List Mgmt. 2017 Trade & FA Targets Part 1

[cooperrules]

martins not playing much better against the dons

He was bog

 

[TheJackal]

martins not playing much better against the dons

I must've been watching a different game then. Will probably receive another three votes after tonight.

 

[burningdwarf]

If we give Fyfe 1.5million a year I'll be sick.

 

[Sippa]

I will be genuinely spewing if we trade both our first rounders regardless who we get.. we see how it turns out for other clubs when they sell the farm ... we need to stagger the age profile of our top stars and we don't have any genuine gun a grade midfielders coming through.. I know Kelly is a gun and I'd love him but I think we need 2 gun 18 year olds who would be st that level in 2-3 years time because realistically that's when we would be ready anyway

 

[TheJackal]

If we give Fyfe 1.5million a year I'll be sick.

If we give him 1.5m a year I can only assume we know what we are doing.

This time of year is basically when we would be finding out about his intentions (internally). So he could've made up his mind already, and he could've already mentally checked out too. He is getting smashed physically every week, his team is average and he wants to make sure he gets to the end of his contract year in one piece.

Personally I'm not a huge fan of that attitude if my assumptions are correct but its possible.

I'll still back in our guys if they get him, but Dusty is a long way ahead on current output and is absolutely my pick of the two.

 

[Impatient Saint]

It wouldnt matter if we had GWS's entire list at the moment the way Richo is coaching they would still lose. Time for a significant mid year review Richo and make some changes to your ball movement and the way sides are countering your game plan. Ive said it before and been bagged but Sexton is the team strategist and he is not up to it and has been at the club far too long - time to recruit a replacement!

 

[VDS66]

It wouldnt matter if we had GWS's entire list at the moment the way Richo is coaching they would still lose. Time for a significant mid year review Richo and make some changes to your ball movement and the way sides are countering your game plan. Ive said it before and been bagged but Sexton is the team strategist and he is not up to it and has been at the club far too long - time to recruit a replacement!

Oh dear. Haven't you applied for the job yet? Who will you appoint as your senior linguistics coach?

 

[VDS66]

Is champagne popping moment involving Josh Kelly ?

No. Longer offered a 10 year extension.

 

[aussierulesrules]

Season is far from over and we can still make finals. Turn it up...

Fyfe watching us and being like:

Yes I will.
No I won't.
Yes I will.
Yes I will.
Maybe I will because it was only Carlton.
No ducking way after that game.

Serious?

Fair enough with Fyfe, he was probably a bad example, as I actually think the only way he'd be coming to us after the way Freo have played this year is if he'd already committed over the offseason- in which case it wouldn't matter how badly or otherwise we went this year- but in the case of someone like Kelly, I think it could be very valid.

If what we've been hearing is true or close to the mark- that we've really only started to go really hard for him very recently, or that he's only started to give us really serious consideration really recently, and that we made our big presentation to him just 3 weeks ago- then why on Earth couldn't how we've performed for a decent period of that time affect his decision, if he needs to make it right about now, and he has two other great options before him?

If he has to make his decision really soon he won't have the benefit of hindsight of how we'll go in the 2nd half of the season (where we MAY get things back on track again, but also may not), but what he'll have to go on are the cold hard facts before him right now.

And the cold hard facts are that despite having played 8 of our 10 games at our home ground and having had minimal injuries, we're currently sitting in 10th spot on the ladder, and after we play Adelaide in Adelaide, could very well be two wins outside the 8, with only one "easy" looking game to come for the rest of the year.

Very rarely do teams come from that sort of position and make finals. So you can say "turn it up" as much as you like, but he'll have no great reason to expect that we'll pull a rabbit out of the hat and do so, especially if the Adelaide game goes as expected.

So he's probably no longer looking at us as this exciting team that could even be pushing top 4 by the end of this year, if we'd gone on with it after the GWS win, as he may have been just 3 weeks ago. Which may have been our main selling point for him for all we know.

Like it or not, what's happened in the last two weeks in particular would have changed perceptions of us and where we're at, and if someone was on the fence about coming to us say 3 weeks ago, I don't see how anyone could seriously argue that what has happened in the last two weeks in particular would have done anything but harm our chances. Even if it's just a little. Especially if they were undecided and have to make a decision right about now, and this form of ours is really fresh in their minds and they have other great alternatives.

Anyway, I really hope it hasn't.

 

[aussierulesrules]

you're arguing the same point. in my opinion, two games does not a season make. I'd really hope anyone who played the game for a living wouldn't be so incredibly short sighted.

Of course two games does not a season make, that's not my point. My point is that if our main or best selling point to someone was that we might have been a team on the serious rise- that would be a legit chance of winning a flag say as soon as next year, after maybe even pushing for top 4 this year- they may have thought that for that to be the case we had to prove that we were legit by going on with it after our wins over Hawthorn and GWS, or at the very least, stay super-competitive and look really likely to play finals this year.

But instead, we've taken a couple of big steps backwards, put our finals chances in significant jeopardy and proved that we're still a potentially long way off being a consistently good team. And that may be all the proof they need that we're not the team for them right now, if they have other seriously good offers on the table (perhaps from one or more teams who are), and need to make a decision based on what they know to be true right now.

If that makes them "incredibly short sighted" in your mind, then so be it. There's plenty of talk that Kelly might sign just a 2 year deal to stay at GWS though, precisely because he might be a much better chance of winning a flag or two there in that time and that he could then look to cash in after that, perhaps when he thinks that teams like us and North are going to be ready to really contend hard for flags.

If he thinks we could be ready to contend hard as early as next year though, that potentially takes away a lot of the incentive to stay at GWS. IMHO.

 

[plugger66]

I will be genuinely spewing if we trade both our first rounders regardless who we get.. we see how it turns out for other clubs when they sell the farm ... we need to stagger the age profile of our top stars and we don't have any genuine gun a grade midfielders coming through.. I know Kelly is a gun and I'd love him but I think we need 2 gun 18 year olds who would be st that level in 2-3 years time because realistically that's when we would be ready anyway

I just never understand these posts. Kelly is 22 years old. Probably got 10 years left. If we lost picks for him who cares. He will still most likely be playing in 2027. And when does a top pick guareentee a gun? Kelly is a gun


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Sir Skid]

Fyfe management to open up discussions for fresh marketing campaign should he move interstate.

F13 will be tabled on Monday to all potential suiters and informing them that he would want that number made available should he choose them.

When asked by Purple
"When did you come up with that idea champ"?
Fyfe responded with
"Just came to me yesterday when I realized after the game I'd had 13 clangers".

 

[StCicatriz]

It wouldnt matter if we had GWS's entire list at the moment the way Richo is coaching they would still lose. Time for a significant mid year review Richo and make some changes to your ball movement and the way sides are countering your game plan. Ive said it before and been bagged but Sexton is the team strategist and he is not up to it and has been at the club far too long - time to recruit a replacement!

This.

 

[VDS66]

Fair enough with Fyfe, he was probably a bad example, as I actually think the only way he'd be coming to us after the way Freo have played this year is if he'd already committed over the offseason- in which case it wouldn't matter how badly or otherwise we went this year- but in the case of someone like Kelly, I think it could be very valid.

If what we've been hearing is true or close to the mark- that we've really only started to go really hard for him very recently, or that he's only started to give us really serious consideration really recently, and that we made our big presentation to him just 3 weeks ago- then why on Earth couldn't how we've performed for a decent period of that time affect his decision, if he needs to make it right about now, and he has two other great options before him?

If he has to make his decision really soon he won't have the benefit of hindsight of how we'll go in the 2nd half of the season (where we MAY get things back on track again, but also may not), but what he'll have to go on are the cold hard facts before him right now.

And the cold hard facts are that despite having played 8 of our 10 games at our home ground and having had minimal injuries, we're currently sitting in 10th spot on the ladder, and after we play Adelaide in Adelaide, could very well be two wins outside the 8, with only one "easy" looking game to come for the rest of the year.

Very rarely do teams come from that sort of position and make finals. So you can say "turn it up" as much as you like, but he'll have no great reason to expect that we'll pull a rabbit out of the hat and do so, especially if the Adelaide game goes as expected.

So he's probably no longer looking at us as this exciting team that could even be pushing top 4 by the end of this year, if we'd gone on with it after the GWS win, as he may have been just 3 weeks ago. Which may have been our main selling point for him for all we know.

Like it or not, what's happened in the last two weeks in particular would have changed perceptions of us and where we're at, and if someone was on the fence about coming to us say 3 weeks ago, I don't see how anyone could seriously argue that what has happened in the last two weeks in particular would have done anything but harm our chances. Even if it's just a little. Especially if they were undecided and have to make a decision right about now, and this form of ours is really fresh in their minds and they have other great alternatives.

Anyway, I really hope it hasn't.

A fair few subjective assumptions being made.

You could use it as a selling point as to why you want him, so he can help us go the next level etc.

I'd be more open to being recruited to a cause and opportunity to play a massive part in it, instead of an armchair ride into finals.

Never discount the appeal of a challenge to a competitive individual. It's how you sell it.

For example I think that's why Fyfe would find us appealing...

New era, cusp of success, you'll be the main man to lead us into battle. Much better for brand Fyfe.

It's about understanding what each player wants and then showing them how you will help them get it.

 

[StCicatriz]

A fair few subjective assumptions being made.

You could use it as a selling point as to why you want him, so he can help us go the next level etc.

I'd be more open to being recruited to a cause and opportunity to play a massive part in it, instead of an armchair ride into finals.

Never discount the appeal of a challenge to a competitive individual. It's how you sell it.

For example I think that's why Fyfe would find us appealing...

New era, cusp of success, you'll be the main man to lead us into battle. Much better for brand Fyfe.

It's about understanding what each player wants and then showing them how you will help them get it.

To saints fans maybe. But that's no different to any other club including freo. The only point of difference we have is money

 

[Zephiisdaman]

I really like Josh Bruce as a player, I can't understand how he isn't getting a gig at the moment. I know he has given us match up headaches in the past.
Is he tradeable? What would he be worth if so?
Edit: I think our trading over the years has been pretty fair. I would imagine you would be pleased with what Koby brings to the table. He was super in the first half yesterday. Tough and uncompromising.

 

[Browny2Carlisle]

Any chance of going after Preuss? Getting limited opportunity at north. Is a young, big mobile ruckman who loves to get in the thick of it and can take a good mark and has the ability to kick the ball. I've got the feeling hes going to be the next big ruckman of the comp and would be worth chasing.

 

[VDS66]

To saints fans maybe. But that's no different to any other club including freo. The only point of difference we have is money

Got nothing to do with Saints fans. It's business 101.

There are many contributing factors to any decision. And it comes down to the player's priorities and which club can meet them best. If it's money, then so be it.

 

[sverik25]

I really like Josh Bruce as a player, I can't understand how he isn't getting a gig at the moment. I know he has given us match up headaches in the past.
Is he tradeable? What would he be worth if so?
Edit: I think our trading over the years has been pay. I would imagine you would be pleased with what Koby brings to the table. He was super in the first half yesterday. Tough and uncompromising.

Bruce is way down on form at the moment. His marking this year has generally been well below AFL standard and before he was dropped I'm pretty sure he was only winning 9% of one-on-one contests, which is well below the AFL average.

Since then he has gone back into the VFL and done nothing to suggest he deserves his spot in the team back. That said I doubt we'll be looking to trade him because we don't have a whole lot of key forward options and I think we still have faith that can recapture some of his 2015 form.

 

[Zephiisdaman]

Bruce is way down on form at the moment. His marking this year has generally been well below AFL standard and before he was dropped I'm pretty sure he was only winning 9% of one-on-one contests, which is well below the AFL average.

Since then he has gone back into the VFL and done nothing to suggest he deserves his spot in the team back. That said I doubt we'll be looking to trade him because we don't have a whole lot of key forward options and I think we still have faith that can recapture some of his 2015 form.

Seems a real confidence player. When up he is almost unstoppable but when struggling.... Could he play CHB to get form perhaps?

 

[aussierulesrules]

A fair few subjective assumptions being made.

You could use it as a selling point as to why you want him, so he can help us go the next level etc.

I'd be more open to being recruited to a cause and opportunity to play a massive part in it, instead of an armchair ride into finals.

Never discount the appeal of a challenge to a competitive individual. It's how you sell it.

For example I think that's why Fyfe would find us appealing...

New era, cusp of success, you'll be the main man to lead us into battle. Much better for brand Fyfe.

It's about understanding what each player wants and then showing them how you will help them get it.

I'm not sure I've made any assumptions there, as it's all just a hypothetical: "IF things are x and y, then us showing that we're still potentially a long way off being a consistently good team could have harmed our chances.

If things aren't x and y, then it's a moot point.

The way I see it though, we had two main selling points really going for us earlier in the year and they were A: money and B: There was a very decent chance that we were the "next big thing".

So to someone from the outside, we right now are probably not looking like B is necessarily likely to be the case any more (we may be, but we may also very much not be), so if that was something that really appealed to them as a selling point, it could make it really hard for us to land them now, if they're about to make their decision.

If that's not what motivates them, then obviously it may not change anything.

It may not actually be the worst thing for us if we don't land a really "big fish" this year, if we don't really turn things around, though. Because it may be that we would be better off continuing to build through the draft until our list is strong enough that adding that big fish at considerable cost will just be the cherry on top.

If it looks like we're still a ways off it, adding someone like Fyfe for not just huge cap space, but also two really good picks, could actually hinder our chances of winning a flag in the near future.

It may be that we'd be better off hitting the draft with really good picks and saving that money for when we're ready to add that guy that will be the final piece of the puzzle.

 

[gringo2011]

I really like Josh Bruce as a player, I can't understand how he isn't getting a gig at the moment. I know he has given us match up headaches in the past.
Is he tradeable? What would he be worth if so?
Edit: I think our trading over the years has been pretty fair. I would imagine you would be pleased with what Koby brings to the table. He was super in the first half yesterday. Tough and uncompromising.

Koby had one good quarter, you can't have Bruce but we might have a few others you can have.

 

[gringo2011]

I'm not sure I've made any assumptions there, as it's all just a hypothetical: "IF things are x and y, then us showing that we're still potentially a long way off being a consistently good team could have harmed our chances.

If things aren't x and y, then it's a moot point.

The way I see it though, we had two main selling points really going for us earlier in the year and they were A: money and B: There was a very decent chance that we were the "next big thing", but to someone from the outside, we right now are probably not looking like B is necessarily likely to be the case any more, so if that was something that really appealed to them as a selling point, It could make it really hard for us to land them now if they're about to make their decision.

It may not actually be the worst thing for us if we don't land a really "big fish" this year if we don't really turn things around though, because it may be that we would be better off continuing to build through the draft until our list is strong enough that adding that big fish at considerable cost will just be the cherry on top.

The counter to that is most managers won't be going all Chicken Little after losses to a couple of decent teams. I don't think many think we are a finished article, we still have an average list but do have at least 5 kids who look like they are on a very upward trajectory. It's not a week to week thing, it's selling the vision of the future and hoping it looks appealing to the prospective player.

 

[VDS66]

I'm not sure I've made any assumptions there, as it's all just a hypothetical: "IF things are x and y, then us showing that we're still potentially a long way off being a consistently good team could have harmed our chances.

If things aren't x and y, then it's a moot point.

The way I see it though, we had two main selling points really going for us earlier in the year and they were A: money and B: There was a very decent chance that we were the "next big thing".

So to someone from the outside, we right now are probably not looking like B is necessarily likely to be the case any more (we may be, but we may also very much not be), so if that was something that really appealed to them as a selling point, it could make it really hard for us to land them now, if they're about to make their decision.

It may not actually be the worst thing for us if we don't land a really "big fish" this year, if we don't really turn things around though. Because it may be that we would be better off continuing to build through the draft until our list is strong enough that adding that big fish at considerable cost will just be the cherry on top.

If it looks like we're still a ways off it, adding someone like Fyfe for not just huge cap space, but also two really good picks could actually hinder our chances of winning a flag in the near future.

It may be that we'd be better off hitting the draft with really good picks and saving that money for when we're ready to add that guy that will be the final piece of the puzzle.

These decisions are not made overnight, do if Fyfe decided to move, he'd be 80% down the road by now. If he states that wins are an essential part of the decision then surely he'd wait until the season draws to a close?

At this stage, any agreement would be in principle and non binding anyway. Too early to draw a line through it IMO.

 

[plugger66]

It wouldnt matter if we had GWS's entire list at the moment the way Richo is coaching they would still lose. Time for a significant mid year review Richo and make some changes to your ball movement and the way sides are countering your game plan. Ive said it before and been bagged but Sexton is the team strategist and he is not up to it and has been at the club far too long - time to recruit a replacement!

Must make Cameron a very poor coach. He actually does have the GWS list and we beat them. And kindly will us in on Sexton's role and where he falls down. I don't you have a clue what he or any of the other coaches do.