Game Day 2019 Brownlow- Us & the rest

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muttley45

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I reckon there would be a very strong correlation between Supercoach rankings and Brownlow top 10, further proof of the way that particular item is influencing the game (umpires/AFL HQ/media etc,etc) pretty sad state of affairs really, under the current structure, not sure if this will ever change to be honest.
 

Mcarcherey

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Going over the results now, the biggest question for me out of our players is how Simpkin only got 1 vote? He had 3 or 4 very high quality games, with 2 of them being BOG I thought. Feels like Taz should have got more as well. The rest seem just about right. Also, didn't feel like Higgins had quite as a good a season, but for him to poll 18 despite missing 5 games shows how they often give votes on reputation. He's had a good season for sure, but perhaps Cunnington should have had a few more.
he's not popular enough. it's all a popularity contest. cunnington got 10 votes ffs, says it all really.
 

Passmore

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I think we have to lose the notion that the Brownlow medal in any way reflects the best player in the competition and accept it for what it is...an award for the player who catches the umpire’s eye each game.

It’s got me wondering what award most legitimately represents the best player in the competition.

It can’t be the AFLPA awards when the members who vote seem to take pride in telling anyone who’ll listen how little footy they watch.

Maybe the coaches?


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The Big O

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I think we have to lose the notion that the Brownlow medal in any way reflects the best player in the competition and accept it for what it is...an award for the player who catches the umpire’s eye each game.

It’s got me wondering what award most legitimately represents the best player in the competition.

It can’t be the AFLPA awards when the members who vote seem to take pride in telling anyone who’ll listen how little footy they watch.

Maybe the coaches?


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ABC Grandstand player of the year for me. Voted by respected ex players (such as Boomer, Stan Alves) who are there to analyze the match. It's nice to here them explain the votes and often the 2 and 1 votes go to players who played their role well, not just racked up possessions.

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Marstermind

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1. Drop the 'fairest'. A suspended player isn't necessarily more unfair than one who's picked up a bunch of fines or even went through unreported.

2. Give the umpires a break. They have enough to do. AFL appoints a panel of 18 respected ex-players (Maybe nominated by the clubs?) whose sole job is to go to games and pick the best players. No media flogs or other commitments just pick the best players.

3. Get with the 21st century. Use replays to analyse and scrutinise play and have access to stats. See what each player's role was and how well they did it.

4. Have time to get the best decision. No reason the votes have to be in within a hour of the game.

5. Consider scrapping the 3-2-1. No system is perfect but it's worth having a think about the merits and flaws of this one.

I have nothing against Fyfe or any recent winners, but the Brownlow is another AFL example of claiming best practice and elite procedures, when the reality is an antiquated, shoddy system that produces the best result as often as a blind man at a dartboard.
 
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Hearts to hearts

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sirswampthing on Twitter with the longish list of players this season who polled 10 coaches votes in games but no Brownlow votes. None of ours - notably none of the front-runners, reinforcing that the umpires see more of what players they expect to be good are doing.
 

ferball

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All of them I’d say.

If his wife can’t settle in Geelong, what hope has she got in Melbourne?


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If she's got strong family ties there then its not even a matter of how cosmopolitan and fast moving Geelong is or what a struggle it is to keep up with the pace of it.
 

ferball

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1. Drop the 'fairest'. A suspended player isn't necessarily more unfair than one who's picked up a bunch of fines or even went through unreported.

2. Give the umpires a break. They have enough to do. AFL appoints a panel of 18 respected ex-players (Maybe nominated by the clubs?) whose sole job is to go to games and pick the best players. No media flogs or other commitments just pick the best players.

3. Get with the 21st century. Use replays to analyse and scrutinise play and have access to stats. See what each player's role was and how well they did it.

4. Have time to get the best decision. No reason the votes have to be in within a hour of the game.

5. Consider scrapping the 3-2-1. No system is perfect but it's worth having a think about the merits and flaws of this one.

I have nothing against Fyfe or any recent winners, but the Brownlow is another AFL example of claiming best practice and elite procedures, when the reality is an antiquated, shoddy system that produces the best result as often as a blind man at a dartboard.
Good post. I agree with all those ideas fwiw.

My only quibble is that a blind man with good darts technique would probably shit all over the Brownlow in terms of results. I wonder if it'd be easier to play with your my eyes shut sometimes..
 

ferball

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sirswampthing on Twitter with the longish list of players this season who polled 10 coaches votes in games but no Brownlow votes. None of ours - notably none of the front-runners, reinforcing that the umpires see more of what players they expect to be good are doing.
Its where they direct their attention. They're primed to do it by being in the footy industry and most likely in a bit of a footy bubble. 25 plus possessions to a name player and a few spectacular things and they are at the forefront of the umps mind when its time to vote.
 

darko

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I thought Jacobs got on top of him and shut him down/curbed his influence after a poor start.
Not what I remember. And that's fine, no tagger will have 100% record. Jacobs has enough scalps to be considered #1 tagger along with DeBoer.
 

ferball

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I think ppl are getting confused. Fyfe was one of the few Jacobs couldn’t get a hold off. Tagging duty was removed and Jacobs started winning some ball instead.

I remember this game and I remember thinking something very similar to that at the time, early in the game, however by the end of the game i'd changed my mind and then Ben fought back and got on top of Fyfe and that helped us. WEnt and checked the match report and Fyfe dominated the first quarter, during which time freo scored 22 of their 58 points. (They led by 8 at 1/4 time.) Fyfe had nearly half his possessions for the game in that first quarter. (13 of 31)

And this is lifted directly from that match report:

Tagger Ben Jacobs was outstanding for the Roos, bouncing back after Dockers superstar Nat Fyfe (31, eight clearances) took him to the cleaners in the opening quarter.

Fyfe racked up 13 disposals, four clearances and booted a goal before quarter-time but Jacobs limited the Brownlow Medal favourite's influence from then onwards, and hurt the Freo skipper the other way, finishing with 29 disposals, nine tackles and a goal.


And point 1 of the 5 talking points that went with the match report:

1. Jacobs isn’t a one-trick pony
Ben Jacobs has been good this season, but the challenge of completely nullifying Nat Fyfe’s impact proved too much. Not many taggers have the repertoire to follow Fyfe wherever he goes, let alone the body size to stop him. The Fremantle skipper was influential in the midfield, forward line and on the few occasions he deputised in the ruck, showing poise and class on a day that lacked any shade of subtlety. Fyfe finished with 31 disposals, 24 contested possessions, eight tackles and a goal and may well have banked another three Brownlow votes. And that’s not to say Jacobs played badly – in fact, he’d mount a pretty serious case for best-on-ground honours with 29 disposals, 18 contested possessions, nine tackles and a goal. Jacobs also limited the quality of Fyfe’s clearances, which had a significant effect on Fremantle’s ball movement.


That's pretty much how I remember it too - Jacobs stopped Fyfe, after fyfe dominated early and that meant we got on top, took the lead and eventually won.
 

shimaburnsgrieg

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I remember this game and I remember thinking something very similar to that at the time, early in the game, however by the end of the game i'd changed my mind and then Ben fought back and got on top of Fyfe and that helped us. WEnt and checked the match report and Fyfe dominated the first quarter, during which time freo scored 22 of their 58 points. (They led by 8 at 1/4 time.) Fyfe had nearly half his possessions for the game in that first quarter. (13 of 31)

And this is lifted directly from that match report:

Tagger Ben Jacobs was outstanding for the Roos, bouncing back after Dockers superstar Nat Fyfe (31, eight clearances) took him to the cleaners in the opening quarter.

Fyfe racked up 13 disposals, four clearances and booted a goal before quarter-time but Jacobs limited the Brownlow Medal favourite's influence from then onwards, and hurt the Freo skipper the other way, finishing with 29 disposals, nine tackles and a goal.


And point 1 of the 5 talking points that went with the match report:

1. Jacobs isn’t a one-trick pony
Ben Jacobs has been good this season, but the challenge of completely nullifying Nat Fyfe’s impact proved too much. Not many taggers have the repertoire to follow Fyfe wherever he goes, let alone the body size to stop him. The Fremantle skipper was influential in the midfield, forward line and on the few occasions he deputised in the ruck, showing poise and class on a day that lacked any shade of subtlety. Fyfe finished with 31 disposals, 24 contested possessions, eight tackles and a goal and may well have banked another three Brownlow votes. And that’s not to say Jacobs played badly – in fact, he’d mount a pretty serious case for best-on-ground honours with 29 disposals, 18 contested possessions, nine tackles and a goal. Jacobs also limited the quality of Fyfe’s clearances, which had a significant effect on Fremantle’s ball movement.


That's pretty much how I remember it too - Jacobs stopped Fyfe, after fyfe dominated early and that meant we got on top, took the lead and eventually won.
That article is broadly right Ferbs but you can be assured Jacobs didn't tag Fyfe after qtr time - at least not in the manner that he was doing in the first qtr. Jacob's played his own game after 1/4 time and won the ball well as an offensive weapon.
 

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