2017 vs 2025 - more talented side?

[Jeffcrowe]

I like to be optimistic and say we’ll peak in 2 months time. That would be friggin’ nice!

Don’t rule it out

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

The 2017 side was able to beat other top 8 sides.

They beat 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th and 7th... Although they were all at home.

The 2025 side has only beaten Brisbane in the top 8 BUT we have a chance to knock off 1st, 4th, 6th and 8th in the run home.

Granted, our losing margins against other top 8 sides currently are 1, 19, 18, 10 and 3 (1 lost at home).

I think this groups ceiling is higher long term, as long as we avoid any extra curricular mental strengthening on the Gold Coast.

Pyke was a smart strategic coach who could match & beat the best opposition coaches.

This is the main factor between the 2 teams as far better coach than Nicks.

 

[John Who]

Don’t rule it out

There’s deluded optimism and then there’s realistic optimism. I don’t think it’s deluded thinking to say we’re still going to improve in the coming months.

The other thing just came to mind is back in 2017 with the injuries to McGovern and Smith, we looked shaky. Now I feel we are in a better position to cover for injuries when it comes to crunch time.

 

[Samcro24]

Don’t rule it out

It’s a good run home, a couple of easy games, a showdown and a handful of top 8 sides.

If we can get a few scalps in the run home, the players might just start to believe. Even if they are home games.

 

[Mr MysteryGuest]

Good thread.

I think the current team has a higher ceiling, I would say it’s already a more dynamic list if not better yet.

 

[pjcrows]

Now I feel we are in a better position to cover for injuries when it comes to crunch time.

Not sure how you could say that. We've barely had any injuries yet haven't bothered to test the depth.

 

[Mr MysteryGuest]

I don't think the peak we reached in 2017 was even that high.

We had one top 4 finish and made one prelim final. I think history has shown the side we had back then was overrated.

True but we were also extremely unlucky not finish top 4 in 2016. We were the first team in history to get to 16 wins and make top 4.

I’m convinced we would have won the premiership that year had we not lost Dangerfield.

 

[WeeBlake]

It’s hard to judge because of history. You look at 2017 key backs and think they’re obviously better but Lever hadn’t get absolutely peaked. Was Talia at his best that year? Can’t remember.

And then Smith, my memory of him is corrupted by recent years. Same with Crouch a bit.

Even with those caveats, my memory is of the 2017 team being genuinely dominant for much of the year. This year’s team has never been at that level.

Anyway, for mine, defence is pretty close. Kpds 2017. Other defenders 2025.

Midfielders also closer than I had thought. Inside mids 2017. Outside mids even.

Ruck - 2017

Forwards is not close. Our forward line crushed it in 2017. Key forwards 2017. Other forwards 2017.

I think a key difference is upside though. In 2017, the players with a lot of upside were Lever, Cameron, And maybe Kelly and Brown. Greenwood? In 2015, it’s TT, Rachele, Curtin, Peatling, Soligo, Max, Worrell, and Keane all well under 100 games. Pedlar the same. That’s a big difference. In time, and with good development and coaching, this side should better than the 2017 side.

 

[John Who]

Not sure how you could say that. We've barely had any injuries yet haven't bothered to test the depth.

Not sure if you’re serious.
We’ve got blokes who are proven consistent AFL standard not currently in the AFL squad

• Murray
• Crouch

Then we have a host of kids/experience who have shown they can do a good job of covering for someone, or thereabouts:

• Jones
• Sholl
• Pedlar
• Nankervis
• Taylor
• Draper
• Bond
• Dowling
• Cook
• Borlase
• Schoenberg

But it isn’t just the reserves players that can come in, it’s also the AFL team itself has more ability to chop and change with flexible players like Curtin, Fog, Dawson, Soligo, Max, Worrell, Rankine, Rachele and etc.

 

[40porpoise]

I think our playing squad is as talented now as it was then. I'd give the edge to our midfield now, but the 2017 forward line was the best the crows have ever had. Tex Jenkins and Eddie all in top form.

And if you add Pyke v Nicks I think its obvious the 2017 squad is better

 

[Huntercrow]

And our midfield in 2017 was one dimensional as well with Brad and Matt Crouch plus Rory Sloane + Hugh Greenwood.

Matt was AA. This was a good midfield who had struck their peak that year.

 

[kirky]

Matt was AA. This was a good midfield who had struck their peak that year.

It was still one dimensional tho.

 

[Cromulant]

It was still one dimensional tho.

It was, but as a pure midfield group its better than what we have now

 

[TubbsFarquhar]

We won't really know for another three years or so. Our current side has a higher ceiling, but 2017, so far, the better floor.

 

[The Smith Revolution]

To me this year is our 2016 year. Finals run, maybe one win one loss. This will be a better team in two years as the loss of Tex smith and laird will only help us improve from right now (lairdy is done). Inferior coach no doubt but with two or three other strong talents we will be better placed than 2017. A true modern big body mid from somewhere would be nice, but then again we haven’t rebuilt through the mids so why start now!!!!

 

[MrBarry]

To me the talent across the park bats deeper this year and a lot of them are younger than the 2017 counter parts.

 

[FR0GGY]

Funfact about the 2 lists in question;

2017 AFC list: 0 top 10 picks
2025 AFC list: 6 top 10 picks

For me based on the 2 sides ceiling's I don't think there's much of an argument. 2025's side still has to reach it, but their potential is much higher for me.

Brad crouch was effectively a top pick was he not?

 

[Cromulant]

Brad crouch was effectively a top pick was he not?

Effectively yes.

 

[Burtonsgottago]

Spud count

2017
Jake Kelly
Rory Atkins
Riley Knight
Kyle Hartigan
David Mackay

2025
Reilly O'Brien
Luke Pedlar/Lachlan Murphy
Brodie Smith (sub)
Rory Laird?

I think we went into the grand final carrying 5 spuds but I'm finding it difficult to assign 5 spuds in our current side, and two of them are just older players that used to be good

As far as our midfield is concerned, our 2017 outside players are absolutely horrible compared to what we have now. We also had quite a one dimensional midfield with basically all being that ground level accumulator grunt type. I think our current midfield is much more dynamic and balanced even if it's not smashing sides or having everyone get 30 touches a game

Struggling to see hoe Pedlar is a spud..

 

[Burtonsgottago]

2025 squad has more talent. 2025 coach not being able to utilise it is what concerns me.

 

[Cromulant]

Struggling to see hoe Pedlar is a spud..

Recent form probably

 

[crows dude]

Brad crouch was effectively a top pick was he not?

Yeh in an open draft he would have been top 5.

 

[StonesThrow]

It’s g bc are to judge because of history. You look at 2017 key backs and think they’re obviously better but Lever hadn’t get absolutely peaked. Was Talia at his best that year? Can’t remember.

And then Smith, my memory of him is corrupted by recent years. Same with Crouch a bit.

Even with those caveats, my memory is of the 2017 team being genuinely dominant for much of the year. This year’s team has never been at that level.

Anyway, for mine, defence is pretty close. Kpds 2017. Other defenders 2025.

Midfielders also closer than I had thought. Inside mids 2017. Outside mids even.

Ruck - 2017

Forwards is not close. Our forward line crushed it in 2017. Key forwards 2017. Other forwards 2017.

I think a key difference is upside though. In 2017, the players with a lot of upside were Lever, Cameron, And maybe Kelly and Brown. Greenwood? In 2015, it’s TT, Rachele, Curtin, Peatling, Soligo, Max, Worrell, and Keane all well under 100 games. Pedlar the same. That’s a big difference. In time, and with good development and coaching, this side should better than the 2017 side.

Smith was good in 2017. Think he was a key omission for us for the rest of the finals campaign.