Mega Thread 2018 Media Thread

poshman

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Wow! I just watched that whole interview and I have no idea how you came to that conclusion. I know you are just trolling for a bite, but I thought it was a really insightful interview, and it seems like Ross is well plugged into the young team.

I loved his comment about Sandilands - "what he's doing for young Darcy, money can't buy that".
That was huge to me - 'whatever we are paying him, it isn't enough' - great to hear and also great to have some perspective on expectations for the year.
 

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Halfbaked

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We have one of them already.
I don't think anybody believes Ross will still be the coach in two years unless there is obvious evidence of improvement. I'm not a RTB hater but he has the key forwards he badly needed, lets see if there is obvious improvement.
Either way I would prefer an experienced coach next.
 

its free real estate

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I don't think most people truly appreciate how well WCE have been list managed for the past decade in comparison to Freo. Simpson inherited a really balanced and experienced list. To his credit, he's made the most of it.

In their premiership team they used experienced players that were traded in and then either one or two players from every draft from 2005 to the 2017 excepting 2009 (Brad Sheppard would have played if not injured) and 2011 (GWS impacted draft - Yeo was originally from that draft though).

Their key positions and midfield are filled solely by experienced players traded in (Kennedy, Cripps, Yeo, Redden, Jetta, Vardy, Hickey) or those drafted prior to 2014 (ie with 5 or more years in the system). Barrass was the only one in their B22 spine drafted or traded in after 2010. And their key distributors off half back are also two of their most experienced (Hurn and Jetta). The players in their B22 who were drafted after 2013 are all small forwards or small defenders (Duggan, Cole, Venables, Rioli, Ryan). In their GF team Venables was the only one under 20 - and he was their least important GF player (2 effective disposals and 2 clangers). Even with injuries to key players during the season their key spots were filled by experienced players (Naitanui > Lycett+Vardy, Sheppard > Schofield, Gaff > Sheed). Their youngsters may have played a couple of games but they were never KPPs (third talls at most - Waterman, Allen, Brander) nor played in the midfield.

Then we take Freo, whose spine (sans 35yo Sandi) is Darcy (a 20yo ruck), Hamling (traded in 2016), Pearce (drafted 2013, missed over a year with injuries), either Cox (a 20yo) or Taberner (a rookie from 2012 who is still not guaranteed B22), Hogan (only just traded in) and Lobb (only just traded in). Their spine has been playing together for years, ours isn't even settled (and is yet to play a regular season game together). Our midfield is Fyfe, Mundy (33yo) and then a bunch of youngsters drafted from 2014 onwards (most of our mids were in their 1st season last year) or players traded in the past 3 years (eg BHill).

We only have 8 players on our list that we drafted/traded in prior to 2014. West Coast has 16. 2 of ours are perpetually injured (Sandi and Hill) and 2 probably shouldn't be B22 (Ballas and Tabs). 14 of theirs are B22. All our trade ins have been in the past 4 years. 11 players in total - 5 are either injured (Bennell) or fringe (Kersten/McCarthy/Matera/Colyer). WC have 8 traded in players on their list, 7 of those over the past 7 years (1 each year except none in 2014 and 2 in 2015). 7 are B22 (Ah Chee the exception).

When your spine and midfield (plus immediate depth) has mostly been together for 5 years+ it makes it so much easier to coach and have the players execute a game plan effectively. I don't think West Coast are a skilled team because they are all amazing kicks. I think Simpson has turned them into an incredibly disciplined team and they move as one to give the person with the ball high percentage options (eg a short kick to a lead whilst the others draw away their defenders). And they do the same when the opposition has the ball - moving in unison. Something that can be achieved far more easily with a team that is experienced and has played together a lot.

Lyon inherited a not dissimilar list in 2012. We had an experienced and established spine (McPharlin/Johnson/Sandi/Pavlich) and a strong midfield (Mundy/Fyfe/Barlow/Hill/Crowley). Perhaps not coincidentally both Lyon and Simpson took their teams to a GF in their second year coaching (2013 and 2015 respectively) and both lost to a more experienced, skilled and disciplined Hawthorn. Freo's 2014 and WC's 2016/17 seasons weren't dissimilar either - both playing finals but not threatening. In 2015 Ross had Freo hobble in to the end of season finishing minor premiers (again losing to the Hawks in the finals), whilst in 2018, Simpson got his team to the GF, took advantage of Richmond getting ahead of itself, and won the big dance. The major difference between Freo's 2015 list and WC's 2018 list? One had the depth to cover key injuries whilst the other didn't. Some will say it was development, I'm saying it was list management.

People will argue Ross' game style wearing the players out was also a major reason for the collapse but the reality was, when key injuries happened, Freo had no-one on the list to replace them. Freo's 2015 list simply wasn't even close to as deep and balanced as what West Coast had last year. Freo were incredibly reliant on veterans to be competitive (hence the plummet in 2016), and due to massive gaps in prior drafting we had no choice but to rebuild. Our list was in a dire predicament but the past few seasons we've turned it around (with good trading and conservative drafting). We've traded in to fill key gaps and add depth, plenty of our youngsters are producing beyond their years but need more time (especially the midfielders) and we've backed them in by playing them in key roles at the expense of our competitiveness. We can't expect immediate coordinated perfection from a list where 32 players have been turned over in 3 seasons. I'm not sure if Ross is the right coach to take Freo forward but I think sometimes people forget the context he is working in. If he goes, someone will inherit a good list come 2021.

And don't even get me started on the player availability issues we've had on top of the list management farce in recent seasons. We need to take immediate action like we did with list management. This season could be a complete write off if we don't (will only take a couple more injuries early) and if we head into next season's first round with a similar 14 or so injured players we'll completely waste all the good list management work we've done of late.
Should have sacked the list management team after that bogus 2010 draft. Complete balls up of drafting 2010-2016, worst stretch in our history.
 
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I don't think most people truly appreciate how well WCE have been list managed for the past decade in comparison to Freo. Simpson inherited a really balanced and experienced list. To his credit, he's made the most of it.

In their premiership team they used experienced players that were traded in and then either one or two players from every draft from 2005 to the 2017 excepting 2009 (Brad Sheppard would have played if not injured) and 2011 (GWS impacted draft - Yeo was originally from that draft though).
As has been pointed out previously, their list management was assisted by having extra (priority) picks in 2008 and 2010 for having seasons of less than 5 wins. That reward for poor performance now only exists at the discretion of the AFL. Could they have beaten Collingwood without those two players (Shuey and Darling)?
 

BlueE

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As has been pointed out previously, their list management was assisted by having extra (priority) picks in 2008 and 2010 for having seasons of less than 5 wins. That reward for poor performance now only exists at the discretion of the AFL. Could they have beaten Collingwood without those two players (Shuey and Darling)?
Pretty good rebuild then. Still depends who you pick with that (Andrew McLeod says Hi). We could have picked Darling (who'd we pick instead?) and McGovern before them so maybe it's our fault they beat Collingwood!
 
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Pretty good rebuild then. Still depends who you pick with that (Andrew McLeod says Hi). We could have picked Darling (who'd we pick instead?) and McGovern before them so maybe it's our fault they beat Collingwood!
That's fair. They're indebted to us, just like in 2006 when we gave Sydney a tough enough time in the prelim that they couldn't get over the line in the GF. F***ing ingrates.
 

tonygeeks

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Wow! I just watched that whole interview and I have no idea how you came to that conclusion. I know you are just trolling for a bite, but I thought it was a really insightful interview, and it seems like Ross is well plugged into the young team.

I loved his comment about Sandilands - "what he's doing for young Darcy, money can't buy that".
loved his comment about Sandilands - "what he's doing for young Darcy, money can't buy that".

What money can't buy a ruck coach ?

Trolling was it , I actually prefer trolls to inane dribblers but that's just me


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salim malik

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loved his comment about Sandilands - "what he's doing for young Darcy, money can't buy that".

What money can't buy a ruck coach ?

Trolling was it , I actually prefer trolls to inane dribblers but that's just me


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What about inane dribbling trolls.
 

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Couldn't be further apart although one feeds off the other

Trolling - howling of the wolf

Inane dribbling - bleating of the sheep


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Nah, plenty of sheep troll.

Trolling is just saying whatever in a desperate bid to get attention. Pretty much fits the inane part and the dribbling too.
 
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As has been pointed out previously, their list management was assisted by having extra (priority) picks in 2008 and 2010 for having seasons of less than 5 wins. That reward for poor performance now only exists at the discretion of the AFL. Could they have beaten Collingwood without those two players (Shuey and Darling)?
Those two guys were available at our picks, so to say they were an advantage over everyone else is a bit much. The picks they got higher in those drafts (Naitanui, Gaff) didn't even play in the GF.

Would we be better off had we drafted Shuey and Darling instead of Hill and Pitt? Undoubtedly. Did everyone else in the league have access to Shuey and Darling (sometimes twice over)? Yes.

An extra pick 18 and 26 for finishing second last and last might have helped a little, but our situation is because we absolutely burned draft picks for six years.
 
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There's too much WC love on here at times for my liking.

Give me Hill over Shuey every day of the week. Plus it's too easy to fall into the"what-if?" trap.

For example, WC also overlooked Darling in that draft and would they have chosen him without that extra pick?

For all that imagine if Harvey had got his way and Freo had selected Bastinac over Fyfe?

Basically though, the whole direction from 2010 onwards was a more national (read eastern-centric) less parochial focus for drafting as instigated by Harvey & Bond. I've always assumed Harvey harboured ill feelings towards Smart for going around him on Fyfe. So he brought in the Lloyds as closer allies to better follow through on his vision for recruitment.
 

freoextra

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Hager’s on 6pr mentioned that cognilio is open to a move to freo. Would prefer wce but they don’t have the coin. He would be a perfect fit.
If true (hey it's a Haggers comment) that would be fantastic. A mad Eagle supporter from a mad Eagles supporting family but a few of his mates are now at Freo so I guess it is possible.
 
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Hager’s on 6pr mentioned that cognilio is open to a move to freo. Would prefer wce but they don’t have the coin. He would be a perfect fit.
If true (hey it's a Haggers comment) that would be fantastic. A mad Eagle supporter from a mad Eagles supporting family but a few of his mates are now at Freo so I guess it is possible.
the kids call it a 'reverse Yeo'
 

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There can be two bad parents. Why does Lyon get a free pass in your estimation for three shit seasons?


Don't want to rain on your parade but Lyon also lead us through the best years I,'ve had as a Freo supporter but that's not to say every thing runs it's race and the end has to come
 
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If true (hey it's a Haggers comment) that would be fantastic. A mad Eagle supporter from a mad Eagles supporting family but a few of his mates are now at Freo so I guess it is possible.
He played at Swan Districts with Sonny Walters. There's that link also.
 
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