2018 Draft thread

[briztoon]

Smith certainly feels like a reach to me, and I definitely reckon we could trade back to somewhere like the Bulldogs first pick and Smith would still be on board.

 

[cotter101]

I personally don’t feel Smith at 18 is a reach.

 

[jackess]

I personally don’t feel Smith at 18 is a reach.

Especially when you consider it'll probably end up being pick 21

 

[spotthedog1]

Quality pre draft melt. Taking things to a new level this season.

Quality jackess smugness. Finding new heights yourself.

No melts here. Confusion, sure. I don't see how a pile of more inside players suits our list. If that qualifies as a melt...

 

[jackess]

Quality jackess smugness. Finding new heights yourself.

No melts here. Confusion, sure. I don't see how a pile of more inside players suits our list. If that qualifies as a melt...

A pile of more inside players?

 

[irel]

Well Pie 4 Life I may well owe you an unreserved apology and retraction shortly, if things go the way they're reported. Lions into Ely Smith. That is an odd one... Noble always gets me. He says one thing to supporters, then does another - outside run, pace, and a half back, hey?

Still not sold on Smith - I think if you want to reach for a player, they'd better be in your needs, and I don't see how that fits at all. We're going to end up at Gold Coast style ratio of inside with nothing outside. Bailey looks promising, but otherwise... Not sure what we've got. Cox is probably closer to delisted than recontracted. List getting slower, which is strange given our game style.

Holy shit

 

[WhiteLionFeva]

Quality jackess smugness. Finding new heights yourself.

No melts here. Confusion, sure. I don't see how a pile of more inside players suits our list. If that qualifies as a melt...

He has mentioned speed and run but has always maintained that building midfield depth is our number one priority. Conole too. One more young quality inside mid would be a need in my view. I've seen a bit of Smith because I follow the Bushrangers and North East footy. He certainly answers the inside ball-winner and clearance player need. I would describe him as having a burst mode without any high end speed. But he is strong and plays taller than most mids of his size. I would have thought he was more a late second round pick but clubs are after his type and if our club rates him more highly then that's fine by me. They are the experts.

 

[spotthedog1]

A pile of more inside players?

I tagged Pie4Life in it because it was a continuation of a prior conversation, where I dismissed the AFL Draft Central phantom as lacking awareness of our list, and saying it'd basically never happen. I particularly questioned the pick of Ely Smith at 30, on the grounds that if you take Taylor, and then intend to take McFadyen and Berry later, you're taking a lot of inside ability, despite the fact that the Noble has said multiple times in the media that we're looking for outside run, pace and maybe another half back. And so, with the Lions inviting Smith to the draft, I felt it important that I owned up to the fact that clearly I was wrong to dismiss their phantom as lacking understanding of our list...

That said, I still maintain that with JLyons on the list, we don't need much more inside, and certainly not 3 or 4 of them. I still maintain that our 22 is probably a bit slower than I'd like, particularly as we play an aggressive game style, and a bit of zip would be ideal. Personally, I don't see as much of a need for another half back, but the club have stated that, and I don't think it'd result in a glut. My impression of our list is that we need high quality, look at any sliders (as rated by the club, and I'm happy to acknowledge that that won't always be the same as bigfooty/journalists), and then look for all round mids, and more outside mids.

That is the context of my comment that we don't really need a pile of inside players.

 

[Fatcat08]

Quality pre draft melt. Taking things to a new level this season.

How is that even remotely a melt? I know you enjoy being a contrarion to everything but I don't think making up things that clearly arent true qualifies. Why not actually go into some detail about why you have issue with it rather than just some short baseless snark attack. I mean why bother posting the above at all?

What he says isn't wide of the mark, we have said during the year we're looking for some speed, run and carry and Smith isn't really that type of player, despite having those athletic traits. Sure we haven't picked him up yet so there's an element of assumption, but we're clearly considering him if we've requested he be there on the first night, even if we don't take him. I think its pretty reasonable what he said, and there wasn't any melting, just a clearly thought out post showing some concern and how what we appear to be doing isn't really what most would think we need. Now it may all be moot pending our actual selection but its hardly a melt.

I don't personally agree with the Cox part, I feel like our recent necessity in having to play early draftees, and the success of this with Clug, berry, Rayner and even Bailey has resulted in us thinking its more the majority rather than the exception and that going forward it may be 3-4 years before we have to start seeing consistent output from teenagers. This is a good thing and more than anything would signify that we are starting to get our list sorted out.

 

[spotthedog1]

I don't personally agree with the Cox part, I feel like our recent necessity in having to play early draftees, and the success of this with Clug, berry, Rayner and even Bailey has resulted in us thinking its more the majority rather than the exception and that going forward it may be 3-4 years before we have to start seeing consistent output from teenagers. This is a good thing and more than anything would signify that we are starting to get our list sorted out.

Cheers mate.

Cox is an interesting one. Agree with you about the 3-4 years, and that could well be a factor here - he could well be a slow burn, but worthwhile when he comes along. I'm not writing him off, but if it were up to me to either recontract or delist, at this stage I don't think we've seen enough to justify more years. That said, the club know what they're doing in that sphere, and I'll be perfectly happy to admit I was wrong if Cox cements himself in the 22. Would love his skills in our list if he can acclimatise to the pace of the game.

 

[jackess]

How is that even remotely a melt? I know you enjoy being a contrarion to everything but I don't think making up things that clearly arent true qualifies. Why not actually go into some detail about why you have issue with it rather than just some short baseless snark attack. I mean why bother posting the above at all?

What he says isn't wide of the mark, we have said during the year we're looking for some speed, run and carry and Smith isn't really that type of player, despite having those athletic traits. Sure we haven't picked him up yet so there's an element of assumption, but we're clearly considering him if we've requested he be there on the first night, even if we don't take him. I think its pretty reasonable what he said, and there wasn't any melting, just a clearly thought out post showing some concern and how what we appear to be doing isn't really what most would think we need. Now it may all be moot pending our actual selection but its hardly a melt.

I don't personally agree with the Cox part, I feel like our recent necessity in having to play early draftees, and the success of this with Clug, berry, Rayner and even Bailey has resulted in us thinking its more the majority rather than the exception and that going forward it may be 3-4 years before we have to start seeing consistent output from teenagers. This is a good thing and more than anything would signify that we are starting to get our list sorted out.

Contrarian? I’m not the one taking issue with the club going back on it’s word by taking all inside mids in a draft that hasn’t happened yet?

On top of not knowing much about the players or the reasons for drafting them or not knowing what type of footballer they’ll end up like.

 

[spotthedog1]

Contrarian? I’m not the one taking issue with the club going back on it’s word by taking all inside mids in a draft that hasn’t happened yet?

Yeah, that's not what happened.

On top of not knowing much about the players or the reasons for drafting them or not knowing what type of footballer they’ll end up like.

However I'm quite happy to admit that this section is entirely true. Not even slightly claiming to be an expert - in fact, the post you started your critique with was me conceding to the superior knowledge of others.

 

[Lace Out]

Who is Cherny?

https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/2018-afl-draft-first-round-predictions-20181121-p50hhl.html

 

[Fatcat08]

I also have to wonder if Baileys end of season trial down back may have shifted our thinking slightly on where we prioritise our picks this year, as well as where the strengths in the draft lie next year as far as type of player goes, along with who we are having discussions with from a trade/fa point of view. There's so many unknowns when you start looking at all the factors. I also think that who we're picking now isn't for the next 2-3 years, its more from the perspective of our list in 4-5 years time. What I don't mind about all those bigger inside guys is the fact they have good athletic qualities, even if it doesn't quite show up on tape. That makes them a bit different from some of the more inside mids that we currently have in Lyons, Matho and Keays and increases their ability to take on different roles in the side as well.

FWIW in my very amateurish opinion I see McFadyen in a more half forward/mid split role as I think he's looked quite dangerous in that role this year. Rotating him and Rayner in 5-6 years time through that sort of role gives some good size and marking ability should he continue to develop.

 

[WhiteLionFeva]

I feel pre-emptively sorry for any young kid who may be invited to tonight's first round of the draft with his family and friends and is not selected in the first round.

 

[WhiteLionFeva]

https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/2018-afl-draft-first-round-predictions-20181121-p50hhl.html

Very much a "Brisbane want a mid and he's still available" call.

 

[Fatcat08]

Contrarian? I’m not the one taking issue with the club going back on it’s word by taking all inside mids in a draft that hasn’t happened yet?

On top of not knowing much about the players or the reasons for drafting them or not knowing what type of footballer they’ll end up like.

Thats not what the post was about, stop trying to make something that was a reasonable line of questioning more dramatic than it was. And yes you have a long history of just going against whatever someone else is saying with small one or two line pokes without really expressing your own detailed thoughts on a matter, you rarely explain why, it seems you enjoy just going against what others are saying.

 

[MSB ROYS]

Drafting Day part one has finally arrived. Looking forward to seeing who is headed our way.

 

[jackess]

Thats not what the post was about, stop trying to make something that was a reasonable line of questioning more dramatic than it was. And yes you have a long history of just going against whatever someone else is saying with small one or two line pokes without really expressing your own detailed thoughts on a matter, you rarely explain why, it seems you enjoy just going against what others are saying.

If you don’t think spotthedogs post was irrational and emotionally driven then you clearly spend way too much time on this forum.

We’re worried because this draft might make Keays, Matho and CLyons surplus to requirements?

Never heard of anything more ridiculous.

 

[Simba Moyo]

We've had issues with clearances and contested ball for years, so I'd be more than happy picking up someone with really quick, clean hands like Ely Smith. Looks to have a decent burst of speed and a good leap too so he's got a couple of tricks

 

[jackess]

If you want to quote Noble; how about this one from last year

“You draft for talent and trade for needs.”

http://www.lions.com.au/news/2017-10-12/noble-draft-for-talent-trade-for-needs

Clearly things are never as black and white as this though

 

[Brizzys Squizzy]

A few posts about what noble has said in past interviews about outside run and half back run which is totally true but that was only some of the interview particularly the one on sen 1116 after trade period where he also mentions going to draft and adding to the midfield with another contested player or maybe 2 depending obviously what's available.

 

[spotthedog1]

Interesting thought - I was thinking about how 30+35 may get us one pick plus McFadyen. Wouldn't surprise me to see them packaged up for one up, one down. Get an earlier pick for someone we like, and then have a later one for points matching.

GWS hold 19, 25, 52.

I thought it could be 30+35 for 25+52. But given the pushback of picks, possible we've got higher aims?

19 + 52 will be around 22 + 50.
30 + 35 will be around 33 + 38.

Probably doesn't work out for picks, but could be the club do something like 30+35+2019R3 for 19+52 if they like someone like Ely Smith, and think another club could take him before our next pick.

Then we'd have 18, 19, and picks for McFadyen and others (Berry, Answerth, Coleman et al).

 

[spotthedog1]

A few posts about what noble has said in past interviews about outside run and half back run which is totally true but that was only some of the interview particularly the one on sen 1116 after trade period where he also mentions going to draft and adding to the midfield with another contested player or maybe 2 depending obviously what's available.

A few journos now, including Twomey, have us targeting "big bodied midfielders", which is usually code for insiders. One, maybe two - fair enough - particularly if we have decided we want Berry, who is inside, but has the pace to go for a run too. Gotta have some balance though. Depth is a positive, for sure, and there's an element of best available, though I believe the club often bank together a few prospects as "around the same mark", just subject to what else we have/need.

 

[WhiteLionFeva]

The apparent emphasis in recent drafts on inside players is really just a confirmation that the fundamentals of football haven't changed all that much over its history. The team that gets first hands on the ball consistently generally wins the contest.