List Mgmt. 2018 Draft/Trade/FA Thread

[Cochblocked]

As much as i dislike signing Lemmens and schoenfeld for 3 years I can’t see how that would effect salary cap when we don’t know what they are on.

Most likely they were back ended for when they (hopefully) show something.

 

[Deleted member 2402071]

I wonder if Kolodjashnij’s fate rests on Newman coming aboard.

And likewise Lonergan waiting on Horlin-Smith or Miles?

And Leslie on Collins?

All similar players but does it help clear cap to swap them if our current guys are well overpaid for their current output?

 

[SandyToes]

Whatever Kolodjashnij's being paid I guarantee its too much

 

[Sunny_]

IIRC KK re-signed when he was at the peak of his form with us, so I wouldn't be surprised to see him on 500k.

I have grave doubts if he will ever get to that level again. If he has the best chance to get there without us I'd be happy to see him go and get there through a change of scenery. And in doing that we get half a mill off the books.

We have a long line of guys who can play that role. Ballard is one (though hopefully will move to a wing later in his career), but we also have Scrimshaw and probably Collins coming in who plays that exact same role. And maybe even Wigg?

I suspect if we get Newman it will be to play inside/outside mid. That's where Dew likes to play him.

 

[SandyToes]

Does anyone know what these "injury payments" alluded to in the podcast are.
Did I hear right if they say it's match payments +20%?
Surely not but if that's the case, then there's our salary cap issues right there

 

[SandyToes]

IIRC KK re-signed when he was at the peak of his form with us, so I wouldn't be surprised to see him on 500k.

I reckon more Sunny- that's what I was meaning

 

[17er]

The AFL Salary Cap is $12.45 million. Lynch takes $1 million of that. Rischitelli will be taking a huge pay cut. Rosa's salary comes off the top, as does Barlow's. Spencer, Jaska, and Willis represents a zero sum total difference because they will be replaced by rookies on the same or less money. That's about $3 million right there and it is still early days as to how many players will be cleaned out. Replacing these 7 contracts will cost between $600 and $700K.

"First-round draft pick players will have a set wage of $88,000 in their first year of play and rookies will get at least $71,500 while the minimum salary for anyone in their second year in the League has been set at $100,000."

The Suns had ballooning salary costs in 2018 due to carrying part of Ablett's salary and paying a replacement player, for argument's sake, Aaron Young, which is a significant amount that wasn't factored in when Ablett's contract was signed. Putting the 2016 top 10ers on 4 year contracts at above average money won't have broken the bank, but most guys in their draft class would only now be negotiating their pay rises.

What could be causing some contractual difficulties for ALL clubs in the EBA signed last year.

"AFL players will receive a 20 per cent pay rise this season after agreeing to a new six-year deal with the league worth $1.84 billion that ties their wages to competition revenue for the first time.

The changes will see the average player salary increase from $309,000 last year to $371,000 this season.

The players will receive 28 per cent projected AFL revenue, minus some exclusions. They will also get an additional share of forecast revenue from the AFL and the clubs.

The six-year deal will see players' earnings increased by:

• 20 per cent in 2017
• 1.2 per cent in 2018
• 1.3 per cent in 2019
• 2 per cent each year in 2020-22

Club salary caps will rise from $10.3 million to $12.4 million next season, giving some the wiggle room to chase a big name player in the off-season.

The pay increase will come into effect immediately for players who have a clause in their current contract tying their wage to the bargaining agreement, which is about 50 per cent of them."

If the Cap issues stem from the fact that more than half of Suns players have this clause in their contracts then a 20% pay rise with immediate effect would have hit harder than other clubs with fewer players with this clause. Who would know about how many players got immediate pay rises? The player managers Jon Ralph is referencing would have a reasonable idea, yet it remains idle speculation. In any case, all the players have their massive pay increases, with another 2.5% over this season and the next, which doesn't sound like a lot, boss none of us would say no to that kind of pay rise and I suspect none of us is on $370K. $5K a year multiplied by the 45 players is around $230K extra, not much but enough to mess the figures around because it can't be avoided.

The bullshit offered up by Jon Ralph is all hidden behind paywalls, which are another way for rumour and innuendo to spread because people don't like to let little things like facts get in the way. Nobody has accused the Suns of Salary Cap breaches because that would be slander, but without having gone over the Cap there is no way in the world the Suns can be in dire trouble with the 2019 Cap. Clubs are allowed to go over/under in player payments by 105%/95% so even if there is a shred of truth in the story there are simple methods of backdating contracts to stay within this zone going forward.

If the Suns are entering a year with a restricted Salary Cap it is due to the factors that I mentioned - paying part of Ablett's salary while having to pay a replacement player, paying more players their early 20% entitlement than the League average, plus accommodating the 2016 top 10ers with inflated salaries. Again, this is solvable by moving on some underperforming players, preferably via trades to get fair value for them, but News Corp has been waging a war on the Suns for years now and no doubt they have confected this story in order to cause maximum damage to the Suns by implying that the Suns will be forced to delist uncontracted players, thus taking away their trade value entirely.

 

[17er]

I wonder if Kolodjashnij’s fate rests on Newman coming aboard.

And likewise Lonergan waiting on Horlin-Smith or Miles?

And Leslie on Collins?

All similar players but does it help clear cap to swap them if our current guys are well overpaid for their current output?

I wouldn't say directly, as in trying to clear their salaries, nor would I say it is like for like because the 3 Suns players you've named are 1st round talents who have under achieved whereas the others are just underachievers. The Media is promoting a firesale mentality in order to devalue these guys at the trading block. Why would a club spend draft picks on them if they were going to be delisted anyway? The replacements that the Suns do end up signing or drafting will be cheaper than the names you've mentioned, but it is draft capital the Suns need not money.

 

[Scotty_222]

I wouldn't say directly, as in trying to clear their salaries, nor would I say it is like for like because the 3 Suns players you've named are 1st round talents who have under achieved whereas the others are just underachievers. The Media is promoting a firesale mentality in order to devalue these guys at the trading block. Why would a club spend draft picks on them if they were going to be delisted anyway? The replacements that the Suns do end up signing or drafting will be cheaper than the names you've mentioned, but it is draft capital the Suns need not money.

Do you work? The effort you put into these posts lol, must take up a bit of your day. It’s good though..

 

[17er]

Do you work? The effort you put into these posts lol, must take up a bit of your day. It’s good though..

Yeah, I work. I'm also a full time sole parent, so I spend a bit more time at home than the average bloke. I have read most of the stuff written about the Suns in the media and know how to sort the wheat from the chaff.
Greg Denham wrote this amazing article that just shuts down 90% of the crap that gets written about the Suns.
https://www.theaustralian.com.au/sp...s/news-story/da3504cd70970727561d5a3048625b51

I am a lot more interested in getting to the bottom of what is really going on. I used to be interested in journalism, but growing up in one newspaper towns like Brizzy and the GC then living in Melbourne where the media perspectives are far more varied instead of being owned by the same person showed me that such a pursuit would be pointless for me. I'd tell the Editor to get stuffed on my first day, especially if they were telling me to do the Andrew Hamilton type pieces that get plastered all over these pages.

 

[kreglze]

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2018/09/13/report-third-swan-set-to-depart/

Newman looking more likely.

With those 3 leaving the Swans I reckon Lloyd almost a certainty to stay now.

 

[David C]

Depend on how you want to pick the team , you can pick up Hugh Goddard , Brendon goddard (I Myself dont want him but use as an eg) and Kieran Collins (DFA) as temporary replacement ,

Also North delisted Daniel Nielson only because they have too many KPD, he should get picked up by a second club I would have thought.

 

[Peel67skin]

Rumours

 

[kreglze]

That would be fine IMO Rozee isn't a massive reach at 3.

 

[Peel67skin]

Possible trade in
1) Anthony Miles
2) George Hollier Smith
3) Newman

Mature age
1) Sam Collins
2) Marlion Pickett

 

[gcsunsfc]

If we're targeting lukosius (pick 2) and rozee would anyone here be willing to trade 3 for Adelaides 7 and 12?
Risks a Clayton Oliver **** up but could nab us another first round pick?
Surely Adelaide would jump at the chance to get Rankine.

 

[Cochblocked]

If we're targeting lukosius (pick 2) and rozee would anyone here be willing to trade 3 for Adelaides 7 and 12?
Risks a Clayton Oliver **** up but could nab us another first round pick?
Surely Adelaide would jump at the chance to get Rankine.

Think you answered you question. Not worth risking again

 

[17er]

https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/af...o/news-story/c253caae1689f69332276a06b29d5518
THE Gold Coast Suns are considering using their first two picks in November’s national draft to pair a star South Australian duo in order to help curb the club’s retention issues.

Foxfooty.com.au understands the club will consider pairing key forward Jack Lukosius and midfielder Connor Rozee, who have been mates since they were 12 years old.

Suns should bundle up picks to get the Saints pick and have 3 picks in a row to get all 3 South Australians, Lukosius, Rozee and Rankine. List space is the only current problem the Suns have with relation to the number of picks, so it makes sense to trade up, especially considering that the club will be trying to offload some players in exchange for even more draft picks. Going all in for another high pick means the Suns then only need to have enough picks left for matching bids on Academy players in the 2nd and 3rd. I'd like to see the team try to improve the position of both the WC pick and the
Priority Pick, but if bundling them together with a 3rd rounder is the price for pick 3 then it could work out in the Suns favour given there could be as many as 3 Academy players they want to take later and for 6 players to be drafted another 4 senior list spots need to be vacated via trade or delisting (players can be re-rookied). Any extra draft pick late in the Draft can be traded for future picks.

The draft haul might look something like:
2. Lukosius
3. Rankine
4. Rozee
51. Scott*
55. Koenen*
58. Graham*

Couple of unneeded 2nd rounders traded for future picks
*these are their NEAFL numbers, but the likely order and possible rank of selections

 

[gcsunsfc]

11. Connor Rozee (SA)
Best position: General forward/outside midfield
Height, weight: 185cm, 72kg
Recruited from: North Adelaide
Projected draft range: 5-20
Plays like: Dale Thomas
Rationale: Damaging forward who also applies impressive forward pressure. Rises due to solid SANFL League performances.
July Ranking: 14
Strengths:
Skills
Vision
Kicking inside 50m
Finishing around goal
Sticky hands overhead
Freakish at ground level
Acceleration
Breaks the lines
Agility
Leap
Change of direction
Pressures the ball carrier
Forward pressure
Tackling
Overhead marking
Impacts games as a forward and midfielder
Clean at ground level
Weaknesses:
Stoppage work
Strength



Nightmares assessment of Rozee.
Certainly sounds like an asset
Just watching his youtube highlights from the 18's tournament he looks athletic, quick twitch, quick jumper, change of direction with vigour
Nice kick

Seems like a very nice player.
Jack martin-esque

 

[17er]

If we're targeting lukosius (pick 2) and rozee would anyone here be willing to trade 3 for Adelaides 7 and 12?
Risks a Clayton Oliver **** up but could nab us another first round pick?
Surely Adelaide would jump at the chance to get Rankine.

A few things need to settle down before the Suns can start to fiddle with their Draft strategy.

First of all, Bailey Scott's decision could influence how many 1st round players the Suns decide to target. If he nominates the Suns, then I reckon we go all in to make our 3rd pick as high as possible, then leave enough late picks for our Academy players.

However, if Scott decides to go to North or Geelong, I think the strategy needs to be 4 top 10 picks selecting best player available. There's a small chance the Priority Pick comes in at #1 given that the Suns have a compelling case for being awarded a pick that high, while Carlton have a number of factors going against them for any priority pick at all. Moderate chance of a mid-round pick at #11 as a Priority Pick, which has been acknowledged by AFL honchos as a consideration. High chance of after 1st rounder because the other 17 teams would have an Eddie Mcguire sized sook.

Assuming the Suns take pick #3 for Lynch as compo, otherwise all bets are off.

 

[Peel67skin]

A few things need to settle down before the Suns can start to fiddle with their Draft strategy.

First of all, Bailey Scott's decision could influence how many 1st round players the Suns decide to target. If he nominates the Suns, then I reckon we go all in to make our 3rd pick as high as possible, then leave enough late picks for our Academy players.

However, if Scott decides to go to North or Geelong, I think the strategy needs to be 4 top 10 picks selecting best player available. There's a small chance the Priority Pick comes in at #1 given that the Suns have a compelling case for being awarded a pick that high, while Carlton have a number of factors going against them for any priority pick at all. Moderate chance of a mid-round pick at #11 as a Priority Pick, which has been acknowledged by AFL honchos as a consideration. High chance of after 1st rounder because the other 17 teams would have an Eddie Mcguire sized sook.

Assuming the Suns take pick #3 for Lynch as compo, otherwise all bets are off.

16 team ? Surely AFL will try to give priority pick to Carlton First .

 

[Stroppy]

11. Connor Rozee (SA)
Best position: General forward/outside midfield
Height, weight: 185cm, 72kg
Recruited from: North Adelaide
Projected draft range: 5-20
Plays like: Dale Thomas
Rationale: Damaging forward who also applies impressive forward pressure. Rises due to solid SANFL League performances.
July Ranking: 14
Strengths:
Skills
Vision
Kicking inside 50m
Finishing around goal
Sticky hands overhead
Freakish at ground level
Acceleration
Breaks the lines
Agility
Leap
Change of direction
Pressures the ball carrier
Forward pressure
Tackling
Overhead marking
Impacts games as a forward and midfielder
Clean at ground level
Weaknesses:
Stoppage work
Strength



Nightmares assessment of Rozee.
Certainly sounds like an asset
Just watching his youtube highlights from the 18's tournament he looks athletic, quick twitch, quick jumper, change of direction with vigour
Nice kick

Seems like a very nice player.
Jack martin-esque

And just played his best game of the season in the seniors in the SANFL in a final. A good sign.

Seems to be a top 10 pick for sure. I would be OK to take Lukosious and Rozee as a package deal. On the Road to the Draft podcast Rozee came across very well and talked about being best mates with Lukosious (and we have to take either Walsh or Lukosious and it sure seems like Walsh will not be there).

....assuming we take pick 3.

 

[Sunraysia]

Suns should bundle up picks to get the Saints pick and have 3 picks in a row to get all 3 South Australians, Lukosius, Rozee and Rankine. List space is the only current problem the Suns have with relation to the number of picks, so it makes sense to trade up, especially considering that the club will be trying to offload some players in exchange for even more draft picks. Going all in for another high pick means the Suns then only need to have enough picks left for matching bids on Academy players in the 2nd and 3rd. I'd like to see the team try to improve the position of both the WC pick and the
Priority Pick, but if bundling them together with a 3rd rounder is the price for pick 3 then it could work out in the Suns favour given there could be as many as 3 Academy players they want to take later and for 6 players to be drafted another 4 senior list spots need to be vacated via trade or delisting (players can be re-rookied). Any extra draft pick late in the Draft can be traded for future picks.

The draft haul might look something like:
2. Lukosius
3. Rankine
4. Rozee
51. Scott*
55. Koenen*
58. Graham*

Couple of unneeded 2nd rounders traded for future picks
*these are their NEAFL numbers, but the likely order and possible rank of selections

Like your thinking - would be good to get 3 from SA - the best U18's performers this year.
Evans stated that the Suns are aiming for 5 draftees inside 30. Not sure that will be the case. You have a good mix here - and if 5 draftees are the go then the 5 you named are good . ( Scott will go higher, Koenen is about right - Graham now less likely to go in the draft - IMO.)
These selections give options aplenty :
4 Forwards (Lukosius, Rankine, Scott, Rozee).
3 Mids - Rozee, Scott, Lukosius
1 Key back - Konenen
2 Talls
2 Locals
A versatile group - that meets with Dews aim for players that can play several positions while also advancing Academy talent and number of Queenlanders on the list.

 

[Sunny_]

Rozee is absolutely flying up the draft boards. Every week he seems to go even higher. It's very much like a Clayton Oliver rise. Was okay-ish in the Champs, but then went really well post-Champs.

Realistically if Rozee is competing well in the SANFL seniors against men (which he seems to be doing) then I'm all for getting him at #3. He and Luko can move in with Charlie Ballard.

 

[Supersuns]

I like rozee but I’m worried he isn’t enough of a contested ball winner to be a star at the next level. Projects as a flanker who may or may not become a mid.We need sure things not maybes