Game Day 2019 Draft - picks 23, 55, 60, 65, 68, 83 Thursday 28 November : Mead + 2 picks?

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JakeNeadeFan

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Nov 25, 2019
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Also Taj Schofield looks like he will be an elite player with Sam Mitchell skills and Robbie Gray elusiveness. Doesnt get alot of the ball, and is a little small/short but i am 100% confident he will be a first 22 player for us for most of his career

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After watching him in the Futures Game I agree with this. At the moment he only gets the ball ~15 times a game, but every disposal finds a target in a good position and he is very good in traffic.

if he can start getting 20+ possessions a game I think he is a first round draft selection.
 

philthy05

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His father played 250 games for the magpies how is he not eligible

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Played like 193ish? Before port entered the afl. Stupid rules designed to fu** us over

The rules are doing exactly what the sanfl and afl wanted.
 

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Interstater

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Only 14th on this list of most games played before 1997, what a slacker.
Also only 4 premierships.

If only we had been a real football club, like those Victorian ones we often beat.

:rolleyes::mad::thumbsdown:

Russell Ebert1968–1978, 1980–1985391
Greg Phillips1976–1982, 1987–1993343
Darren Smith1984–1996343
Tim Ginever1983–1997314
Kym Kinnear1973–1984, 1986272
Stephen Williams1979–1986, 1988–1995268
John Cahill1958–1973264
Darrell Cahill1969–1982263
Geof Motley1953–1966258
Brian Cunningham1971–1983256
Rohan Smith1985–1990, 1992–1997251
Tim Evans1975–1986248
Ted Whelan1949–1961248
Daryl Borlase SANFL Premiership trophy icon.jpgSANFL Premiership trophy icon.jpgSANFL Premiership trophy icon.jpgSANFL Premiership trophy icon.jpgStarIconGold.png1985–1998246
Robert B. Quinn1933–1944239
George Fiacchi1985–1997236
Paul Northeast1987, 1989–2000235
Jeff Potter1959–1970235
 
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Holden Hillbilly

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Only 14th on this list of most games played before 1997, what a slacker.
Also only 4 premierships.

If only we had been a real football club, like those Victorian ones we often beat.

:rolleyes::mad::thumbsdown:

Russell Ebert1968–1978, 1980–19851968,391295
Greg Phillips1976–1982, 1987–19931976,34393
Darren Smith1984–19961984,343456
Tim Ginever1983–19971983,314302
Kym Kinnear1973–1984, 19861973,272125
Stephen Williams1979–1986, 1988–19951979,268288
John Cahill1958–19731958, round 5264286
Darrell Cahill1969–19821969,263375
Geof Motley1953–19661953,258156
Brian Cunningham1971–19831971,256428
Rohan Smith1985–1990, 1992–19971985,251247
Tim Evans1975–19861975,2481044
Ted Whelan1949–19611949,24891
Daryl Borlase SANFL Premiership trophy icon.jpgSANFL Premiership trophy icon.jpgSANFL Premiership trophy icon.jpgSANFL Premiership trophy icon.jpgStarIconGold.png1985–19981985,246328
Robert B. Quinn1933–19441933, round 2239386
George Fiacchi1985–19971985,23653
Paul Northeast1987, 1989–20001987,23511
Jeff Potter1959–19701970,235289

That port magpies (and north, west, WWT & centrals) rule ended in October 2017 i.e. 20 years after we entered the AFL. We now only have Power F/S eligibility.
 

crafty_bernardo

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Was just contemplating how much of an influence Brett Anderson may have in our latest drafting, and then came across on the staff listing Alex Pisani (Football IT Support), wonder if they're related to our new draftee.
 

VineValerian

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Or just accept the rule because they apply to all the clubs in the AFL.
Or we just place an early bid on him next year that the Camries aren't willing to match (with the obvious proviso of if he is talented enough)?
 

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Fade to Gray

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Or we just place an early bid on him next year that the Camries aren't willing to match (with the obvious proviso of if he is talented enough)?
Going to be hard when we don't have a 1st round pick, and if he was talented enough to justify an early pick, the they will match.

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MrPlow

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Also Taj Schofield looks like he will be an elite player with Sam Mitchell skills and Robbie Gray elusiveness. Doesnt get alot of the ball, and is a little small/short but i am 100% confident he will be a first 22 player for us for most of his career

On VOG-L09 using BigFooty.com mobile app
I haven’t seen Taj in action but at 175cm he either needs to grown or be incredibly elite...or be a forward pocket goal sneak
 

JakeNeadeFan

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Offtopic, but you have to wonder why we showed no interest in Robertson at all given some clubs clearly loved him (as Melbourne showed in that vid). Yes we have many "kick-and-hope" inside mid types in Wines, SPP, Atley and Drew. But every one of those players has question marks, whether that is injuries, loyalty, offield etc. Quite frankly, our next generation midfield is inconsistent at best, and rubbish at worst.
 

shewho

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Are there other teams?
Offtopic, but you have to wonder why we showed no interest in Robertson at all given some clubs clearly loved him (as Melbourne showed in that vid). Yes we have many "kick-and-hope" inside mid types in Wines, SPP, Atley and Drew. But every one of those players has question marks, whether that is injuries, loyalty, offield etc. Quite frankly, our next generation midfield is inconsistent at best, and rubbish at worst.
You’re forgetting Houston, Rozee, Butters, Mead, Schofield. Bergman and Georgiades May also end up midfielders. Williams over Robertson was a needs pick.
 

Tibbs

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Andrew Moore may have ended up as a midfielder.
He was a midfielder.... Just not a good one!

You really should be asking the question...If Robertson was so sought after, why wasn't he picked earlier? Williams was a brilliant pick up at our pick! I would also have been happy with this Robertson, but both will be afl players
 

JakeNeadeFan

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He was a midfielder.... Just not a good one!

You really should be asking the question...If Robertson was so sought after, why wasn't he picked earlier? Williams was a brilliant pick up at our pick! I would also have been happy with this Robertson, but both will be afl players
My point would be that if you want good midfielders, you draft players that have played underage football in the midfield. Yes Nathan Fyfe and Cripps were drafted as forwards and then turned into elite midfielders, but these are exceptions. For every Nathan Fyfe type there are 10 Andrew Moore and Darcy Fogarty types who have "prototype-midfielder" potential which amounts to nothing.

With regards to Robertson's draft position, I highly recommend you watch the Melbourne draft video. They were desperate to get him and were shocked he lasted to the point he did. Supposedly half of the comp were in a similar boat, and ultimately Brisbane gave up significant capital to get him. If Brisbane had retained their original pick 16 they would have picked him there, so they clearly rated him very highly and probably though they got a bargain at where they got him.

The only reason why he lasted to that pick was because the teams who had picks in the 15-20 range (so Geelong, us, Richmond and Carlton) had no interest. This could have been because these teams were picking on needs at these picks like us. If they didn't rate him I think this is a massive mistake...Thomson Dow and Philp are objectively worse than Robertson and it truly boggles the mind teams would pick these players over the U18 All Australian Captain.

I think its laughable to say Williams is a brilliant pick up. His 2019 was rubbish so we essentially drafted him on his U17 form. The exact same thing was said about Darcy Fogarty. It's equivalent to saying that Melbourne are a brilliant team because they had a good 2018. Also regardless of Williams' actual ability, by selecting him we have drafted 3 forwards in one year, and as I pointed out earlier our core stock of true midfielders is terrible.

To top it off, we still could have got Williams if we wanted at an earlier pick and drafted Robertson instead of Georgiades and Bergman. In my ideal world we still draft Williams.
 

PJ Power

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My point would be that if you want good midfielders, you draft players that have played underage football in the midfield. Yes Nathan Fyfe and Cripps were drafted as forwards and then turned into elite midfielders, but these are exceptions. For every Nathan Fyfe type there are 10 Andrew Moore and Darcy Fogarty types who have "prototype-midfielder" potential which amounts to nothing.

With regards to Robertson's draft position, I highly recommend you watch the Melbourne draft video. They were desperate to get him and were shocked he lasted to the point he did. Supposedly half of the comp were in a similar boat, and ultimately Brisbane gave up significant capital to get him. If Brisbane had retained their original pick 16 they would have picked him there, so they clearly rated him very highly and probably though they got a bargain at where they got him.

The only reason why he lasted to that pick was because the teams who had picks in the 15-20 range (so Geelong, us, Richmond and Carlton) had no interest. This could have been because these teams were picking on needs at these picks like us. If they didn't rate him I think this is a massive mistake...Thomson Dow and Philp are objectively worse than Robertson and it truly boggles the mind teams would pick these players over the U18 All Australian Captain.

I think its laughable to say Williams is a brilliant pick up. His 2019 was rubbish so we essentially drafted him on his U17 form. The exact same thing was said about Darcy Fogarty. It's equivalent to saying that Melbourne are a brilliant team because they had a good 2018. Also regardless of Williams' actual ability, by selecting him we have drafted 3 forwards in one year, and as I pointed out earlier our core stock of true midfielders is terrible.

To top it off, we still could have got Williams if we wanted at an earlier pick and drafted Robertson instead of Georgiades and Bergman. In my ideal world we still draft Williams.
I agree with a lot of this and would have been happy if we had selected Robertson, and even more so if one of our picks had landed Kemp.

Having said that, it looks like we have knowingly taken a high risk-very high reward approach. In selecting Bergman, Georgiades and Williams, we have three players who have each been hindered at one point or another in the past 2 years by injury. As such, their 2019 form was either non-existent (Georgiades), patchy (Bergman) or disappointing (Williams). With each of these guys, the ceiling still seems extremely high. They are powerful, explosive types with x-factor. Each has goal sense and very good contested marking ability for his height. I'm ok with this. The key now is to develop each of them to meet their extremely high potential. If this is purely as forwards for each of them, I still think that's ok.

If we can keep Wines and he can return to his best form consistently, then a centre-square midfield combining Wines, Houston, Rozee and Mead is a very good starting point, with Duursma, Amon, Butters, SPP and Drew the current support cast aged 25 and under. Schofield will be added to that group. We still need another 1-2 high output A-grade midfielders to bring in over the next couple of drafts but it's getting there.

F: Williams....Marshall.....Hayes

HF: Butters.....Georgiades.....Bergman

C: Amon.....Wines......Duursma

R: Ladhams......Houston.....Rozee

Forward/mid depth: Mead, Schofield, SPP, Drew, Farrell (followed by a big gap to Patmore, Atley, Woodcock, Cox, Burgoyne)
 
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JakeNeadeFan

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I agree with a lot of this and would have been happy if we had selected Robertson, and even more so if one of our picks had landed Kemp.

Having said that, it looks like we have knowingly taken a high risk-very high reward approach. In selecting Bergman, Georgiades and Williams, we have three players who have each been hindered at one point or another in the past 2 years by injury. As such, their 2019 form was either non-existent (Georgiades), patchy (Bergman) or disappointing (Williams). With each of these guys, the ceiling still seems extremely high. They are powerful, explosive types with x-factor. Each has goal sense and very good contested marking ability for his height. I'm ok with this. The key now is to develop each of them to meet their extremely high potential. If this is purely as forwards for each of them, I still think that's ok.
I think it's fair to say the club successfully executed on their intended strategy, which as you have pointed out was to get some high ceiling players. I also think it's fair to say in these days of high end analytics that they have some data to back up the decision. However, at a fundamental level it seems like a flawed strategy in that it doesn't have an appropriate risk attitude... you don't invest limited capital (==draft picks) into risky projects (==players) unless you can take the loss (==all of them going bust). GWS can take a punt on speculative players as they have the list to sustain failure. With our list we can't take afford for them to all go bust. Now I am coming at this from a portfolio management perspective but the principals are the same.

If we can keep Wines and he can return to his best form consistently, then a centre-square midfield combining Wines, Houston, Rozee and Mead is a very good starting point, with Duursma, Amon, Butters, SPP and Drew the current support cast aged 25 and under. Schofield will be added to that group. We still need another 1-2 high output A-grade midfielders to bring in over the next couple of drafts but it's getting there.
I just think there are too many "ifs" here. If Wines gets back to form. If Rozee transitions successfully to midfield. If SPP gets his crap together. If Drew stops being perpetually injured. Our midfield is in desperate need of some sure bets. I'm not saying that Robertson 100% guaranteed becomes an A-grade midfielder, but his floor is probably a Jack Graham type, which I'd take at the moment. Personally I think its much more likely he becomes the next James Worpel and in that case Brisbane have got a bargain.
 

Tibbs

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My point would be that if you want good midfielders, you draft players that have played underage football in the midfield. Yes Nathan Fyfe and Cripps were drafted as forwards and then turned into elite midfielders, but these are exceptions. For every Nathan Fyfe type there are 10 Andrew Moore and Darcy Fogarty types who have "prototype-midfielder" potential which amounts to nothing.

With regards to Robertson's draft position, I highly recommend you watch the Melbourne draft video. They were desperate to get him and were shocked he lasted to the point he did. Supposedly half of the comp were in a similar boat, and ultimately Brisbane gave up significant capital to get him. If Brisbane had retained their original pick 16 they would have picked him there, so they clearly rated him very highly and probably though they got a bargain at where they got him.

The only reason why he lasted to that pick was because the teams who had picks in the 15-20 range (so Geelong, us, Richmond and Carlton) had no interest. This could have been because these teams were picking on needs at these picks like us. If they didn't rate him I think this is a massive mistake...Thomson Dow and Philp are objectively worse than Robertson and it truly boggles the mind teams would pick these players over the U18 All Australian Captain.

I think its laughable to say Williams is a brilliant pick up. His 2019 was rubbish so we essentially drafted him on his U17 form. The exact same thing was said about Darcy Fogarty. It's equivalent to saying that Melbourne are a brilliant team because they had a good 2018. Also regardless of Williams' actual ability, by selecting him we have drafted 3 forwards in one year, and as I pointed out earlier our core stock of true midfielders is terrible.

To top it off, we still could have got Williams if we wanted at an earlier pick and drafted Robertson instead of Georgiades and Bergman. In my ideal world we still draft Williams.
It's "laughable"? Wow, you saying you know better than our team of recruiters who have worked on it for a few years? I just see Robertson a slight upgrade on Atley or Drew. Woopidoo that Melbourne were falling over themselves to get him, their recruiting over the years has sucked!

It's all just opinion mate, don't get too carried away on over-rating yours!
 

JakeNeadeFan

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It's "laughable"? Wow, you saying you know better than our team of recruiters who have worked on it for a few years? I just see Robertson a slight upgrade on Atley or Drew. Woopidoo that Melbourne were falling over themselves to get him, their recruiting over the years has sucked!

It's all just opinion mate, don't get too carried away on over-rating yours!
Yes it is laughable. James Worpel, Sam Hayes and Sydney Stack were brilliant pick ups at their respective draft positions. I reserve superlatives for selections that actually deserve them.

I'm not saying that I know better than our team of recruiters. If anything I am saying that our list management strategy is rubbish, not our recruiting. However, the implication that our recruiters should be free from scrutiny just because they are "professionals" is foolish in the same way that saying Ken Hinkley is a "professional" head coach and makes all the right decisions is foolish. Our recruiting team have made some very obvious, very costly blunders over the years...Ben Jacobs and Mitch Harvey come to mind.
 

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