Play Nice 2019 Non AFL Admin, Crowds, Ratings, Participation etc thread

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NoobPie

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 21, 2016
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Are the ratings broken up into adult & jnr? When is one considered an "adult"? If so, what are the corresponding ratings for junior viewers in AF & soccer?
The adult qualifier was my own based on what was my understanding (in line with Wookie's comment above) that ratings are only captured by Oztam for people over 15.....I'm now thinking this may be incorrect on reflection but wookie would know better!


Where did the "100 million adult hours" figure, for all local & foreign soccer live viewing hours, come from? And how accurate is this figure? If correct, it is very impressive.
Can you provide an estimate of what the various media organisations in Australia are paying for foreign domestic Leagues & international etc. soccer broadcasts?
I made it up as a very generous estimate using the 15m hours for the A League as a baseline. I actually think it would be a lot lower than that, particularly in a non-world cup year

Point was though even if you added up all the live soccer consumed - the eurosnobs, the bitters, the jingoistic spike at world cup time as well as the A League - under the most generous assumption you would still be barely half the NRL.


In the BF "Next Media Rights" thread, you very ambitiously claimed the AFL can probably expect another c. 50% increase in its total Rights, in the next Agreement. This conflicts with what virtually all MSM independent experts are predicting (flat, or less). Also, AFL average ratings, IIRC, have decreased by c. 15% (total FTA & Foxtel) for H & A matches over c. 15 years (A very worrying, long term decline, for the AFL; & goal scoring- with its very valuable, additional advertising time slots- is also in decline).

What is the basis for your belief a 50% increase in the Rights $ is again likely?
BBT, my old internet friend, please feel free to respond in that thread to the relevant post. I set out a fair bit of rationale there

I don't think I have read anyone I'd acknowledge as an "MSM independent expert". If you are able to provide a link I am happy to respond



IMO, it appears probable a 19th team, Tasmania, will enter the AFL, c. 2025. This will add an extra 11 H & A matches pa- & these 11 matches will probably be played in Prime Time on Thursday nights (making 19 Thursday night matches pa, from the current 8). The AFL season will go from 198 - 209 H & A games, an increase of 6 %.
What do you think these 11 extra Thurs. night Prime Time matches might be worth for the AFL Rights?

I think having more thursday night games would enhance the value of the FTA rights. Not sure how much but at an uneducated guess I would say in the low tens of millions per annum

The growth next time round will be driven by new technology
 

Gigantor

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May 13, 2012
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Speaking of demos, the 16 to 39 age bracket on Friday nights is often very, very strong for the AFL.
In fact, dare I say it, far, far stronger than anything the A-League can come up with.
 

NoobPie

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 21, 2016
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So the A-league has record ratings and crowds at the moment. They are currently at the peak and has the full engagement of the football community.
No it got its record ratings and crowds whenever it had a burst of novelty about it - eg in its first few years then after the wanderers came in and del piero was playing

Each time it has then regressed back to the mean

As has been established there is no "the football community" in any meaningful sense - it is an illusory concept that does nothing but cause eternally inflated expectations. People who follow the AFL as well as european soccer and / or jump on the socceroos bandwagon every four years aren't part of some giant monolithic "the football community" that is ever going to be "engaged" by the A League in a sustainable way. Likewise the misinterpreted soccer participation numbers aren't going to suddenly morph into big "engagement" in the A League. NSW has half of Australia's soccer participants and Victoria the lowest participation and yet Victoria has the biggest franchise in the A League and had the biggest club in the NSL

Victory apparently have 50% of its members are also AFL club members. It transparently appropriated the Big V when it was founded.


cool. Go troll somewhere else.
Naaah, think I am going to keep to posting on attendances/ratings of other sports on a thread dedicated for such purposes regardless of whether it gives lurkers the burnsies
 

Gigantor

Brownlow Medallist
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Just for fun, thought I'd take a look at some recent demos.
Went back to a semi played Friday 13 Sept, between Geelong and the Eagles, so we're talking about middle order clubs in terms of TV ratings.
Top rating TV show that night with 850k (NRL rated 439k, lower than the AFL pre-game).
Also won the multi channels (up against the Ashes)
Won STV ratings convincingly with 319k, NRL rated 221k
Won the 16 to 39 demos convincingly with 212k, NRL got 111k
Won the 18 to 45 demo convincingly with 332k, NRL got 191k
Won the 25 to 54 demo convincingly with 368 k, NRL got 210k

Ok, that's finals, so I went looking for a non-descript home and away game, found a good one, Rd 21, Friday 9 August, Giants hosted Hawthorn at Manuka and were were absolutely thrashed by 9 or 10 goals, so this is likely to result in a poor ratings result.

8th in the FTA ratings with 528k, but much to my surprise, beating the NRL which only got 307k
3rd in STV ratings with a respectable 224k, top rating was NRL with 250k
FTA Demos:
1st in 16 to 39 with 134k (NRL didn't make top 5)
1st in 18 to 45 with 219k (NRL didn't make top 5)
2nd in 25 to 54 with 233k (NRL didn't make top 5)

This is from a club with no supporters, getting thrashed on a Friday night, still topped the demos.
There must be at least a handful of young people watching the AFL on FTA on Friday nights!
 

Our Game

Club Legend
Sep 30, 2014
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Just for fun, thought I'd take a look at some recent demos.
Went back to a semi played Friday 13 Sept, between Geelong and the Eagles, so we're talking about middle order clubs in terms of TV ratings.
Top rating TV show that night with 850k (NRL rated 439k, lower than the AFL pre-game).
Also won the multi channels (up against the Ashes)
Won STV ratings convincingly with 319k, NRL rated 221k
Won the 16 to 39 demos convincingly with 212k, NRL got 111k
Won the 18 to 45 demo convincingly with 332k, NRL got 191k
Won the 25 to 54 demo convincingly with 368 k, NRL got 210k

Ok, that's finals, so I went looking for a non-descript home and away game, found a good one, Rd 21, Friday 9 August, Giants hosted Hawthorn at Manuka and were were absolutely thrashed by 9 or 10 goals, so this is likely to result in a poor ratings result.

8th in the FTA ratings with 528k, but much to my surprise, beating the NRL which only got 307k
3rd in STV ratings with a respectable 224k, top rating was NRL with 250k
FTA Demos:
1st in 16 to 39 with 134k (NRL didn't make top 5)
1st in 18 to 45 with 219k (NRL didn't make top 5)
2nd in 25 to 54 with 233k (NRL didn't make top 5)

This is from a club with no supporters, getting thrashed on a Friday night, still topped the demos.
There must be at least a handful of young people watching the AFL on FTA on Friday nights!
Yeah Ive noticed that the NRL chest beating about how much better they are than the AFL when it comes to TV ratings and style of game for TV have dried up in recent seasons.Where are you Roy Masters?
 

Rob

Brownlow Medallist
Nov 8, 2000
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He's at it again, getting the job done:
Tony McEvoy remembers the Melbourne Cup being unmatched for romance and Australiana. School days coming to a giddy halt when the call was played over the loudspeaker.
What about now? McEvoy adjusts his flat cap on Monday at Royal Randwick, puts down his binoculars and laments the internationalisation of the first Tuesday in November and claims The Everest has become the gallop that most represents, and increasingly fascinates, the nation.
I have to say I laughed at this. I am no horse racing fan, but a general sports fan - so take this with that in mind - but I can say that the Everest has virtually zero profile over here. Maybe with hard core racing fanatics, but there aren't many of those.

The Melbourne Cup on the other hand, there would be no-one that doesn't know it's on.

In Sydney the Everest might be big, and it wouldn't be the first time someone from Sydney thinks what's happening in Sydney is reflected in the rest of the country.
 

jatz14

Norm Smith Medallist
Dec 13, 2011
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I have to say I laughed at this. I am no horse racing fan, but a general sports fan - so take this with that in mind - but I can say that the Everest has virtually zero profile over here. Maybe with hard core racing fanatics, but there aren't many of those.

The Melbourne Cup on the other hand, there would be no-one that doesn't know it's on.

In Sydney the Everest might be big, and it wouldn't be the first time someone from Sydney thinks what's happening in Sydney is reflected in the rest of the country.
Second this. If someone mentioned the Everest to me, I would think mountain peaks first. I would have to be reminded there was a race with that name. I also do not have a lot of interest in horse racing, but I could name a bunch of Melbourne cup winners, wouldn't have a clue about the Everest. The whole thing sounds like it came out of a marketers focus group.
 

Our Game

Club Legend
Sep 30, 2014
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Let NSW have the not quite the richest horse race in the world BTW thats the Dubai Cup at $17,500,000 AUD
Ill take the Melbourne Cup Carnival every day.Tradition and Class will beat pure money any day.
Why do 3 - 4 Cruse Ships come down form Sydney for Melbourne Cup every year and stay a couple of days? I dont see any going to Sydney for the Everest
 

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manicmagpie

A slice of fried gold
Jul 2, 2003
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Let NSW have the not quite the richest horse race in the world BTW thats the Dubai Cup at $17,500,000 AUD
Ill take the Melbourne Cup Carnival every day.Tradition and Class will beat pure money any day.
Why do 3 - 4 Cruse Ships come down form Sydney for Melbourne Cup every year and stay a couple of days? I dont see any going to Sydney for the Everest
To be fair Sydney has cruise ships coming and going constantly.
 

Kwality

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To be fair Sydney has cruise ships coming and going constantly.
when 4 is a crowd, its not Sydney Harbor ... :)
So does Melbourne between October and April 140 visits this year alone with 4 ships including the Queen Elizabeth having Melbourne as their home port.
Guess the suggestion is cruise ships arent a measure of value - why didnt you support your claims with comparitive figures, didnt look or did you recognise the foolishness* of the OP who raised the measure originally.

*The data belows suggest 58% of the national economic benefit in that sector occurs in NSW & 7% in Vic

This might help release your grip on it:
While NSW accounted for most of the national economic contribution overall, the State’s total economic impact rose by only 6%, the lowest out of all the states, and a substantial decrease on the almost 20% growth in 2015/16. This drop can be directly attributed to Sydney reaching its cruise capacity with the Overseas Passenger Terminal unable to accommodate any more cruise ships during the peak cruising season.
The other states have benefited as a result of this shift in capacity, with Queensland up 14% to now represent about a fifth (21%) of the national economic contribution, more than A$1.1 billion. Victoria experiences a 12% increase to take 7% of the national contribution, securing around A$390 million. Similarly, with increased deployments to Western Australia and Tasmania in 2016/17, both these states experienced substantial growth. A 104% increase in Western Australia brought the State’s share of the national contribution in line with that of Victoria at 7%. While Tasmania grew 138% in total output growth to up its share to almost 3%.
 

Our Game

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Both Brisbane and Sydney have Cruise Ships all year round whereas Melbourne has only a 7 month period of Cruise ship operation.

So you cant have apples for apples comparison.BTW not that long ago Melbourne was lucky to get 20 Cruise ship visits per season!
 

Professor Knowall

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Sep 24, 2006
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The (original) point is - regardless of overall cruise numbers - Melbourne had a bunch of cruise ships that came from Sydney specifically for the Melbourne Cup carnival. The reverse doesn't apply for the Sydney carnival. There was an article the other day in the HS (unfortunately I can't find it on-line) that stated approx 44,000 visitors came from NSW for last year's cup carnival - more than the total attendance for 'The Everest'.

The point of the article was that the Melbourne Spring Racing carnival attracts tens of thousands of more tourists and thus contributes tens of millions more to the Victorian economy than its Sydney counterpart does to the NSW economy.
 

NoobPie

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 21, 2016
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The (original) point is - regardless of overall cruise numbers - Melbourne had a bunch of cruise ships that came from Sydney specifically for the Melbourne Cup carnival. The reverse doesn't apply for the Sydney carnival. There was an article the other day in the HS (unfortunately I can't find it on-line) that stated approx 44,000 visitors came from NSW for last year's cup carnival - more than the total attendance for 'The Everest'.

The point of the article was that the Melbourne Spring Racing carnival attracts tens of thousands of more tourists and thus contributes tens of millions more to the Victorian economy than its Sydney counterpart does to the NSW economy.
Yeah sadly we have some folks who contribute here with an extremely poor grasp of logic accompanied by an even poorer grasp of their logic grasping inadequacies!
 

HavUEvaSeenTheRain

Premiership Player
Apr 20, 2006
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So despite being on FTA as well the WBBL rated the same on Fox as the exclusive A-League game?

Those are very worrying signs for the A-League. This is supposed to be their clear air period.

Conversely, terrific numbers for the WBBL.
I wonder if people still think Gallop is a fool. He absolutely fleeced them on those last tv rights.
 

manicmagpie

A slice of fried gold
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Why did Melbourne Victory play at Marvel last night?
If its for contract reasons that's just silly because I can't understand why they don't fully utilise the much more suited aami park.
Yes, the crowd was just 17,231 which would still be a decent atmosphere at AAMI but looks terrible at Docklands.

Going back through the records, about 5 years ago they got a smidge over 30k against WSW at Docklands, which technically wouldn’t fit at AAMI. Every other time they’ve played them there it’s been well under the capacity for AAMI. Doesn’t seem to be the need to play there. Derbies and against Sydney FC sure, but not WSW.
 

Cmarsh

Norm Smith Medallist
Apr 23, 2012
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So despite being on FTA as well the WBBL rated the same on Fox as the exclusive A-League game?

Those are very worrying signs for the A-League. This is supposed to be their clear air period.

Conversely, terrific numbers for the WBBL.
Two of the biggest a-league clubs involved as well.
 

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