List Mgmt. 2018 St Kilda Trade Thread Part 3

[Sunnyjim]

All media reporters stating that bulldogs in box seat for Wingard should he leave and even afl website stated the dogs and hawks were interested in Wingard and didn’t even mention us. As hopeful as I am it seems so unlikely that we can attract anyone bar Hannebery because no one in the comp will pay his wages but us. As for out other targets there will always be better teams interested and their offers similar to ours
I want us to land atleast a big name (apart from banners) but I’d consider it lucky if we were to land Hannebery a ruckman and a young unproven player eg scrimshaw and likely of just landing Hannebery and a mediocre player like Roughead as a ruckman

Is premium an itk or trusted source? Has he got anything before?

 

[triggering bro]

Never underestimate The Cho

Not enough Mav Geary’s

 

[Grav]

The pick 4 picks I’d like to see.

 

[_Maximus_12]

Don't worry whoever we get they say they are s//t , this is why the hawks and dogs want him.

As a supporter base we have literally the the rosiest of rose coloured glasses.

 

[plugger66]

Dont believe that for a second. McCartin pretty similar to Hawkins type player who suits today's football. Dunstan was an in and under bull who has shown glimpses of being elite (see end of last season). Goddard hasn't had many chances to due to injury, but to say that they are not suited to today game is utterly wrong.

I suggesting him not being on our list makes it utterly right. Dunstan to slow in our midfield because we have others slow but better. McCartin has shown nothing to suggest he is like Hawkins except people hoping. I don’t believe development can be blamed when you look at others going better than their pick numbers. Very lazy to say they were good as juniors so it must be development if they aren’t as seniors. Do you think they thought billings would be as outside as he is when drafted. Doubtful when they said he would be a mid when he gets older. Unfortunately he doesn’t have what it takes to be a mid. Poor drafting is certainly one of the reasons we are no good. Poor development is probably another reason

 

[plugger66]

I'm a huge Wingard fan. Shiel is a good midfielder but Wingard can be a special player.
The thought of him, Gresham, Long and Billings in the forward half is pretty exciting.

Yes long can tackle the rest can watch the ball leave the forward line. Quality mids must be first priority if there is a choice. Pick 4 for a hff off an ordinary year doesn’t do it for me

 

[malevu]

Never underestimate The Cho

You're the funniest dude on here. Your posts crack me up.

 

[Mowman]

According to the media

Pfft Didn't they have Jakey boy going to Carlton
They know less then us and thats saying something

 

[Yawkey way]

yes, let's build our list based on opinions of forum posters...

Honestly I have a port supporter in my midst these days so I watch them more than I would like.

He just seems to have gone backwards as a player, I really see him as a small forward and a very good one at his best. I want mids, skilfull pure mids I just don’t rate him highly enough to consider giving up pick 4. All this talk of a late pick back and points value etc is garbage, I like this draft and I would be very happy with Smith/Caldwell and bytel amongst others.

As for forum posters well some are pretty good and some recruiters are pretty ordinary but if wingard was worth pick 4 surely he would be almost universally loved by port supporters.

 

[DT_35]

Thoughts...

St.K
In- Wingard, Pick 10 2018 (pick for Polec)
Out- 2018, 2019 first rounders

Port
In- 2018, 2019 1st rounders from St.K
Out- Wingard, pick 10

Keeps us in the 1st round this year

Yuk. You realise it could be 2 x Top 4 picks?

 

[Yawkey way]

I gather Port supplying the lube ?

Nah not even a spit in that deal.

 

[SAIINT]

When players consistently get linked to a club it is usually for good reason (where there is smoke), someone knows about it and the news has made its way into the media. Even when there is 2-3 clubs linked to a player their is always a leading contender, and most often that is where the player ends up if they move. Based on that we won’t be getting anyone of note this offseason apart from Hannebery. We are trailing in the gaff, Shiel and Wingard chases, some news snippets don’t even mention us as a contender for these guys (I am sure we are). We are a small club at the arse end of the ladder, with a coach who is on the verge of getting sacked and a list rated by many as the worst in the league...it doesn’t exactly scream destination club. As a saints supporter it’s easy to be blind to where we sit in the landscape. Start improving and playing a watchable brand of footy and the signings will come.
I still believe things will start to turn in our favour next year. I will be satisfied with hanners and pick 4 until then (not that I’d be disappointed with Wingard or Shiel!).

 

[_Maximus_12]

Alright, so I’m sick of being mediocre and if the clubs looking to finally bring in established talent that tells me they are too.
If the right price can’t be found then yeah let’s take pick 4 to the draft but fmd let’s improve.
Let’s stop being the laughing stock of the comp.
Let’s stop thinking we’re attractive because we’re in Melbourne.
Let’s stop thinking we can develop a premiership team ourselves.
Let’s stop being bloody patient with success, and let’s start flippin’ improving.
Give me established talent, pay the cost required and let’s start achieving something besides wooden spoons and the occasional super star forward.

 

[mighty_sainters]

Thoughts...

St.K
In- Wingard, Pick 10 2018 (pick for Polec)
Out- 2018, 2019 first rounders

Port
In- 2018, 2019 1st rounders from St.K
Out- Wingard, pick 10

Keeps us in the 1st round this year

If we did that I would buy the club off the AFL just so I could fold us.

 

[RWB4life]

I've been thinking about wingard and shiel and while I would love to get them I've kinda accepted they're unlikely.

I think a trade period of hannebery, scrimshaw and setterfield and a ruck in like roughead. With hickey, dunstan, weller and a future second going out good be good for the club. Take king at 4 and let him play vfl for 2 years, or Walsh if he slips and hopefully bounce back in 2019.

Another year of experience and an easier draw could see us bounce to that 12-6 range. Go hard for coniglio Kelly and everyone else that's a FA and we really challenge in 2020.

 

[lewdogs]

I've been thinking about wingard and shiel and while I would love to get them I've kinda accepted they're unlikely.

I think a trade period of hannebery, scrimshaw and setterfield and a ruck in like roughead. With hickey, dunstan, weller and a future second going out good be good for the club. Take king at 4 and let him play vfl for 2 years, or Walsh if he slips and hopefully bounce back in 2019.

Another year of experience and an easier draw could see us bounce to that 12-6 range. Go hard for coniglio Kelly and everyone else that's a FA and we really challenge in 2020.

 

[bennymc7]

I gather Port supplying the lube ?

Spitballing... but trying to somehow keep a presence in the first round, really the gamble is how we go next year imo

 

[bennymc7]

Yuk. You realise it could be 2 x Top 4 picks?

Yeh...

Obvs a disaster if we finish below 10th

 

[Strahany]

Trading out pick 4 for a player like Wingard, who has been on the decline since his first few years and demanding a lot of money relative to his output, would only be remotely palatable if we had other talent secured, like Gaff. All throughout this year, we've defending Billings stating that he is the "cream on top" and just needs to have solid players in place in order to be used to his full potential. Adding Wingard without first establishing a solid basis is just adding more cream on top of a big bowl of nothing, and everyone knows that if you eat too much cream you're going to end up sh*tting the bed.

 

[Stewart66]

Pfft Didn't they have Jakey boy going to Carlton
They know less then us and thats saying something

Agree .

Lots of things to play out , think there will be shocks from number of clubs .

Could be nearly 40 players changing clubs.

 

[Winmar2Lockett]

Except we will not have that. We have gone part way and have some new assistants.

Which will hopefully go some way to sorting out the development issues.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Tommy Wigs]

Marcus Adams make some sense as a defender? You’d imagine he wouldn’t be worth a heap pick-wise.

 

[Kilroy]

You’re a dog Stavro Nachos.

Are you referring to me?

One and the same.

 

[Strahany]

There is a huge flaw in the argument of "we can't develop players, so we should trade our first round picks for Wingard/Shiel etc", and it's really simple to expose it.

Will adding Wingard/Shiel/Player X to our current list make us a premiership contender? No. So why are we adding him? Because if we add Wingard/Shiel, and our players improve then we would be contending? But wait a second, aren't you saying that we can't develop players? So how can you possibly say that we shouldn't draft because we can't develop players, but we should trade in Wingard because when our players continue to develop, we'll be able to challenge? The mental gymnastics required to pull off that reasoning is astounding.

Either we can develop players, or we can't. If we can develop players, then we should be drafting the best possible core of talent, and capitalise on the fact that pick 4 spent on a drafted kid will keep us lower on the ladder for longer (relative to trading in an established player) and therefore increase the likelihood of getting future talent with high end picks before they develop and cause a rise in ladder positions. But if we can't develop players, then the only logical solution in such a scenario would be to trade our first round pick every year for an established player - given the state of our list at the moment (and the fact that we can't develop who we already have, according to this logic) then we would need to add 3-4 stars over the course of 3-4 years, by which point the players we have traded in are ageing and past their prime.

The reality is that a club will never be successful if you "can't develop" players, since the only other viable way of acquiring talent (trading in established players) takes too long to build a side that would be challenging for the flag. If you truly believe that we "can't develop" talent, then the only solution would be to fold, but I doubt anyone would support it; people just want to have their cake and eat it too, by claiming we can't develop talent, yet in the same breath back in a decision to over pay for players on the basis that they will excel the side whilst we simultaneously develop our existing list.

 

[Ekomaira]

I gather Port supplying the lube ?

Spitballing... but trying to somehow keep a presence in the first round, really the gamble is how we go next year imo

I thought you were going somewhere way different