List Mgmt. 2017 Starting 22 | + Trimming the "fat"

Discussion in 'Fremantle' started by Docker Alyssa, May 12, 2016.

Put it out there
  1. wayToGo_

    wayToGo_ Norm Smith Medallist

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    Yeah I think many are expecting Dawson to play 20+ games this season but he only played 59% TOG yesterday and he had very little impact just like he did in Rd 23 win last year against the Dogs. I guess we'll wait and see but I think he's only a chance because of Alex being injured and even then I don't think Ross has him locked in anymore like he has in previous years.
     

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  2. theGav56

    theGav56 Brownlow Medallist

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    He is out of contract. Is he going to be on the list next season? Doubt it. Extending that line of thinking, plus with the recruitment of Logue and Cox, plus Collins and A Pearce, there is no reason to expect him to be playing best 22 by years end. He would need to have an absolute blinder of a season, and even then, nup.

    I have to say that I have enjoyed watching Dawson play. It is a slightly macabre pleasure, but he is a regular scalp-taker., and we definitely need some hardness When we are winning I don't mind a chuckle at his limitations. But his mistakes can be costly, and he has been suspended way to often to be considered an ongoing option.
     
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  3. ilikepotatoes

    ilikepotatoes Norm Smith Medallist

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    I reckon the 22 who played the first half yesterday are pretty much the round 1 team (if fit).

    So that's something along the lines of

    Spurr Dawson Ibbotson
    Johnson Hamling Weller
    B. Hill Mundy S. Hill
    Walters Kersten (dependent on his ribs) Blakely
    Griffin McCarthy Ballantyne
    Sandilands Neale Fyfe
    D. Pearce Langdon Sutcliffe Tucker

    Probably a few players who I personally wouldn't have in the team ahead of younger players, but not too old.
     
  4. meima

    meima Brownlow Medallist

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    I think is the suspended part that hurt his chance , apart from that Dawson is pretty handy player. But I still prefer Collins having game time .
     
  5. Wally Walpamur

    Wally Walpamur Premium Gold

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    There's probably only one KPF that Dawson matches up on OK and that's Tom Hawkins. They're both slow, don't run too much and their game is built around the contest, which is why I think he'll play round 1 and phased out over the year for Collins and A Pearce. Unless the AFL bring in some rules the traditional KPF/KPB is a dying breed.
     
  6. Kenny_01

    Kenny_01 Brownlow Medallist

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    I think we all would prefer AP, Bennell, Apeness and Logue/ Crozier in for Dawson, D Pearce, Griffin and Ibbotson but that's looking unlikely due to injury or form. Regardless, if can get a consistent performance from those 4 then we should be very competitive.


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  7. Docker Alyssa

    Docker Alyssa Club Legend

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    Time will tell I guess but Ross Lyon and match committee I suspect will put a combination of the best, most hardened and consistent team on the park each week this season. This isn't a franchise team. Players whose careers are in the peak 27-30 age bracket will not have stayed if it'd been made clear youth would be selected and we were playing a long game. I think the team wants top 4 success now. For this to happen I don't know how you can "put 20 games into [player x]" and all that just because you, a mere fan, happen to like the kid. Nor do I believe will Ross.

    Best 22 talent is not starting 22 ;)

    We need to breed a culture of attrition. It should be hard to squeeze out our experienced players. I've said this before but last seasons playing the youth has been seen incorrectly as a 'new direction' for the club. It was a one off season decision. 5 losses in a row when Fyfe went down meant our season was shot and only then we pumped games into unproven youth. This was a good decision for our future and set us up for the best trade period we ever had.

    Our age profile is already vastly improved this year. We still need our veterans left in to give our team experience and on-field leadership.
     
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  8. FreoMonocle

    FreoMonocle Premium Gold

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    I think it's more nuanced. I think they're playing both the long game and the short game and they'd be mugs not to. You go out to win now but also with a view to what it takes to win in the future.

    Typically, the players are on at the most 2 years, the club can can get rid of under-performers - if there is someone better. As fans, we often have a different idea of someone better, even if the club fielded the 1 in a hundred year champion team there'd still be a disgruntled "they could have played x instead of z".

    In general, the player that is battle hardened is the better player, than a raw candidate without AFL experience. An a grade player like Walters who has natural footy smarts isn't getting a game unless he is fit and motivated, as evidenced in the different stages of his career, Logue tonight made great contests and some great decisions for a rookie, but the number of and consequences of his howlers were hmmmm... ordinary and wouldn't have been accepted if he was a long term player.
     
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  9. MitchRobinson12

    MitchRobinson12 All Australian

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    Hey guys I reckon Freo look good this season especially if Bennell can come in.

    Just a question.. If Sandilands plays does he play sole ruck? Or does Griffin play too incase he gets injured? Also how long is Zac Clarke out for?

    Cheers guys.
     
  10. DudleyDocker

    DudleyDocker Club Legend

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    You might be in the wrong thread buddy, there is a dedicated Fantasy / SC thread.

    Having said that, it looks very much like we will be going with 2 ruckmen, at the moment that is Sandi and Griffin, with young Sean Darcy having a run in the JLT as well. That's about all the fit rucks we have at the moment.

    Apeness should be back in around 8 weeks and Clark will probably be second half of the season.
     
  11. Jezzitizle

    Jezzitizle Club Legend

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    Who should replace Ballas in the 22?

    Grey for his pressure/to develop him?

    Maybe move Weller forward and throw crozier back to the backline?
     
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  12. WilloTree

    WilloTree Club Legend

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    Wouldn't you love it to be Bennell.. But, it'll be Crozier.
     
  13. Schauermann

    Schauermann Premiership Player

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    Was thinking about that as well: Not that easy. Got enough tall suddenly small look a bit thin.

    I like that idea, Crozier played his best football back while Weller looked good anywhere. Weller/Fyfe/Langdon and other mids to rotate. Preferable the most dangerous one when it comes to goals. Not really sure who those are until Bennell gets fit hopefully one day. Blakely looked an odd choice but 9 score involvement was decent (with 2 goals he would have looked close to a masterstroke).
     
  14. meima

    meima Brownlow Medallist

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    With ballas injury, what about Neale move to play ballas role , blakely move to middle , weller to HF and croz to weller. Any other option ? Until ballas is injured I think he is underated how important he is do ross forward structure.
     
  15. theGav56

    theGav56 Brownlow Medallist

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    The club would not have been expecting Ballantyne to play 22 games, so they would already have a strategy for this, and from what we have seen, that strategy is not Grey, Weller or D Pearce. It is not switching Crozier and Weller. It is definitely not Neale.

    It is either Crozier or/and Langdon.
     
  16. Tayl0r

    Tayl0r Moderator

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    I think Langdon offers quite a bit in transitional play, more than Ballantyne and if that means more fast movements into the forward line for one on ones but no crumbing options then I'd take it.
     
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  17. heavho

    heavho All Australian

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    It just goes to show how important Walters is to the team now. We need some quality small forwards coming through in the next draft
     
  18. dominguez

    dominguez Brownlow Medallist

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    Our starting 18 looks strong in my opinion but it falls away quite quickly after that.
     
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  19. theGav56

    theGav56 Brownlow Medallist

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    A symptom of a team in transition.
     
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  20. Frigate

    Frigate Club Legend

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    Great work Alyssa, I think you are right on the money. There is no way the team is entering this season as if they cannot win the flag. It is unlikely that will occur, however if we can be in the 8 come the bye rounds, then with Bennell, A.Pearce and even Ballas back that is a fair injection. A full list would see us as a very competitive team in the second half of the year, as I believe some of our "younger players" will take the next step too, and our recruits in Hamling, Hill and McCarthy are going to be great - not sure with Kersten, think he will rotate with Apeness and Tabs until one becomes consistent (or perhaps falls from favour).

    Just reiterating what I interpreted from your post, if a player is better than another player (for that role), they get to play. If someone has an injury, the best available for that position comes in. The exceptions come into play with form of the team. Winning - not many changes / losing. The players need an upside to be considered - age is not a factor in a competing squad. If a team is experimenting - that is another thing, and teams unlikely or not going to play finals can do this (tanking rules apply).
     
  21. Frigate

    Frigate Club Legend

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    I agree. We have about a backup + 1 for each position. We are at breaking point for ruck already. Our midfield, Fyfe, Neale, S Hill are not replaceable within our squad, around that we can make do (to an extent). With A Pearce out, we cannot lose another key back. Ibbo or Logue cannot take a KPF role IMO effectively. Forward, we have options for smalls, but McCarthy is our solitary tall for the opening rounds.

    So we need no injuries or suspensions, then we can compete.
     
  22. getgaff

    getgaff Norm Smith Medallist

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    Won't be the best available against the Cats on Sunday but here is my thoughts on the Dockers strongest 22 for 2017 excluding Ballantyne due to a longer term injury.

    BACKS: Lee Spurr ~ Sam Collins ~ Hayden Crozier
    HALF BACKS: Michael Johnson ~ Joel Hamling ~ Tom Sheridan

    CENTRE: Brad Hill ~ David Mundy ~ Stephen Hill
    FOLLOWERS: Aaron Sandilands ~ Nathan Fyfe ~ Lachie Neale

    HALF FORWARDS: Ed Langdon ~ Shane Kersten ~ Lachie Weller
    FULL FORWARDS: Jonathan Griffin/ Michael Apeness ~ Cam McCarthy ~ Michael Walters

    INTERCHANGE: Darcy Tucker ~ Connor Blakely ~ Harley Balic/ Hayden Ballantyne ~ Alex Pearce/ Garrick Ibbotson/ Cameron Sutcliffe



    Jon Griffin in a fortunate position where Apeness are out injured. I had Apeness as best 22 more regularly in 2017 with the idea to keep pumping games into him and persisting with him because his a big boy ho when played deep won't get moved off the footy easily.

    Harley Balic - Has the skills, just needs the opportunity to present itself. Ballantyne injury is that small opening he needs.

    Harley Bennell - Talent to burn, would be a top 5 player at the club when fully fit but can't get his body right. Speculation about his dedication to rehab is still there.

    Alex Pearce - can be argued that with him there's one to many talls and with smaller/ versatile guys like Ibbotson, Suban and Sutcliffe in the stands he might make way. Will be eased into it but from an outsiders perspective I think the best tall defence combo is Hamling, Collins and Alex Pearce.
     
  23. Scham

    Scham Norm Smith Medallist

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    Where's Dawson!!!:mad:
     
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  24. wayToGo_

    wayToGo_ Norm Smith Medallist

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    The key is in the word "speculation". Ross has debunked this several times and I think his word might be more reliable than some hack "journalist" who makes money from how many clicks they get.
     
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  25. scon

    scon Brownlow Medallist

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    Once speculation based upon zero evidence has been regurgitated for a year, it's referred to as the unadulterated filth that spews from the mouths of scum.
     
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