general point that its easy to blame the greens. The Liblabs in Tas do it all the time. Anyone with 1/2 a brain could see what Gunns were up to in Tas forests, so when the shyte hit the fan the LibLabs blamed the greens for the forestry disaster here, rather than the forest practises & world economics & trends. Thats just one example.

 

[swingdog]

There's no part of my post that could be reasonable construed to blaming the Greens.

We don't have an ETS in Australia. For that I blame the Greens for their pigheadedness, but more importantly the fact that incredibly they ignored one of the truisms of history; that change happens in excruciatingly small increments. But hey, continue to let the good be the enemy of the pure.

We also would almost certainly have had same-sex marriage already in Australia if the plebiscite happened in the first half of 2017.

I'd say the first portion of blame goes to Kevin Rudd trying to corner Malcolm Turnbull, who was ready to support the ETS.

 

[King Brown]

The internationalisation of the economy & the ability of capital to flow virtually unencumbered from country to country, has seen the loss of lower skilled manufacturing jobs, as well as the loss of such jobs due to mechanisation & computerisation. That has seen the biggest transfer of jobs from western to third world countries. ie Australia to China, India etc.

The push to the clean & green environment stuff has had a minimal impact on jobs by comparison.

Its easy to blame the greens. The fact is it was a Government & business inspired change.

Go to a colliery in the Hunter or Illawarra and ask the union members there, Labor's last true remaining base, what they think of the Greens. Go to the Tomago smelter and ask around. Or anyone who works in the energy and forestry sectors around the country.

Now, ask yourself what happens if Labor are forced to ally with the Greens to hold power and further demises to industrial workers rights and jobs happen under that arrangement, in the interests of 'the environment'. What happens to the seats of Shortland, Newcastle, Hunter, Whitlam? Do they stay Labor, or break ranks and filter off to a populist firebrand? What do you think happens?

All because a bunch of preening dilettantes want to change their Facebook profile to "THIS SATURDAY I'M VOTING GREEN" every couple of years.

 

[madmug]

Go to a colliery in the Hunter or Illawarra and ask the union members there, Labor's last true remaining base, what they think of the Greens. Go to the Tomago smelter and ask around. Or anyone who works in the energy and forestry sectors around the country.

Now, ask yourself what happens if Labor are forced to ally with the Greens to hold power and further demises to industrial workers rights and jobs happen under that arrangement, in the interests of 'the environment'. What happens to the seats of Shortland, Newcastle, Hunter, Whitlam? Do they stay Labor, or break ranks and filter off to a populist firebrand? What do you think happens?

All because a bunch of preening dilettantes want to change their Facebook profile to "THIS SATURDAY I'M VOTING GREEN" every couple of years.

Dont confuse the anger of people in stressed & dying industries with the words of the inner city latte set. The demise of such industries are driven by real world economics. Not the comments of people over a coffee. Economic reality is the real game. Fact

 

[King Brown]

Dont confuse the anger of people in stressed & dying industries with the words of the inner city latte set. The demise of such industries are driven by real world economics. Not the comments of people over a coffee. Economic reality is the real game. Fact

The Greens have active policies to deny any further exploration for coal seam gas, expansion of mines, and handbrake any energy intensive industry, like aluminium processing. Of course, aluminium smelting doesn't disappear into thin air, it just happens elsewhere, as energy intensive as it ever was.

Citing real world economics is nice, Australia won't prosper with a debt-funded services industry based on the rentier class speculating on housing investments. Someone's gotta dig up the lithium and rare earths to fuel the fleet of green electric cars dreamed up in their policy document - it might as well be Australia.

What exactly do people do in the Greens utopian vision?

 

[madmug]

The Greens have active policies to deny any further exploration for coal seam gas, expansion of mines, and handbrake any energy intensive industry, like aluminium processing. Of course, aluminium smelting doesn't disappear into thin air, it just happens elsewhere, as energy intensive as it ever was.

Citing real world economics is nice, Australia won't prosper with a debt-funded services industry based on the rentier class speculating on housing investments. Someone's gotta dig up the lithium and rare earths to fuel the fleet of green electric cars dreamed up in their policy document - it might as well be Australia.

What exactly do people do in the Greens utopian vision?

Green policy is not Government nor business action. They are not the Government nor do they control the economy. Sure, get angry with them, knock yourself out over them, but that achieves nothing.

Even the Greens good ideas are irrelevant because they control nothing.

Their 'vision' is likewise irrelevant. They are not in power.

 

[Bombermania]

The Greens have active policies to deny any further exploration for coal seam gas, expansion of mines, and handbrake any energy intensive industry, like aluminium processing. Of course, aluminium smelting doesn't disappear into thin air, it just happens elsewhere, as energy intensive as it ever was.

Citing real world economics is nice, Australia won't prosper with a debt-funded services industry based on the rentier class speculating on housing investments. Someone's gotta dig up the lithium and rare earths to fuel the fleet of green electric cars dreamed up in their policy document - it might as well be Australia.

What exactly do people do in the Greens utopian vision?

The Greens might have such policies but they are not the government and they are not controlling investment decisions so when we look at investment decisions the smart money is going to renewables instead of coal, now unless all those high net worth individuals have become greens overnight then maybe there is more to the changing energy landscape than a minor political party's policies.

Greens are not opposed to all mining, they are only opposed to coal and uranium mining. Lithium mining is a growing part of the resources space just as coal is a declining part.

 

[AM]

A sweeping review of construction projects is under way after police uncovered a rort in which more than 400 dodgy building licenses were granted.

A major Victoria Police investigation has found that references were faked, work histories falsified, and bogus certificates issued in the scam.

The Herald Sun has been told builders who obtained the licenses are suspected of having performed work worth tens of millions of dollars.

This is on top of the contemptible shoddy and dangerous fire prone cladding placed on so many buildings by developers.

Yet the well known apologist here for the developers can't get past kicking the CMFEU. It's a corrupt industry.

 

[Brunswick Trap King]

In King Brown's defence, I've always found it ironic how pro-Greens Northcote appears, yet I've never lived anywhere less racially diverse in Melbourne. I think it's pretty easy to care (or at least pretend to care) about being pro-immigration when you don't actually deal with a lot of the abject poverty associated with it.

Even when I moved to Fairfield, my friend (Samoan) and I would make jokes about how the white people would always stare at him as if he doesn't belong there. It's easy to be pro-anything if you don't have real experiences, both good and bad, of it.

 

[King Brown]

In King Brown's defence, I've always found it ironic how pro-Greens Northcote appears, yet I've never lived anywhere less racially diverse in Melbourne. I think it's pretty easy to care (or at least pretend to care) about being pro-immigration when you don't actually deal with a lot of the abject poverty associated with it.

Even when I moved to Fairfield, my friend (Samoan) and I would make jokes about how the white people would always stare at him as if he doesn't belong there. It's easy to be pro-anything if you don't have real experiences, both good and bad, of it.

Don't get me started. I have a few friends, white Greens voters, naturally, who live in Coburg and refer to it as 'Coburgistan'. Also constantly mentioning that you have to live on "the good side of Bell St". They of course own property there.

When I asked them in a blunt fashion "what do you mean by Coburgistan" they obfuscated "oh you know, it's a diverse neighbourhood". Yeah, that's the case over on the bad side of Bell St.

Greens voters man.

 

[Brunswick Trap King]

Don't get me started. I have a few friends, white Green voters, naturally, who live in Coburg and refer to it as 'Coburgistan'. Also constantly mentioning that you have to live on "the good side of Bell St". Own property there.

When I asked them in a blunt fashion "what do you mean by Coburgistan" they obfuscated "oh you know, it's a diverse neighbourhood". Yeah, that's the case over on the bad side of Bell St.

Greens voters man.

With these situations, there's seemingly a herd mentality where people will vote along these lines while actually despising the people they pretend to care about.

One of my closest friends (Indian) was born very wealthy. He likes to bandwagon on social issues e.g. asylum seekers and pretend to care about the working class. As soon as he's had a few drinks, he'll start mocking the poor by calling them 'dead shits' and mocking the various ethnicities that visit him in his health practice in Coburg, while unironically not realising he's had opportunities most would dream of à la his parents bankrolling him buying practices.

I've noticed these types of things with people too often to not be cynical about inner-suburb progressives' real motives.

 

[radiojake]

Only thing that sucks about living on the 'bad' side of Bell St (which I assume your friends mean 'north of') is having to cross Bell St

otherwise it's great out here

 

[radiojake]

With these situations, there's seemingly a herd mentality where people will vote along these lines while actually despising the people they pretend to care about.

One of my closest friends (Indian) was born very wealthy. He likes to bandwagon on social issues e.g. asylum seekers and pretend to care about the working class. As soon as he's had a few drinks, he'll start mocking the poor by calling them 'dead shits' and mocking the various ethnicities that visit him in his health practice in Coburg, while unironically not realising he's had opportunities most would dream of à la his parents bankrolling him buying practices.

I've noticed these types of things with people too often to not be cynical about inner-suburb progressives' real motives.

campaigners gonna campaign

they cross every spectrum

 

[Pessimistic]

The Greens have active policies to deny any further exploration for coal seam gas, expansion of mines, and handbrake any energy intensive industry, like aluminium processing. Of course, aluminium smelting doesn't disappear into thin air, it just happens elsewhere, as energy intensive as it ever was.

Citing real world economics is nice, Australia won't prosper with a debt-funded services industry based on the rentier class speculating on housing investments. Someone's gotta dig up the lithium and rare earths to fuel the fleet of green electric cars dreamed up in their policy document - it might as well be Australia.

What exactly do people do in the Greens utopian vision?

Farmers and national party arent keen on fracking eithr

 

[King Brown]

Only thing that sucks about living on the 'bad' side of Bell St (which I assume your friends mean 'north of') is having to cross Bell St

otherwise it's great out here

This was 5 years ago, with the insane property boom in Melbourne I imagine it's the Ring Road now.

 

[Brunswick Trap King]

campaigners gonna campaign

they cross every spectrum

I agree. However, anecdotally I've found that the difference between a lot of the Liberal and Greens voters I've met is that the Liberal supporters are more honest with how they really feel. Young Libs don't bother to keep up the pretence of being socially minded for whatever reason. Surprisingly, I don't really know many people my age that vote Labor. It seems that it's non-trendy to do so, despite me occasionally talking a few friends into voting that way.

That's not to say you're like that, or anyone else here, but it's something I've noticed.

 

[nobbyiscool]

Don't get me started. I have a few friends, white Greens voters, naturally, who live in Coburg and refer to it as 'Coburgistan'. Also constantly mentioning that you have to live on "the good side of Bell St". They of course own property there.

When I asked them in a blunt fashion "what do you mean by Coburgistan" they obfuscated "oh you know, it's a diverse neighbourhood". Yeah, that's the case over on the bad side of Bell St.

Greens voters man.

As opposed to the conservatives in this country who bleat about family values while actively keeping asylum seeker families apart and leaving fathers in torturous conditions.

As opposed to conservative hypocrites like Dutton who wear a white ribbon while ignoring the violence that asylum seekers are subjected to.

Yeah, the tiny minority of Green voting hypocrites are much more deserving of ridicule

 

[Pessimistic]

Green policy is not Government nor business action. They are not the Government nor do they control the economy. Sure, get angry with them, knock yourself out over them, but that achieves nothing.

Even the Greens good ideas are irrelevant because they control nothing.

Their 'vision' is likewise irrelevant. They are not in power.

Too right. about a logical as the deputy prime minister running a protest campaign in a by election, and people falling for it

 

[Gough]

Too right. about a logical as the deputy prime minister running a protest campaign in a by election, and people falling for it

Or preaching family values when his wife throws him out for knocking up a staffer. Anyone else notice her absence when Barn voted on the weekend?

 

[King Brown]

More Liberal-Greens alliance:

http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/g...to-kill-west-gate-tunnel-20171210-h0218u.html

This made me laugh heartily:

Ms Ratnam said the Greens wanted to see a bigger push to get freight on rail to reduce truck traffic in Melbourne's west.
​

The Greens continue to demonstrate their incredibly naive understanding of how modern day logistics works.

 

[Snake_Baker]

Looking forward to the Northcote secessionist movement