List Mgmt. 2018 Draft/Trade/FA Thread

[Peel67skin]

VFL TEAM OF THE YEAR (Only VFL listed players eligible)

B: Marty Hore (Collingwood), Lucas Cook (Port Melbourne), James Tsitas (Geelong)

HB: Brett Bewley (Williamstown), Sam Collins (Werribee), Aaron Heppell (Essendon)

C: Nick Hind (Essendon), Michael Gibbons (Williamstown), Will Hayes (Footscray)

HF: Eli Templeton (Port Melbourne), Jesse Palmer (Northern Blues), Corey Rich (Frankston)

F: Ben Cavarra (Williamstown), Jordan Lisle (Port Melbourne), Danny Younan (Essendon)

FOLL: Nick Meese (Williamstown), Tom Atkins (Geelong), Tom Gribble (Werribee)

I/C: Marcus Lentini (Coburg), Corey Wagner (Casey), Brede Seccull (Sandringham), Angus Monfries (Footscray), Jay Lockhart (Casey), Tom O’Sullivan (Port Melbourne)

COACH: Jade Rawlings (Casey

 

[THE_GUN]

Miles & Gibbons joint winners JJ Liston

Both Boys had great years

 

[Sun Stormer]

Thoughts on Mitchell hibberd

None.....not good enough.

 

[Iva Bigun]

So Dew wants us to turn into a group of utility players. Awesome they can be just a little less effective in each of their roles than dedicated players

As for Hall and KK sounds like a fire sale, “get your Suns here, red hot Suns going cheap, no offer too small”

 

[ProgUbud13]

And big Defender Sam Collins 3rd

 

[Sunny_]

My own two cents on the guys we've been linked to:

Jake Lloyd: Tom Morris on the couch said we have offered him about 650k/yr over four years. He's on 500k at the moment at Sydney. I would look at him because it gives us more flexibility to play Lachie Weller and Jack Bowes up the ground. There's a place for him there, but I don't want to be paying him quite that much. I guess you have to overpay these guys to get them to us. 500k is what his value is.

George Horlin-Smith: I actually really like him and always have. IMO he's the quintessential hard worker guy from a successful club that we should target. Perhaps what makes him most attractive as a player is that he can play both inside and outside.

Anthony Miles: I don't understand why we're interested given we have a line of inside mids already. By all reports is a fantastic clubman, awesome trainer and good for the young guys to learn off of. But if we're getting him that means that we intend to play him - and he's 100% inside mid. Who does he replace? Brodie? Surely not. Do we put Touk Miller back up forward so he can play that pressure role he did in his first year? Swallow more outside to save his body? I just don't really get it from a positional point of view. Certainly he ticks every other box.

Brendan Whitecross: Like him - think he could play a good leadership role for us in the forward line. Can probably get him for a packet of chips.

Marlion Pickett: Easily the best state mid in the game right now given his combination of strength, skills and speed. There would be ~6 clubs wanting to get him after his electric finals campaign. I have some concern over our ability to keep him here given he has a young family, but he makes us a better side easily. Hopefully we get some priority access to him.

Sam Collins: Really like him as a third tall option. I think the idea will be that he replaces KK as that intercepting/rebounding defender. The numbers speak for themselves really. If he and Pickett are available I think we get them. I wouldn't be adverse to pulling the trigger early on in the draft either if we have to.

Other guys I like:

I really like Josh Corbett as an option for us in the forward line. Fantastic contested mark and still quite young. We lack contested marking power and I think he suits.

Mitch Maquire I also really like, but I'm not sure where he plays at AFL level. But I think with guys like that you just get them in to prove themselves.

 

[17er]

Would be interested in your opinion on what would be the better deal thats actually able to get done, Realistically

I'm afraid Graham would be the central piece in the deal or else picks 1 and 2 this year and next year unless the Blues will take some fringe players from the Suns and Tigers. Hall is a player you'd imagine the Blues would be interested in and there are a number of ways the Tigers could package players and picks to further make it worth Carlton's while to agree to trade out of pick #1. If that is pick #18 and #36 this year and similar next year, then the Tigers' draft capital is decimated. That is why I'd suggest players and picks. Richmond could always demand Lynch and a couple of dinky late picks, but would have to offer up a lot with Carlton dangling pick #1 and the Suns trading hard on Lynch.

Your comments on Lynch walking in free agency for a compo pick are all well and good, but as other posters repeatedly point out to you - it suits Richmond ten times more than it satisfies the Suns. In fact, it sets a dangerous precedent with the Suns foundation players with Unrestricted Free Agency for the first time. So rather than smooth sailing for the Tigers Dynasty, I think you should be prepared for a fight because in a trade you are gonna lose some paint and take some hits.

 

[17er]

Anthony Miles: I don't understand why we're interested given we have a line of inside mids already. By all reports is a fantastic clubman, awesome trainer and good for the young guys to learn off of. But if we're getting him that means that we intend to play him - and he's 100% inside mid. Who does he replace? Brodie? Surely not. Do we put Touk Miller back up forward so he can play that pressure role he did in his first year? Swallow more outside to save his body? I just don't really get it from a positional point of view. Certainly he ticks every other box.

Brendan Whitecross: Like him - think he could play a good leadership role for us in the forward line. Can probably get him for a packet of chips.

Miles has already visited the club, so if a deal is likely to come for any of these guys you'd have to say he's one of the most likely. Agree about the inside midfield issue, but Miles isn't a marquee signing, he's being brought in as a depth player and an alternative. I like your suggestion of playing Swallow more outside, but I'd also play him forward where he can do a lot of damage and hit the scoreboard. Dew needs to find a plan B for Touk because when he isn't tagging or doesn't have a good match up, the game seems to go past him. Love Touk, but if our midfield is to improve with him in it maybe he needs to go forward as you recommend.

In fact, in the first Carlton game, all the midfielders inside and out ended up rotating through the forward line, leading to Martin, Lyons, MacPherson, Joyce, Sexton and Ainsworth getting amongst the goals, behind and goal assists. It was a beautiful game plan that fell apart against Freo after Hanley was injured, and was also unpicked in the first Lions game after Darcy broke his leg. Perhaps having Miles gives options like this?

Did you know Brendan Whitecross is a Queenslander? Has to be one of the most desperately unlucky players to miss a Premiership given he debuted the year after the Hawks 2008 Flag, missing the 2012 GF after doing an ACL in the finals, then coming back the next year only to do his ACL again in the prelim and missed the whole 2014 season. Hasn't been the same since, but he has played over 100 games and been a valuable depth player for the Hawks. Bring him home!

 

[Scotty_222]

Miles has already visited the club, so if a deal is likely to come for any of these guys you'd have to say he's one of the most likely. Agree about the inside midfield issue, but Miles isn't a marquee signing, he's being brought in as a depth player and an alternative. I like your suggestion of playing Swallow more outside, but I'd also play him forward where he can do a lot of damage and hit the scoreboard. Dew needs to find a plan B for Touk because when he isn't tagging or doesn't have a good match up, the game seems to go past him. Love Touk, but if our midfield is to improve with him in it maybe he needs to go forward as you recommend.

In fact, in the first Carlton game, all the midfielders inside and out ended up rotating through the forward line, leading to Martin, Lyons, MacPherson, Joyce, Sexton and Ainsworth getting amongst the goals, behind and goal assists. It was a beautiful game plan that fell apart against Freo after Hanley was injured, and was also unpicked in the first Lions game after Darcy broke his leg. Perhaps having Miles gives options like this?

Did you know Brendan Whitecross is a Queenslander? Has to be one of the most desperately unlucky players to miss a Premiership given he debuted the year after the Hawks 2008 Flag, missing the 2012 GF after doing an ACL in the finals, then coming back the next year only to do his ACL again in the prelim and missed the whole 2014 season. Hasn't been the same since, but he has played over 100 games and been a valuable depth player for the Hawks. Bring him home!

I think you’re jumping the gun on miles.

 

[17er]

Let me interpret some of this:

“With our chat with Hally it’s let’s just see what the next month brings. He is probably weighing up if he needs a change and we might be weighing up where Hally fits in our system. I think that will play out in the next month.

We don't want him and we are posturing that we would even consider it to try to get something for him in a trade

“Kade is probably a little similar to Hally. We are working out where he fits in our system and having a look at what our list looks like going forward. He is out of contract and we are in constant dialogue with him. We will get to Kade as quickly as we can around where he sits and where his future lies.”

Kade just got compared to Hall - WTF??

Did you listen to the podcast? The questions were all given to Dew in advance and he answered them in coach speak. He might not want Hally and you might not want him, but he's not going to go on the record bagging his own player when in a month he's going to try sell the same guy for as much as he can get in return.

With Kade, the context was that he's also coming out contract, had an injury interrupted season and, like Hall, probably isn't in the Top 22 players but gets paid like one. Could be tradebait. They are also both Tasmanians, so perhaps they've had attention from North and/or Tassie?

 

[17er]

I think you’re jumping the gun on miles.

I was referring to the list Sunny made as the most likely, but by no means a certainty, mainly because of his confirmed visit while his club is still in contention and he's an outside chance of playing in the GF should injury strike.

Who do you think we should sign or are you suggesting Miles isn't interested?

 

[17er]

So Dew wants us to turn into a group of utility players. Awesome they can be just a little less effective in each of their roles than dedicated players

As for Hall and KK sounds like a fire sale, “get your Suns here, red hot Suns going cheap, no offer too small”

I actually thought he was pretty diplomatic. He signalled that Hall was weighing his options and the club was reassessing the list, then he said Kade was in the same situation. That doesn't scream fire sale at all, they were simply replies to direct questions. The Interviewer was pretty well prepared and Dew didn't bat away awkward questions, he answered them in a frank and honest way that was respectful of the process.

I think a lot of the context is lost when you just read excerpts of a transcripts from a 30 minute interview.

 

[thurls64]

My own two cents on the guys we've been linked to:

Jake Lloyd: Tom Morris on the couch said we have offered him about 650k/yr over four years. He's on 500k at the moment at Sydney. I would look at him because it gives us more flexibility to play Lachie Weller and Jack Bowes up the ground. There's a place for him there, but I don't want to be paying him quite that much. I guess you have to overpay these guys to get them to us. 500k is what his value is.

George Horlin-Smith: I actually really like him and always have. IMO he's the quintessential hard worker guy from a successful club that we should target. Perhaps what makes him most attractive as a player is that he can play both inside and outside.

Anthony Miles: I don't understand why we're interested given we have a line of inside mids already. By all reports is a fantastic clubman, awesome trainer and good for the young guys to learn off of. But if we're getting him that means that we intend to play him - and he's 100% inside mid. Who does he replace? Brodie? Surely not. Do we put Touk Miller back up forward so he can play that pressure role he did in his first year? Swallow more outside to save his body? I just don't really get it from a positional point of view. Certainly he ticks every other box.

Brendan Whitecross: Like him - think he could play a good leadership role for us in the forward line. Can probably get him for a packet of chips.

Marlion Pickett: Easily the best state mid in the game right now given his combination of strength, skills and speed. There would be ~6 clubs wanting to get him after his electric finals campaign. I have some concern over our ability to keep him here given he has a young family, but he makes us a better side easily. Hopefully we get some priority access to him.

Sam Collins: Really like him as a third tall option. I think the idea will be that he replaces KK as that intercepting/rebounding defender. The numbers speak for themselves really. If he and Pickett are available I think we get them. I wouldn't be adverse to pulling the trigger early on in the draft either if we have to.

Other guys I like:

I really like Josh Corbett as an option for us in the forward line. Fantastic contested mark and still quite young. We lack contested marking power and I think he suits.

Mitch Maquire I also really like, but I'm not sure where he plays at AFL level. But I think with guys like that you just get them in to prove themselves.

who has us linked to Whitecross? I haven't heard this for 2019? I would take him I just havent heard this before?

 

[Mego Red]

Makes sense for Fremantle to push for pick 1 from Carlton if Brisbane do sign Neale due to KPF still being their biggest issue.

Fremanle
IN: Pick 1
OUT: Lachie Neale, Future second

Brisbane
IN: Lachie Neale
OUT: Pick 4, Pick 22

Carlton
IN: Pick 4, Mitch McGovern
OUT: Pick 1

Adelaide
IN: Pick 22, Future Second (Fre)
OUT: Mitch McGovern

Adelaide if they were desperate for rankine could then offer

7, 12, 22 for pick 3 and 21 from the saints.

That is the worst thing I've ever read on the internet.

 

[Mego Red]

Crows in particular will try trade up to get the local boys. They a froffing for Lukosius and Rankine. I think it's safe to say Lukosius won't happen for them. But they haven't given up hope of trading up for Rankine. Word here is there may be a few more following McGovern out the door so that may be their way of trading up and still potentially getting Rozee with their current pick.

There's no one else following McGovern out the door.

Even McGovern may not be heading out that door, unless we get a trade that works for us.

 

[Mego Red]

I think you selling Mitch short with two second Rd pick .

There's zero chance he's traded for anything close to as terrible as that.

His tradable return needs to be between 5 and 9.

 

[Scotty_222]

I was referring to the list Sunny made as the most likely, but by no means a certainty, mainly because of his confirmed visit while his club is still in contention and he's an outside chance of playing in the GF should injury strike.

Who do you think we should sign or are you suggesting Miles isn't interested?

Sorry I tagged the wrong person
Mine was directed at Peel67skin, saying we are in line to snap him up.

 

[17er]

who has us linked to Whitecross? I haven't heard this for 2019? I would take him I just havent heard this before?

He's a Queenslander, therefore, linked to the Lions and Suns since before he was drafted. I even put his name up either here or another Suns page and was flamed by all and sundry. Agree that he would be an asset.

 

[SnusCG]

That is the worst thing I've ever read on the internet.

How?
McGovern for 2 picks in the early 20's is probably over his value. he's not going to fetch you a top 10 pick unless you give something else back.
and
If you want to get pick 1, 2 or 3 you're going to need to offer 7 + melbourne's first (currently 14) + potentially more depending on where Melbourne's first ends up

the scenario at the bottom I agree is probably overs, but it really does depend on how much your club wants Rankine or Lukosius.

 

[Crow till I die]

How?
McGovern for 2 picks in the early 20's is probably over his value. he's not going to fetch you a top 10 pick unless you give something else back.
and
If you want to get pick 1, 2 or 3 you're going to need to offer 7 + melbourne's first (currently 14) + potentially more depending on where Melbourne's first ends up

the scenario at the bottom I agree is probably overs, but it really does depend on how much your club wants Rankine or Lukosius.

For our pick 7 & the melbourne pick for your pick 2 (maybe even also downgrading our pick 19 for one of your early 2nd rounders) may work ok..particularly if Carlton get a mid 1st round PP that we can get along with a 2nd rounder for MM.

 

[SnusCG]

For our pick 7 & the melbourne pick for your pick 2 (maybe even also downgrading our pick 19 for one of your early 2nd rounders) may work ok..particularly if Carlton get a mid 1st round PP that we can get along with a 2nd rounder for MM.

As far as face value goes that trade works well enough but we don’t have enough list spots to work with that. Head recruiter + coach has already said we’re going to take pick 2 + 3 (if we take it) to the draft. Looks likely as well that we’ll take Lukosius if there. Apparently Craig Cameron is really into him.

 

[Crow till I die]

As far as face value goes that trade works well enough but we don’t have enough list spots to work with that. Head recruiter + coach has already said we’re going to take pick 2 + 3 (if we take it) to the draft. Looks likely as well that we’ll take Lukosius if there. Apparently Craig Cameron is really into him.

Fair enough..you have options for sure as a club going forward. I do wonder though if you could extract a good draft haul for one of those top picks from the crows if then you could seriously go after some top end players from other clubs with a few of those 1st round picks whilst maintaining a good presence in the draft also? It would balance the need to bring in draft talent with bringing in some very good players to help now and going forward

 

[Fat Pizza]

Fair enough..you have options for sure as a club going forward. I do wonder though if you could extract a good draft haul for one of those top picks from the crows if then you could seriously go after some top end players from other clubs with a few of those 1st round picks whilst maintaining a good presence in the draft also? It would balance the need to bring in draft talent with bringing in some very good players to help now and going forward

Who are these top end players from other clubs that want to play for the SUNS?

 

[SnusCG]

Fair enough..you have options for sure as a club going forward. I do wonder though if you could extract a good draft haul for one of those top picks from the crows if then you could seriously go after some top end players from other clubs with a few of those 1st round picks whilst maintaining a good presence in the draft also? It would balance the need to bring in draft talent with bringing in some very good players to help now and going forward

The issue with that as a Qld team is that:
1. Players aren't willing to move up unless you're offering them ridiculous money. Which we don't want to do.
2. Contracted players wanting to move to the GC often means we get bent over in the trade: ie. Weller for 2 when we had pick 18 and WCE 2018 first on the table as well
3. There simply isn't enough Qld, or rather quality Qld players in the competition yet for us to chase after with any 'go-home' pull.

The way I think most see our draft/trade period going is with about 6/7 list spots available, taking pick 2, 3, 17 and using them on the best junior talent. mature age drafting and rookie drafting a few solid VFL/SANFL/WAFL players with later picks. This, plus trading for a few mature players that could add competitive depth like Miles, Townsend and Horlin-Smith for nothing picks like 5th/6th round picks

 

[Bazza37]

Agreed. Really is just about keeping them here though.

As much as we dislike Clayton for the way he handled our list, a full team of

Harbrow - May - Saad
Weller - Thompson - Hanley
Hall - Prestia - Bennell
Wright - Lynch - Caddy
Ainsworth - Dixon - Martin

Witts - Ablett - O'Meara

Swallow, Fiorini, Day, Bowes

Would have been hard to beat. Disappointing it never eventuated but if we can keep our current list together it is looking up

B grade talent scout
Absolutely no idea how to MANAGE a list



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