List Mgmt. 2018 Draft/Trade/FA Thread

[17er]

He averaged 5 contested possessions amongst 14 disposals with an efficiency of 76%. He’ll also be 27 next year. There’s a reason he was DE-LISTED.
He wasn’t told to explore his options with a guarantee of staying if there were no takers like Kolodjashnij, and he wasn’t offered good money to swap clubs, he was delisted and the only clubs interested in him were 17th and 16th on the ladder last year. If he was a ‘decent’ player he’d still be on their list.

Comparing him to jack Martin is just irrelevant. Jack plays as a half forward or half back and still averages more touches and contested possessions than Murdoch who runs through the midfield often

There's a flaw in your calculations. 2 actually. I told you, he averaged 16 disposals a game over the past 2 seasons, not 14 which is his career total. Also, adding contested possessions to uncontested possessions does not equal total disposals, so you're short changing him twice. FYI over the past 2 years, he has had closer to 5.6 contested and 10.8 uncontested possessions, an improvement which cam after he was dropped in 2016 and told to get more of the pill.

Geelong, if you didn't notice, recruited Gary Rohan before they delisted Murdoch. Rohan is a former Geelong Falcons player and they tend to be high on Geelong's radar. They think they're getting an upgrade, which in a way they are because of loyalty. Giving away Murdoch cost them nothing and it will cost us next to nothing to acquire him. At least you'll have someone to complain about!

 

[TheSunGod]

I suppose the main question is “are Geelong supporters laughing at us over picking up Murdoch?”

 

[NOBBYS]

Jordan Murdoch like a lot of players can be very hot or very cold but not much in between.
Has played in 6 finals for 43 possessions suggests under pressure struggles too produce.
Not sure what he cost but we need potential good footballers not cheap.
Honestly hope he works out ,only time will tell.

 

[OB11]

Jordan Murdoch like a lot of players can be very hot or very cold but not much in between.
Has played in 6 finals for 43 possessions suggests under pressure struggles too produce.
Not sure what he cost but we need potential good footballers not cheap.
Honestly hope he works out ,only time will tell.

Don't think we will have to worry about how he goes in finals for the next few years.

I think we've already had the discussion that good footballers are not lining up to come here this year.

Still plenty of deadwood to delist next year.

 

[SnusCG]

There's a flaw in your calculations. 2 actually. I told you, he averaged 16 disposals a game over the past 2 seasons, not 14 which is his career total. Also, adding contested possessions to uncontested possessions does not equal total disposals, so you're short changing him twice. FYI over the past 2 years, he has had closer to 5.6 contested and 10.8 uncontested possessions, an improvement which cam after he was dropped in 2016 and told to get more of the pill.

Geelong, if you didn't notice, recruited Gary Rohan before they delisted Murdoch. Rohan is a former Geelong Falcons player and they tend to be high on Geelong's radar. They think they're getting an upgrade, which in a way they are because of loyalty. Giving away Murdoch cost them nothing and it will cost us next to nothing to acquire him. At least you'll have someone to complain about!

You’re just selecting stats to suit a point though. He averaged 14 over his career and 14 this season. Why include the average for his last 2 years besides the fact that it slightly bumps it up to help your argument. His body of work and his most reason season are pretty average and I just personally think we can do better.

would honestly rather Mav Weller

 

[thurls64]

So I’ve only really seen a little bit of Murdoch (and what I have seen isn’t super reassuring) but from what is being said about him I am getting an image of a Kk but can tackle, and plays a little further up the ground, no? Although his confidence issues aren’t head injury related.

isn't he a pressure forward/outside mid? not a defender?

 

[Scotty_222]

I suppose the main question is “are Geelong supporters laughing at us over picking up Murdoch?”

Yes lol

 

[Mini GF]

I suppose the main question is “are Geelong supporters laughing at us over picking up Murdoch?”

Have we officially recruited him yet?

 

[Stroppy]

For mine, Murdoch does not move the needle either way.

At this stage of his career, has shown he is a fringe AFL player. But he is a mature depth player with lots of experience in a well run club that plays a lot of finals.

The one thing he has for sure is AFL speed, and if iirc Dew was looking for more speed in the team. No guarantees but like all our mature players, if they play the role well that Dew wants them to play, they are a big chance to play. See Rischa last year. Do your job, get a game early in the year.

As a rebuilding team we should be wary of spending list spots on fringe mature players, but we are also a bit of an anomaly there.

We were the youngest list last year and just got younger. We are also using the 3 extra rookie spots to hold onto younger players (Scheer, Wigg, Leslie, assuming they are not drafted elsewhere).

So if we pick him up it is a big shrug from me. Will be interested to see if playing in a rebuilding team is good for him. Pressure to play well but a lot less pressure to win.

 

[gcsunsfc]

Your impression of Murdoch isn't borne out in the stats. He'd be 4th at the Suns in disposal efficiency after being 14th at Geelong with 76.1%. To make matters worse, we've just traded or delisted 6 of our top 10 disposal efficiency ranked players, so Murdoch will be 2nd most efficient behind Rory and it isn't even close.
View attachment 581970

Playing as an outside player in a successful offensive team will do wonders for your disposal efficiency.
I would put my years salary on his efficiency getting worse.

Look up his disposal numbers / efficiency in losses. That will be more reflective of what he will experience if he plays for our team.

 

[Young_Guns]

isn't he a pressure forward/outside mid? not a defender?

I thought he was wingmen, so more advanced up the field then Kk was yep. Not sure of his ability up forward though. More that some of the traits sounded similar.

If the defensive side of his game is a positive then I guess it’s clear why he’s being targeted with his skill set. I don’t have too much of a problem with us picking him up as depth/a rookie in case of emergency (would prefer Cheney though) But I’m just hoping that the 3 year deal part isn’t true (seems to be guesswork thankfully).

 

[gcsunsfc]

The stats show in losses last year
9.8 disposals at 67% efficiency.

How does that stack up.

Agree with @barberbarian massive downhill skier.

 

[Suns of Anarchy]

The stats show in losses last year
9.8 disposals at 67% efficiency.

How does that stack up.

Agree with @barberbarian massive downhill skier.

Wouldn’t most teams’ disposal efficiency drop in a loss??
Plenty of players on our list that wouldn’t get one game with a finals team let alone 108.

 

[gcsunsfc]

Wouldn’t most teams’ disposal efficiency drop in a loss??
Plenty of players on our list that wouldn’t get one game with a finals team let alone 108.

Yes
Which is why I think comparing his disposal efficiency this year with our current list disposal efficiency is inherently flawed and doesn’t really provide any meaningful information.

 

[gcsunsfc]

For what it’s worth I wouldn’t mind him on our list as think he provides something we don’t have.
Just have pretty tempered expectations about what will actually happen.

Am sure he will have some good games. Can also see a lot of 7 disposal, 1 tackle games coming.

 

[17er]

You’re just selecting stats to suit a point though. He averaged 14 over his career and 14 this season. Why include the average for his last 2 years besides the fact that it slightly bumps it up to help your argument. His body of work and his most reason season are pretty average and I just personally think we can do better.

would honestly rather Mav Weller

3rd time - he averaged 15 disposals this year at 76% in a team full of ball hogs. Last year he played 22 games and averaged almost 17 disposals. It's important because it shows continual improvement throughout his career. What are the most important things on your resume? Your High School Tertiary Entrance Score, what you were doing

For mine, Murdoch does not move the needle either way.

At this stage of his career, has shown he is a fringe AFL player. But he is a mature depth player with lots of experience in a well run club that plays a lot of finals.

The one thing he has for sure is AFL speed, and if iirc Dew was looking for more speed in the team. No guarantees but like all our mature players, if they play the role well that Dew wants them to play, they are a big chance to play. See Rischa last year. Do your job, get a game early in the year.

As a rebuilding team we should be wary of spending list spots on fringe mature players, but we are also a bit of an anomaly there.

We were the youngest list last year and just got younger. We are also using the 3 extra rookie spots to hold onto younger players (Scheer, Wigg, Leslie, assuming they are not drafted elsewhere).

So if we pick him up it is a big shrug from me. Will be interested to see if playing in a rebuilding team is good for him. Pressure to play well but a lot less pressure to win.

Good points, except I really don't understand why you feel the need to label this guy a fringe player. Just seems a cheap shot. He's played 30 odd VFL games and 108 AFL games for Geelong. That's about 75% of Geelong games since he was drafted. He played most of his VFL in his debut season and also in 2016 and even then he played in half the Senior games in both seasons. The guy almost never gets injured and always won his place back in the handful of times he's been dropped for form or minor injury.

Alex Sexton has had a comparable percentage of AFL games and NEAFL games, although far more injuries over the exact same time. Is Sexton a fringe player? Anthony Miles might be, but he wasn't in 2016. George Horlin-Smith is, but Geelong's a pretty damn tough side to crack. Jordan Murdoch isn't a fringe player. What is is the prettiest girl at the DFA dance and we have a spot to fill on the Senior list that he ticks the most boxes for.

 

[Suns of Anarchy]

For what it’s worth I wouldn’t mind him on our list as think he provides something we don’t have.
Just have pretty tempered expectations about what will actually happen.

Am sure he will have some good games. Can also see a lot of 7 disposal, 1 tackle games coming.

Some of those low possession games were as a defensive forward from memory and tackles actually matched his possessions. Cameron did say we were looking for speed outside & also a rebounding defender etc. Maybe he’ll be used down back? Interesting to see his role.
I don’t expect him to star wherever he plays but he adds depth and hopefully prevents some kids exposed when they’re not ready like this year.
Ultimately it will be the 5 drafted next month and our other kids who are the future. These mature agers are stop gaps and mentors.
And you’re right about our disposal efficiency. The north game was atrocious and other games in the heavy dew compared to the Etihad teams with a roof and no wind.

 

[SnusCG]

3rd time - he averaged 15 disposals this year at 76% in a team full of ball hogs. Last year he played 22 games and averaged almost 17 disposals. It's important because it shows continual improvement throughout his career. What are the most important things on your resume? Your High School Tertiary Entrance Score, what you were doing

Good points, except I really don't understand why you feel the need to label this guy a fringe player. Just seems a cheap shot. He's played 30 odd VFL games and 108 AFL games for Geelong. That's about 75% of Geelong games since he was drafted. He played most of his VFL in his debut season and also in 2016 and even then he played in half the Senior games in both seasons. The guy almost never gets injured and always won his place back in the handful of times he's been dropped for form or minor injury.

Alex Sexton has had a comparable percentage of AFL games and NEAFL games, although far more injuries over the exact same time. Is Sexton a fringe player? Anthony Miles might be, but he wasn't in 2016. George Horlin-Smith is, but Geelong's a pretty damn tough side to crack. Jordan Murdoch isn't a fringe player. What is is the prettiest girl at the DFA dance and we have a spot to fill on the Senior list that he ticks the most boxes for.

You’d think after getting banned several times for exactly this you’d have learnt to have a reasonable discussion without going straight for an insult.

But fine, okay, let’s round then seeing as that seems to have plucked a nerve with you.

2015 he averaged 16 disposals (15.61) [his 5th year in the AFL system]
2016 he averaged 14 disposals (13.50)
2017 he averaged 17 disposals (16.86)
2018 he averaged 15 disposals (14.88)

He’s reached his ceiling. What he’s producing right now is as good as he’s going to. He’s literally a MUCH worse version of Aaron Hall and we seemed perfectly happy to trade him this year.

Murdoch was constantly dropped over his time at geelong and subsequently de-listed this year because he doesn’t have much to offer. He was never an incredible performer in the VFL either when he was dropped.

Again. If he was a decent player he would still be on Geelong’s list. Mav Weller would add more, and I’m not even in favour of bringing him in either

 

[Old Sol]

Yes but he only averages 14 disposals a game. Who cares how good you are at disposing the ball if you can’t find any of it.

I care about how good the Suns are at disposing of the ball.

 

[Suns of Anarchy]

I suppose the main question is “are Geelong supporters laughing at us over picking up Murdoch?”

The Zac Smith trade soon shuts them up.

 

[TheJanuaryMan]

One thing on Murdoch. How much of the ball could he be expected to win with Danger, Ablett, Selwood, Duncan and Menegola in the same team. He may thrive as a more experienced go-to.

 

[gcsunsfc]

One thing on Murdoch. How much of the ball could he be expected to win with Danger, Ablett, Selwood, Duncan and Menegola in the same team. He may thrive as a more experienced go-to.

well in 2014 they didn't have ablett, danger, menegola
and averaged 12.8 possessions - although was only his 3rd AFL season

 

[Live in hope]

You’d think after getting banned several times for exactly this you’d have learnt to have a reasonable discussion without going straight for an insult.

But fine, okay, let’s round then seeing as that seems to have plucked a nerve with you.

2015 he averaged 16 disposals (15.61) [his 5th year in the AFL system]
2016 he averaged 14 disposals (13.50)
2017 he averaged 17 disposals (16.86)
2018 he averaged 15 disposals (14.88)

He’s reached his ceiling. What he’s producing right now is as good as he’s going to. He’s literally a MUCH worse version of Aaron Hall and we seemed perfectly happy to trade him this year.

Murdoch was constantly dropped over his time at geelong and subsequently de-listed this year because he doesn’t have much to offer. He was never an incredible performer in the VFL either when he was dropped.

Again. If he was a decent player he would still be on Geelong’s list. Mav Weller would add more, and I’m not even in favour of bringing him in either

Murdoch’s good games were (not a great surprise) when Geelong could get its pressure and zone game working well, particularly on the narrow confines of Kardinia park. In these games showed Murdoch’s good features of hitting in with some really hard tackles, and tearing off opponents into open 50 for goals.

What Cats fans hated with Jordan was -
- not imposing himself consistently in games - almost invisible in some. (Early in his career he also appeared quite timid and reluctant to tackle but actually this is now a strong point). I think he was never settled into a single position where he could focus on his role
- butchering disposal and brain fade clangers. To be honest, he wasn’t actually a stand out with this and probably more reliable with kicking than many, including Dangerfield.

If I was Dew I would:
- settle Murdoch in a role where he could leverage his elite speed and tackling and ability to cadge a goal, like a defensive forward. Like Hardwick and the Tiger small forwards, make his role as simple as possible,
- crazy possibly, but give him a leadership role (member of the leadership group). This might help the self belief and confidence.

 

[Live in hope]

The Zac Smith trade soon shuts them up.

Think most of us are happy for him to go but also hoping he gets a gig elsewhere. Not many of us that fussed on what we get.
You are definitely getting a more robust less injury prone player with Jordan than Zac.

 

[Peel67skin]

Murdoch is a DFA , not a top 10 pick or Isaac Smith . Please lower your expections.