Mega Thread 2019 List Management, Free Agency & Trade thread #2

[Purple_Turtle]

Not getting James aish is NOT going to be any significant loss in terms overall football results or play next year.

Only if you think you cover both our wings effectively with our current talent (ie. Colyer or Bewley.)

 

[ImperialPurple]

I really wish I understood the points system properly. I get that you have to use points you have available to use on players you have an affiliation with if someone else bids on them. That part is easy. But I don't understand how people are saying that we can trade back into a better position with picks that have lower values than what we're trying to trade with. I'm discombobulated.

 

[Superkoops]

I said that but it was as much an idea of what we give up in value. I would have thought we could do it for pick 56 for example.

Wanted the power the three future 2nds would give us on draft night

Aish is worth much more than a pick in 50's

For eg we traded in Matera for about pick 42. We got 41 for Crozier. We got Hamling for late 30's pick equivalent.

Let's say Collingwood finish where the Eagles finished. Their third rounder will be about 49/50

Let's say St Kilda finish around North/Adelaide range - second pick 27/28/29 & fourth pick 65/66

Our pick 69 likely to move up a couple of picks after list lodgement.

28 + 65 > 50 + 67 = pick 41

That is start of third round value. Lots of variables but the range will be 38-44. To me that is decent for Aish. No doubt if we had future 3rd that would have been the pick and we prob would have had to sweeten.

 

[wayToGo_]

I really wish I understood the points system properly. I get that you have to use points you have available to use on players you have an affiliation with if someone else bids on them. That part is easy. But I don't understand how people are saying that we can trade back into a better position with picks that have lower values than what we're trying to trade with. I'm discombobulated.

Say we have picks #7, #10, #22, #56, #79... We pick a player @ #7, then another @ #10. Then someone bids on Henry at #12. We use pick #22 to match the bid plus #56 to make up the points. So our next available pick is #79. We have an opportunity to package up future picks (and any remaining picks we have this draft) and live trade for another pick. So we might trade for GC's #15 - and then we get another player at that pick. If we had got that pick before the bid had happened then it'd have been used to match the bid (the next pick gets used and so on)

 

[Alfonz]

I still can't believe what we did with the Aish trade. Hopeless. It's like Bell went to his baggage handler ... "Here, have a go mate, I gave you a chance last year and you got Colyer. See if you can get someone better this time."

 

[Bring back Drum]

I really wish I understood the points system properly. I get that you have to use points you have available to use on players you have an affiliation with if someone else bids on them. That part is easy. But I don't understand how people are saying that we can trade back into a better position with picks that have lower values than what we're trying to trade with. I'm discombobulated.

discombobulated
adjective
HUMOROUS

1. confused and disconcerted.
   "he is looking a little pained and discombobulated"
   

Just looking for a friend!

 

[estibador]

In saying that, Aish is far more preferable to the other names we've been linked with this window. Longmuir's worked pretty extensively with him and you'd have to think that he had a hand in us pushing pretty hard for the deal to go through. It's also a pretty fair assumption that he could've explored other options in Victoria or back in SA...or simply refuse to nominate us, so I think he's at least brought in to JL's project.

I've seen a lot of people mention we should trust JLo's judgement on Aish since he's worked with him closely, but what I think is a great sign is that a non-WA player like Aish is happy to sign with us because of JLo. Reflects well on our choice of coach.

 

[fnerd]

Only if you think you cover both our wings effectively with our current talent (ie. Colyer or Bewley.)

Yes.
Lucky those two aren’t our only options for the wings then

 

[Alfonz]

Aish doesn't have to reach amazing heights to be great value. If he gets near his pick #7 potential we will be thinking of him as the cheapest piece of our puzzle.

That's not the point. The point is we should have only given up a 3rd/4th rounder for him and kept that pick 20 (I'm predicting Saints to be hopeless) to help trade into this year's draft for another of the WA kids this year.

 

[Superkoops]

Are we in the mix to get Menadue as a DFA? I haven't bothered listening to the media fools but wondered if there had been any mention about him.

What about Nic Robertson who we were leading the exceptionally fast paced race for?

Also looks like we'll be having a PSD with some genuine interest. The agent for Martin said he won't be nominating for ND and instead will nominate for PSD. On a separate matter Dover said Jesse Hogan had a favourable medical report post surgery.

 

[Vintage]

I’m not a fan of analysing trade effectiveness by looking at ‘points values’ when comparing it to players we’ve traded out.
The points system is an arbitrary measure of value.
On this basis, it was always going to be an uphill battle getting back value for Hill - you just can’t replace a guy like him with a draft pick (or even multiple picks). It’s bit us with his homesick missus but what can FFC do... not sure we’ve quite made the best of it, but I’ll take saints picks without whinging about it.

On inwards player trades I look at value of player by previous performance and team needs (moneyball)
Acres may be a good replacement for Mundy, but not sure he’ll fit our needs as a winger.
Aish I’m unsure of, strong marking little guy that’s not strong enough for mid duties so relegated to defence of late. Maybe we can transition him to that elusive high half forward role ? He has the traits required ...
have to trust Jlo on this one


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I know it’s not the only way to measure Hill value - and I didn’t want him to go - but considering we paid pick 23 for 3 years of Hill plus pick 10, etc we have done pretty damn well out of him.

 

[Bring back Drum]

Menadue as a DFA anyone?

Belly mentioned late he was still under consideration & at that point I thought it’s probably a bit late to get that done.

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

Aish is worth much more than a pick in 50's

For eg we traded in Matera for about pick 42. We got 41 for Crozier. We got Hamling for late 30's pick equivalent.

Let's say Collingwood finish where the Eagles finished. Their third rounder will be about 49/50

Let's say St Kilda finish around North/Adelaide range - second pick 27/28/29 & fourth pick 65/66

Our pick 69 likely to move up a couple of picks after list lodgement.

28 + 65 > 50 + 67 = pick 41

That is start of third round value. Lots of variables but the range will be 38-44. To me that is decent for Aish. No doubt if we had future 3rd that would have been the pick and we prob would have had to sweeten.

I dont disgaree he's worth more thatn a pick in the 50's, wasnt really my point.

Just thought it was a good chance for an easy win for a guy being pushed out. We paid for Aish with a fair price, I dont think we should have had to

 

[Deathly]

I'm pretty satisfied with this trade period, I was always of the opinion that we needed to bring some kind of experience in for what was going out and we did that. Sure individually Aish & Acres aren't direct replacements for Langdon & B.Hill in general, although who really knows. There's a good chance they can have a similar kind of impact on our side under Longmuirs' system compared to what the exiting players had under Lyons'

 

[Joao]

Don't reckon Menadue is likely given both Acres and Aish can play wing.

 

[wayToGo_]

I dont disgaree he's worth more thatn a pick in the 50's, wasnt really my point.

Just thought it was a good chance for an easy win for a guy being pushed out. We paid for Aish with a fair price, I dont think we should have had to

The rule is if you end up with pick #69 you win trade period. The Aish trade was critical in bringing home the win.

 

[raffrox]

According to AFL.com.au

Verdict: Got a great haul for Bradley Hill, but lost a couple of crucial runners in both him and Ed Langdon. Blake Acres and James Aish are steals who the club gave up very little for, while it will still end up with two top-10 picks and perhaps a third first-round selection should it match an early bid for Academy prospect Liam Henry.

Ranked us 7th.

 

[Joao]

We did ok (Aish future 2nd aside) as long as the Henry bid comes after 10. Could easily get the same player with 10 as we would have with 6 with the way this draft seems to be rated.

 

[wayToGo_]

According to BetterThanAFL.com.au

Verdict: Got a great haul for Bradley Hill, but lost a couple of crucial runners in both him and Ed Langdon. But one has already peaked and the other can't kick. Blake Acres and James Aish are steals and future GOATs who the club gave up very little for, while they will still end up with two top-10 picks, will likely magic up a couple more and another first-round selection by matching the expected bid for Academy prospect Liam Henry. Most important of all they now have pick #69.

Ranked us 1st.

 

[Danny82]

I was happy to get aish as someone that can play back pocket well in an area we lacked. I was out off by the price paid not because 41 seemed high, but the opportunity lost of bundling up 2 2nds for a first this year.

Ned guy from Collingwood, said it wasn’t a salary dump. We approached them about aish and they were ok to trade him given it is a better deal than they would’ve been able to offer. So they didn’t need the $$s of the books, we just offered him a much better deal and didn’t want to stand in his way.

There is no doubt for me aish is straight into best 22 in back pocket, so paying around pick 41 for a 23 year best 22 player is ok.

On another topic, if a bid for Henry is made at say pick 20, do we lose 22 and then get back a pick in the 30’s? I don’t quite get how that works when not all the points are used.

 

[sherrif]

I dont disgaree he's worth more thatn a pick in the 50's, wasnt really my point.

Just thought it was a good chance for an easy win for a guy being pushed out. We paid for Aish with a fair price, I dont think we should have had to

You realize that the trade happened seconds before the deadline. It was a choice of either getting him at that price or not getting him at all. There wasnt another option and clearly Collingwood could have kept him. In the end we decided to do the trade because his former line coach and our current knew coach must rate him more than people on here. I think Ill go with his view. Collingwood clearly had no problems keeping under the salary cap if they kept him or they would have accepted a lower offer and not waited to the last possible moment to sign off on the trade. I still remember the draft preview of Aish. He was described as pure class with a ball in hand and very athletic. We need those types of players desperately.

 

[Taylor]

That's not the point. The point is we should have only given up a 3rd/4th rounder for him and kept that pick 20 (I'm predicting Saints to be hopeless) to help trade into this year's draft for another of the WA kids this year.

Collingwood paid #26 and #33 for Aish.

We paid a single pick between there, next year.

We scammed a talent out of them.

 

[showemhowtorock]

According to BetterThanAFL.com.au

Verdict: Got a great haul for Bradley Hill, but lost a couple of crucial runners in both him and Ed Langdon. But one has already peaked and the other can't kick. Blake Acres and James Aish are steals and future GOATs who the club gave up very little for, while they will still end up with two top-10 picks, will likely magic up a couple more and another first-round selection by matching the expected bid for Academy prospect Liam Henry. Most important of all they now have pick #69.

Ranked us 1st.

betterthanafl.com.au staff writer sounds like a freo supporter, but he is 100% right obviously we were the best by far

 

[ChimpaWompa]

It wouldn't have been a Fremantle trade period without us throwing future 2nd rounders out there like confetti

 

[Van_Dyke]

It wouldn't have been a Fremantle trade period without us throwing future 2nd rounders out there like confetti

Last year was the only year we have done a trade involving a future 2nd round pick and I for one found it strange and unusual