World Cup 2018 FIFA World Cup-Group D Thread (Argentina, Iceland, Croatia, Nigeria)

[Cruyff14]

Anybody else think Argentina will flop? They have so much talent but they never seem to be able to get the results when it matters.

 

[Occidental]

Anybody else think Argentina will flop? They have so much talent but they never seem to be able to get the results when it matters.

What?!?!
In the last 10 World Cups, Argentina has won 2, made 2 other finals and only once in those ten tournaments not progress from their group.
They have gone through the toughest of all Qualifying programs and I reckon this steels them to rise when they make the finals.
They struggled a bit in qualifying this time around but the job was made harder by both Chile & Peru being gifted 3-0 wins due to Bolivia (who neither actually beat) fielding an ineligible player. Those changed results evened up the table and put real pressure on everyone except Brazil.
But Argentina did the usual and finished off with a tremendous 3-1 win in Quito to qualify.
Right them off at your peril.

 

[Macpotata]

Anybody else think Argentina will flop? They have so much talent but they never seem to be able to get the results when it matters.

When it matters? If that's the case say the same for all the other 31 teams that make it. They made the final last time around and b2b copa's too losing both on pens. The previous two world cup losses were eliminations to Germany in the qtrs who finished 3rd themselves and lost to the eventual winners. One of those losses was on pens in 06, the other a 4-0 drubbing in 2010 which was a rare exception.

 

[Macpotata]

What?!?!
In the last 10 World Cups, Argentina has won 2, made 2 other finals and only once in those ten tournaments not progress from their group.
They have gone through the toughest of all Qualifying programs and I reckon this steels them to rise when they make the finals.
They struggled a bit in qualifying this time around but the job was made harder by both Chile & Peru being gifted 3-0 wins due to Bolivia (who neither actually beat) fielding an ineligible player. Those changed results evened up the table and put real pressure on everyone except Brazil.
But Argentina did the usual and finished off with a tremendous 3-1 win in Quito to qualify.
Right them off at your peril.

Just read this.

Exactly!

86 winners
90 runners up.

Italy/Brazil/Germany had 24 years between winning a cup in 94, 2006 and 2010. I guess they were no good as well. Like France now!

 

[Cruyff14]

What?!?!
In the last 10 World Cups, Argentina has won 2, made 2 other finals and only once in those ten tournaments not progress from their group.
They have gone through the toughest of all Qualifying programs and I reckon this steels them to rise when they make the finals.
They struggled a bit in qualifying this time around but the job was made harder by both Chile & Peru being gifted 3-0 wins due to Bolivia (who neither actually beat) fielding an ineligible player. Those changed results evened up the table and put real pressure on everyone except Brazil.
But Argentina did the usual and finished off with a tremendous 3-1 win in Quito to qualify.
Right them off at your peril.

The last 10 World Cups, which stretches back to 40 years ago. A time when football was completely different and the world didn't know who Diego Maradona was. That is a MASSIVE sample size, which you've obviously selected to suit your argument.

They bored their way to the final last time around and they weren't really impressive upon their path IIRC. They struggled against Iran (91st minute winner from Messi), ET against Switzerland with a 118th minute winner, and winning on penalties against Holland.

Happy to be proven wrong, but I think they're very top heavy and are too reliant on Messi when clearly they don't need to be.

 

[Macpotata]

The last 10 World Cups, which stretches back to 40 years ago. A time when football was completely different and the world didn't know who Diego Maradona was. That is a MASSIVE sample size, which you've obviously selected to suit your argument.

They bored their way to the final last time around and they weren't really impressive upon their path IIRC. They struggled against Iran (91st minute winner from Messi), ET against Switzerland with a 118th minute winner, and winning on penalties against Holland.

Happy to be proven wrong, but I think they're very top heavy and are too reliant on Messi when clearly they don't need to be.

How they they got there or who they beat is irrelevant. Germany in 2002 played no one until the final.

Saudi Arabia
Ireland ( draw )
Cameroon
Paraguay ( stoppage time winner )
USA
South Korea

That's the easiest path ever to a final.

Brazil played England in the qtrs themselves and that's it. Who did they face, Turkey? Who Rivaldo cheated against to get a dodgy penalty which was outside the box. China, Costa Rica, Belgium who were denied a clear goal at 0-0. Played turkey again in the semis.

Brazil in 1994? Holland. Sweden weren't a gun until that cup themsleves and struggled at times and didn't have " big scalp "
Beat Romania on penalties.

Any of the calibre of opponents mentioned above can be put on par with Belgium 2014.

France in 1998

South Africa
Saudi Arabia
Denmark ( lol what a rigged group )
Paraguay
Italy ( great side )
Croatia ( good too maiden World Cup )


France had a dream run to The qtrs where they were an inch away from losing in golden goal extra time, and won on pens. That was after a golden goal winner vs Paraguay in the 2nd round, a team who was held goalless for 3 full matches and almost all of extra time. A team who scored in one game only against a side in their last group game who were already qualified in top spot.

Beat croatia with their defender scoring his only two goals of his career.

You can always pick teams apart and find faults etc

 

[Macpotata]

The last 10 World Cups, which stretches back to 40 years ago. A time when football was completely different and the world didn't know who Diego Maradona was. That is a MASSIVE sample size, which you've obviously selected to suit your argument.

They bored their way to the final last time around and they weren't really impressive upon their path IIRC. They struggled against Iran (91st minute winner from Messi), ET against Switzerland with a 118th minute winner, and winning on penalties against Holland.

Happy to be proven wrong, but I think they're very top heavy and are too reliant on Messi when clearly they don't need to be.

98
2006
2010

Qtr finals. The last two cups before the last are recent and as mentioned went out in one via penalties to Germany who were the host nation.

Made the last two finals of the Copa America losing on penalties both times.


Your argument is actually flawed.

 

[Occidental]

The last 10 World Cups, which stretches back to 40 years ago. A time when football was completely different and the world didn't know who Diego Maradona was. That is a MASSIVE sample size, which you've obviously selected to suit your argument.

They bored their way to the final last time around and they weren't really impressive upon their path IIRC. They struggled against Iran (91st minute winner from Messi), ET against Switzerland with a 118th minute winner, and winning on penalties against Holland.

Happy to be proven wrong, but I think they're very top heavy and are too reliant on Messi when clearly they don't need to be.

Of course I selected a large sample size. It simply proves how consistently good Argentina have been for decades. Would an unrepresentative small sample have been better evidence?
Argentina are proven performers at the highest level and they have been so for decades.
The fact a nation like them can do it is amazing. Argentina is not a wealthy country. It has pockets of wealth, particularly in B.A, but the vast majority of people do it pretty tough. They make bugger all money & their currency is useless. When you get off the main highways, 90% of the roads are still dirt. Yet the fact they can stick it to wealthy nations like England, Holland, Germany, Italy etc is a credit to them.

 

[Cruyff14]

What does wealth have to do with it? Brasil is one of the poorest countries in the world and look at what they do. No wealth = play football on the streets from the age of 3. Hence why both nations can produce such amazing players, consistently.

 

[Occidental]

What does wealth have to do with it? Brasil is one of the poorest countries in the world and look at what they do. No wealth = play football on the streets from the age of 3. Hence why both nations can produce such amazing players, consistently.

Wealth = infrastructure, stadiums, technical support, coaching, high wages, stability ........
South American countries cannot compete with rich nations on any metric you care you name. Yet they still serve it up to First World nations like England, Italy, Spain, Germany, Holland all the time. It is a credit to them all.
Argentina does nothing on the world stage at all except for football. That's because it is a yet another struggling South American country. Yet they consistently outdo nations like England.
I know who the real "flops" are.

 

[No_Spoke]

Wealth = infrastructure, stadiums, technical support, coaching, high wages, stability ........
South American countries cannot compete with rich nations on any metric you care you name. Yet they still serve it up to First World nations like England, Italy, Spain, Germany, Holland all the time. It is a credit to them all.
Argentina does nothing on the world stage at all except for football. That's because it is a yet another struggling South American country. Yet they consistently outdo nations like England.
I know who the real "flops" are.

Argentines are mainly of Italian and Spanish descent -- 5 world cups between them. Combine that with a country thats crazy about football, mixed with sth american football flair, and you're bound to get some serious talent. This talent is further developed in the European clubs with deep pockets, and there's your answer as to how they do well against the first world countries.

 

[Cruyff14]

Not sure why you're coming across as so offended Occidental. It honestly reads like I've a hit nerve reading your posts in reply to mine.

No_Spoke also adds to my point. They're crazy mad about football, and like I said, when you don't have money to do anything else, you pick up a football and play. Do that every day form age 3, you're going to get good. And when you think how many kids do that, it's a no brainer why they have been so successful.

 

[Occidental]

Not sure why you're coming across as so offended Occidental. It honestly reads like I've a hit nerve reading your posts in reply to mine.

No_Spoke also adds to my point. They're crazy mad about football, and like I said, when you don't have money to do anything else, you pick up a football and play. Do that every day form age 3, you're going to get good. And when you think how many kids do that, it's a no brainer why they have been so successful.

Cheers - in re-reading my posts I agree I may have come across a tad strong.
I’ve visited South America a few times and love the place. I guess I just get how they struggle - huge rich / poor divide, stupid governments, loads of poverty... and yet they star at football.
I just admire them so much for what they achieve - I guess I may have come across a bit defensive - my apologies.

 

[Macpotata]

Not sure why you're coming across as so offended Occidental. It honestly reads like I've a hit nerve reading your posts in reply to mine.

No_Spoke also adds to my point. They're crazy mad about football, and like I said, when you don't have money to do anything else, you pick up a football and play. Do that every day form age 3, you're going to get good. And when you think how many kids do that, it's a no brainer why they have been so successful.

hitting a nerve? That's a typical defLect response from someone who is actually offended.


grow up.

 

[Jatz]

Argentina play a friendly tomorrow morning at 8:50am our time against Haiti.

Can't imagine they'll be at full strength of course.

 

[Cruyff14]

Cheers - in re-reading my posts I agree I may have come across a tad strong.
I’ve visited South America a few times and love the place. I guess I just get how they struggle - huge rich / poor divide, stupid governments, loads of poverty... and yet they star at football.
I just admire them so much for what they achieve - I guess I may have come across a bit defensive - my apologies.

No need to apologise at all mate.

Yeah that's fair enough, I don't dislike Argentina, I just think for all the attacking talent they have, it doesn't translate to the results it should.

hitting a nerve? That's a typical defLect response from someone who is actually offended.


grow up.

Not sure what your problem is either. Reading your posts you come across as very aggressive because someone has said something that you don't agree with.

You'll see Occidental even says himself he may have come across as a tad strong.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

 

[Jatz]

That kit shouldn't work but it just does.

 

[No_Spoke]

No need to apologise at all mate.

Yeah that's fair enough, I don't dislike Argentina, I just think for all the attacking talent they have, it doesn't translate to the results it should.


Not sure what your problem is either. Reading your posts you come across as very aggressive because someone has said something that you don't agree with.

You'll see Occidental even says himself he may have come across as a tad strong.

Argentina have underachieved massively given the talent that they had/havd. You can blame it on Maradonas shadow but history shows that they've always had the talent but nothing to show until wc78 and when he came along. The team is too old to do anything this world cup even with Messi in the side.

 

[XXRL]

2014 - Brazil beat them 3-1 in the world cup opener. Croatia scored early and Neymar equalised. A ridiculous penalty put brazil back up 2-1 when the Cro's were getting on top some what. Smashed Cameroon 40 then were belted 3-1 by Mexico in the last knocking them out and 3 consecutive group phase exits.

Was that at game - atmosphere was awesome. Could see from 100m away that the pen was a clear dive - no idea how the ref gave it.

I was sitting adjacent to the media people who got to see replays of it (unlike the rest of us) and they were all arguing with each other in animated sign language as to whether it was a dive or a foul - was pretty funny and confirmed to me that it must have been a dive.

Croatia were gallant in that game, but not sure they were ever going to win it.

 

[Macpotata]

Was that at game - atmosphere was awesome. Could see from 100m away that the pen was a clear dive - no idea how the ref gave it.

I was sitting adjacent to the media people who got to see replays of it (unlike the rest of us) and they were all arguing with each other in animated sign language as to whether it was a dive or a foul - was pretty funny and confirmed to me that it must have been a dive.

Croatia were gallant in that game, but not sure they were ever going to win it.

You lucky son of a gun. I enjoyed that game and it was good that it delivered goals and drama. Not bullshit cheating and bad decisions, but drama in the sense that Brazil were up against it early and had a big fight on their hands.

Which other games did you go to?

 

[XXRL]

You lucky son of a gun. I enjoyed that game and it was good that it delivered goals and drama. Not bullshit cheating and bad decisions, but drama in the sense that Brazil were up against it early and had a big fight on their hands.

Which other games did you go to?

I was happy Brazil won - Was party time in Sao Paulo afterwards!

Brazil vs Croatia
Australia vs Holland
Ecuador vs Honduras
Australia vs Spain
France vs Ecuador
Columbia vs Uruguay (R16)

Got to see the two best goals of the tournament IMO

 

[Macpotata]

I was happy Brazil won - Was party time in Sao Paulo afterwards!

Brazil vs Croatia
Australia vs Holland
Ecuador vs Honduras
Australia vs Spain
France vs Ecuador
Columbia vs Uruguay (R16)

Got to see the two best goals of the tournament IMO

holy s**t you did too. Cahill and Rodriguez. Dynamite!

nice games

 

[Cruyff14]

Argentina have underachieved massively given the talent that they had/havd. You can blame it on Maradonas shadow but history shows that they've always had the talent but nothing to show until wc78 and when he came along. The team is too old to do anything this world cup even with Messi in the side.

Absolutely they have.

Yeah, I think quarters at best for them this year.

 

[No_Spoke]

Absolutely they have.

Yeah, I think quarters at best for them this year.

At best