List Mgmt. 2019/20 Trade/Delist/Re-sign Predictions/Opinion (now with TRADE RADIO)

[GROTTO]

In terms of the crows, I think that article intuitively makes sense. We lost a few players that on paper retain good statistical value based on performances going back over the past few years (Eddie, Sauce, JJ). We also lost a couple of very good/productive 27 year olds on Keath and Greenwood and even CEY. So on paper it makes sense that we “lost” a lot during this trade period and we didn’t convert that into a whole heap of future gain in terms of draft picks/points. Ok, I’ll cop that.

But what that doesn’t take into account is that we are in a list rebuild. The over 30s are clearly well past their best, so while there might be some book value in them in terms of PAPs or whatever, that won’t actually translate to future on field performances. I do agree that we have actually lost some tangible value in moving on Keath, Greenwood and CEY. However, we aren’t competing for a flag in the next year, so you really need to look 3, 4, 5 years ahead. At that point these players “value” to us will be a lot less than what we lost for 2020.

Im very comfortable in that assessment and us “losing” out in their analysis. I see it as a positive and some real tangible evidence that the club is doing a thorough attempt at a rebuild. Which is exactly what I wanted.

It begs the question though, if they do have decent value to a team in 2020 and that could take the team to the next value, why didnt we get more for them.

Your second point is very important and true, those players who we let go and their value in the years beyond 2020 is the primary reasons why we traded them out.

 

[Shaz2012]

It begs the question though, if they do have decent value to a team in 2020 and that could take the team to the next value, why didnt we get more for them.

Yeah. Was disappointed we let Bulldogs walk all over us in particular, but I am over it already . I hope that the points value of those picks next year are worth stocking up on. With a bit of luck, it could work out favourably. Ideally we want Edwards/Borlase/Mystery player to be really high first rounders, but no so high as to be bid on before our first pick.

Edit: Actually, I suppose the dream scenario is if they are picks 1,2 and 3 and we can trade out or up as needed.

 

[Chillum]

Milera to me just look lost didn’t know what he should be doing poor bugger

He never looked the same after he missed games from that bump that injured his shoulder

 

[jackster83]

Riley Knight played 15 games in 2019?

******* when?

His fumble 2 mins into the Hawks game set the tone for the whole season.

 

[Thinker]

His fumble 2 mins into the Hawks game set the tone for the whole season.

And...nobody else fumbles the footy? FFS Talk about witch hunt or whipping boy or whatever you want to call it. His footy hasn't improved over the past couple of seasons but name anyone's that did under that coaching and football department debacle.

 

[triggyscrewedus]

Mind boggling. The most delusional club in the AFL will never learn lol

Let me employ similar logic to illustrate how ridiculous you guys sound..


Patrick Cripps was acting toxic because the club was in shambles and asked for a 15 year contract so we showed him the door for a second round pick. Great work by the club

You guys gutted your already poor list and got very very little in return and all you can do is bag the guys who are leaving.

Maybe they were playing crap because the state of your club? Maybe they were asking for long deals as compensation for the poor running of the club?

The player managers don’t play hardball with contracts at clubs they want their players to stay at, they do it when they could take it or leave it and that’s all that happened here, not some heroic stance by the club.

Why didn’t they heroically take a stand and show Gibbs the door who has been possibly the most disruptive player in the past season? Or are you going to twist it and say Gibbs still has a lot to offer? Is Gibbs better than Betts who you ‘showed the door?’

The guys you lost played a combined 74 games last year and the best return you got was pick 37!! A pick that may not even be an AFL player at all. That is a disaster!

Very happy that those players are gone and we now have cap space for Grundy 2021.
Well played AFC.

 

[Eagleboy2011]

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It’s D-day for Riley Knight and the Adelaide Crows as talks start to decide his future

I rate Riley. Ill probably get shot down by the haters on BF who hate every AC player. Riley has not been used well to get the best out of him. He's a better prospect than MacKay who we signed up without blinking while Campo was still here. I cant see any pickups that are in his class.

 

[ams4crows]

I rate Mackay Higher than Knight currently, they're both vanilla but at least Mackay has a raspberry swirl happening with that whole breaking the lines, positioning he has.

 

[Golumless]

I rate Riley. Ill probably get shot down by the haters on BF who hate every AC player. Riley has not been used well to get the best out of him. He's a better prospect than MacKay who we signed up without blinking while Campo was still here. I cant see any pickups that are in his class.

That's hardly an achievement though, Mackay should have been off our list six years ago.

 

[tinman]

He never looked the same after he missed games from that bump that injured his shoulder

After the shoulder injury Milera was not the same. Get him fit and he'll be fine

 

[tinman]

I rate Riley. Ill probably get shot down by the haters on BF who hate every AC player. Riley has not been used well to get the best out of him. He's a better prospect than MacKay who we signed up without blinking while Campo was still here. I cant see any pickups that are in his class.

Of the out of contracts players and DFA's I agree.

Maybe Robertson who has more size and aggression, but Riley has more skills and I believe more upside.

Robertson would really only come in if we believed he could play a role for us, as that's the "type" of player he is.

The query for Knight is are we better off going for a draft pick that maybe Hamish can spot that we're better off with. Not a similar type at all, just a speculative pick.

Knight was a late pick himself, and for where he was picked he's done pretty well. It's another "trust in Hamish" call for me.

If Hamish has a speculative draft pick pegged I'll back him.

 

[Peter Doherty]

I'm liking the idea of a Carlton style trade at draft night. Who would be up for it?

A team who has a later first rounder, a team who thinks they will be around the top of the ladder and we will be around the bottom.

How about the Brisbane Lions? They have picks 16, 21, 34, 48, 52, 55

Brisbane give: 16 and 2020 first rounder
Adelaide give: 2020 first rounder

Pay off could be big for Brisbane. If we are down the bottom next year and Brisbane near the top I'd still do it. We very well could get Gould around that pick this year and will we be keeping our first next year if Lukosius is gettable?

Leaves us with 4, 16, 23, 28, 37, 45

 

[Deaneus!]

I'm liking the idea of a Carlton style trade at draft night. Who would be up for it?

A team who has a later first rounder, a team who thinks they will be around the top of the ladder and we will be around the bottom.

How about the Brisbane Lions? They have picks 16, 21, 34, 48, 52, 55

Brisbane give: 16 and 2020 first rounder
Adelaide give: 2020 first rounder

Pay off could be big for Brisbane. If we are down the bottom next year and Brisbane near the top I'd still do it. We very well could get Gould around that pick this year and will we be keeping our first next year if Lukosius is gettable?

Leaves us with 4, 16, 23, 28, 37, 45

I see merits in both arguments but the fact is we’ve been doing the “late first round pick dance” for ages and it hasn’t worked

We’d end up with what pick 16 this year and next year?

I’d rather try taking 4 to the draft and see what top end talent looks like at our club

 

[conVINCEd]

I see merits in both arguments but the fact is we’ve been doing the “late first round pick dance” for ages and it hasn’t worked

We’d end up with what pick 16 this year and next year?

I’d rather try taking 4 to the draft and see what top end talent looks like at our club

We’re still using 4 in this year’s draft under that proposal though.

 

[crows dude]

I'm liking the idea of a Carlton style trade at draft night. Who would be up for it?

A team who has a later first rounder, a team who thinks they will be around the top of the ladder and we will be around the bottom.

How about the Brisbane Lions? They have picks 16, 21, 34, 48, 52, 55

Brisbane give: 16 and 2020 first rounder
Adelaide give: 2020 first rounder

Pay off could be big for Brisbane. If we are down the bottom next year and Brisbane near the top I'd still do it. We very well could get Gould around that pick this year and will we be keeping our first next year if Lukosius is gettable?

Leaves us with 4, 16, 23, 28, 37, 45

Why would Brisbane give up two first rounders for our one first rounder next year. Or do you mean our first next year for their first this year.

 

[Shaz2012]

I rate Mackay Higher than Knight currently, they're both vanilla but at least Mackay has a raspberry swirl happening with that whole breaking the lines, positioning he has.

I get your point and agree that Mackay has outperformed Riley easily. But we should not have given Mackay a contract. Not least because we have Scholl, Hamill and McPhearson in the squad that we need to put games into. At least with Pyke and Campo gone I have new hope that these kids won’t be blocked by Mackay this year.

Really don’t understand how we came to the decision of giving him a contract before the review/coach was finalised. Maybe he had met a trigger.

 

[Peter Doherty]

We’re still using 4 in this year’s draft under that proposal though.

I did edit my original post, thinking about how many picks we need, decided not to include the Geelong trade I mentioned.

 

[Peter Doherty]

Why would Brisbane give up two first rounders for our one first rounder next year. Or do you mean our first next year for their first this year.

It's the same trade we did with Carlton last year on draft night, we gave up pick 19 and our '19 first rounder for Carlton's '19 first rounder.

 

[Peter Doherty]

I see merits in both arguments but the fact is we’ve been doing the “late first round pick dance” for ages and it hasn’t worked

We’d end up with what pick 16 this year and next year?

I’d rather try taking 4 to the draft and see what top end talent looks like at our club

I've left the Geelong swap out now, so we still keep 4 and bring in another first rounder this year.

I think we will target Lukosius so pushing our first out a bit next year doesn't bother me.

 

[jackster83]

Really don’t understand how we came to the decision of giving him a contract before the review/coach was finalised. Maybe he had met a trigger.

Campo's parting gift.

 

[Thetrader15]

Any news on MacPherson - is he up and running yet?

 

[WaynesWorld19]

 

[Vader]

I get your point and agree that Mackay has outperformed Riley easily. But we should not have given Mackay a contract. Not least because we have Scholl, Hamill and McPhearson in the squad that we need to put games into. At least with Pyke and Campo gone I have new hope that these kids won’t be blocked by Mackay this year.

Really don’t understand how we came to the decision of giving him a contract before the review/coach was finalised. Maybe he had met a trigger.

Compare Mackay's B&F ranking with those of the players who were delisted (Douglas & Otten), and those on the fringe of being deliste (Knight). The answer will be staring you in the face.

Mackay is widely reviled here on BF. Like it or not, those within the club do not share BF's opinion.

 

[Deaneus!]

We’re still using 4 in this year’s draft under that proposal though.

Apologies Peter Doherty it's been a tough few weeks at work and i didn't quite read your proposal correctly

Brisbane would only do that deal - our first next year for their late firsts this year and next - if they thought (like we did) we'd be down the bottom of the ladder and likely to give them a high pick next year

I'd like to believe we'd rebound but I'm not sure

 

[Shaz2012]

Compare Mackay's B&F ranking with those of the players who were delisted (Douglas & Otten), and those on the fringe of being deliste (Knight). The answer will be staring you in the face.

Mackay is widely reviled here on BF. Like it or not, those within the club do not share BF's opinion.

I am not one of those that revile him. I have defended him numerous times. Especially when he gets accused of not putting his body on the line, which I feel he does. I think that bloke has done everything within his god given abilities and I take nothing away from him. But I think that a forward looking club wouldnt have given him as many games. Anyway, that is in the past now. I dont believe that at his age he should have been given a contract. He should be playing SANFL this season and even as a break glass ICE option I dont think we need him. We arent/shouldnt be playing for a flag this year. Its all about developing the list and Mackay is one over age player that we didnt need.

I think Mackay has been very unfairly dealt with on BF, but the club has basically proved all those people right by giving him this extra year. Doesnt make sense to me. Especially the timing of it. If it was done after Nicks was appointed then you could say it was more of a judgement call on what Nicks needs to develop the list properly. But the timing of it will always leave question marks over it. Anyway, I am happy overall with what we did and with the guys we got rid of before him. Basically apart from Douglas and Otten we got some value for all of them which we wouldnt have got for Mackay. So out of Douglas, Otten and Mackay, 2 out of 3 aint bad. And all three have been excellent loyal servants to the club.