2019 Trade thread

briztoon

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So we keep picking up average small forwards?
This where some people disagree with you.

Some of us believe Elliot is much better than an average small forward. Despite his height, he doesn’t play a typical smalls game. I’d have Elliot in ahead of both Bundy and Rayner (currently) in that role.
 

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jackess

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This where some people disagree with you.

Some of us believe Elliot is much better than an average small forward. Despite his height, he doesn’t play a typical smalls game. I’d have Elliot in ahead of both Bundy and Rayner (currently) in that role.
What about defensively? Will he help to create opportunities for others?
 

jackess

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Have you watched him play? Are you just asking questions to shift goalposts once people respond?
Shifting goalposts? Defensive work and creating opportunities is vital as a forward. Especially in our team structure. It’s also an area that Bundy has excelled at since returning.

He is quite good defensively but there’s no guarantee he’ll be a fit with our forwardline. On top of that he lacks versatility and off field leadership. Two things we value highly.
 

dlanod

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Shifting goalposts? Defensive work and creating opportunities is vital as a forward. Especially in our team structure. It’s also an area that Bundy has excelled at since returning.

He is quite good defensively but there’s no guarantee he’ll be a fit with our forwardline. On top of that he lacks versatility and off field leadership. Two things we value highly.
That's why I was curious about whether you had watched him play or were just asking questions to push a narrative rather than contribute your own thoughts. That was a much better read.
 

jackess

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That's why I was curious about whether you had watched him play or were just asking questions to push a narrative rather than contribute your own thoughts. That was a much better read.
That would be why I ask questions. Because I’m interested in others opinions.
 

briztoon

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Shifting goalposts? Defensive work and creating opportunities is vital as a forward. Especially in our team structure. It’s also an area that Bundy has excelled at since returning.

He is quite good defensively but there’s no guarantee he’ll be a fit with our forwardline. On top of that he lacks versatility and off field leadership. Two things we value highly.
There’s no guarantee any trade in, drafted in, or academy graduate will fit in with our team.

We don’t need every player to bring off field leadership.

Nor does every player need to be able to play multiple positions.

If you don’t like the player or fit, just say so.

As far as free hits go, as Elliot won’t cost anything at the trade table, I can think of many worse.

I’d rather pick up Elliot for free, than spend a draft pick to trade in Hugh Greenwood.
 

jason pm

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It's good to have stuff to chat about.... now how boring would it be if we recruited Stephen Coniglio as there would be nothing to discuss as I'm sure we'd find room for him in our best 22.
 

SizeMatters

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No way is Elliot coming in where exactly would he even play . You have Cameron , McCarthy and Rayner all in the forward 50 . Surplus to our Needs . 4th rounder at best . I would take jack Martin in a heart beat if he was available though . Hopefully dom can get the Gold Coast to delist him for nothing like Lyons .
Rayner to play more midfield minutes, Elliot to play as yet another great leading, pressure forward.
 

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PattyKwasagun

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Just wondering if Noble's Adelaide connection might come through for us in more ways than just Greenwood.

Rory Laird or Brodie Smith would be outstanding in that small defender role. I'm a big fan of Zac Williams like many on here but I think I'd actually prefer Laird or Smith to him. Either would a good option to replace Hodge.
 

PattyKwasagun

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I haven't watched a lot of the Crows this year so I'm not right up on their form this season but...... Zac Williams ......>>> Rory Laird/Brodie Smith.
I'm interested in what metric you're basing that on.

Laird won Adelaide's best & fairest last year and has been All Australian the past two years (in the 22, not just the squad). He's 25 years old - same as Zac Williams. He's close to the first small defender in the comp I'd pick if I was assembling a team from scratch.

Smith will be 28 come the start of next season so is a little older, but he was AA in 2014 and has been building back into his best form lately.

Zac Williams hasn't been All Australian yet. He might make it this year but he's no certainty.

Laird is averaging 28 touches this season. Williams is averaging 24. Smith 22. Worth noting Smith has played more as a half forward at times this year too.

If we're looking at metres gained - a key stat for a rebounding defender - Smith has averaged 507 metres gained this season while Williams is on 489. Granted though Williams does significantly edge out Laird in this area, but that's largely because Laird sets up play more by handball than kicking.

I think Rory Laird is a completely unrealistic hope, as he's probably in the top two or three players Adelaide wouldn't want to lose. Smith would be in their top 10 I think.

What about Zac Williams makes him significantly better than those two in your mind? I've seen a fair bit of all three play and am struggling to see it myself.
 

jason pm

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I'm interested in what metric you're basing that on.

Laird won Adelaide's best & fairest last year and has been All Australian the past two years (in the 22, not just the squad). He's 25 years old - same as Zac Williams. He's close to the first small defender in the comp I'd pick if I was assembling a team from scratch.

Smith will be 28 come the start of next season so is a little older, but he was AA in 2014 and has been building back into his best form lately.

Zac Williams hasn't been All Australian yet. He might make it this year but he's no certainty.

Laird is averaging 28 touches this season. Williams is averaging 24. Smith 22. Worth noting Smith has played more as a half forward at times this year too.

If we're looking at metres gained - a key stat for a rebounding defender - Smith has averaged 507 metres gained this season while Williams is on 489. Granted though Williams does significantly edge out Laird in this area, but that's largely because Laird sets up play more by handball than kicking.

I think Rory Laird is a completely unrealistic hope, as he's probably in the top two or three players Adelaide wouldn't want to lose. Smith would be in their top 10 I think.

What about Zac Williams makes him significantly better than those two in your mind? I've seen a fair bit of all three play and am struggling to see it myself.
99% of the time go off the eye test when I'm looking at players, rarely look at stats. Purely my uneducated unresearched opinion but I love the look of Zac Williams... albeit as I said I have seen little of Laird and Smith, you never know I could be wrong... wouldn't be the 1st time, you have obviously seen a lot more of them than me.
 

PattyKwasagun

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99% of the time go off the eye test when I'm looking at players, rarely look at stats. Purely my uneducated unresearched opinion but I love the look of Zac Williams... albeit as I said I have seen little of Laird and Smith, you never know I could be wrong... wouldn't be the 1st time, you have obviously seen a lot more of them than me.
And to be clear, I really like Zac Williams too - I would be over the moon if we were able to get him. I just think I'd definitely prefer Laird, and maybe Smith. That could partially be due to the fact I think we're a much better chance at getting one of them through the Noble connection and the fact Adelaide have been struggling though. Can't really see any reason why Zac Williams would join us.
 

Daniels Riches

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We would have to pay up big time to get Williams or Laird. The reason why I’d prefer Williams to Laird is because of his burst of speed and damaging disposal. On the other hand, Laird is as consistent as you get and also durable. Either one would be amazing gets and substantially add to our team.

I think Smith has the most realistic chance of getting here though. The thought of Richy and Smith coming off half back is nice. The forwards eyes would light up!


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cotter101

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Williams adds that pace needed out of defence.
We would have to pay up big time to get Williams or Laird. The reason why I’d prefer Williams to Laird is because of his burst of speed and damaging disposal. On the other hand, Laird is as consistent as you get and also durable. Either one would be amazing gets and substantially add to our team.

I think Smith has the most realistic chance of getting here though. The thought of Richy and Smith coming off half back is nice. The forwards eyes would light up!


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Smith doesn’t really use the ball all that well nowadays.
 

Leuy LongerCombo

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I'm interested in what metric you're basing that on.

Laird won Adelaide's best & fairest last year and has been All Australian the past two years (in the 22, not just the squad). He's 25 years old - same as Zac Williams. He's close to the first small defender in the comp I'd pick if I was assembling a team from scratch.

Smith will be 28 come the start of next season so is a little older, but he was AA in 2014 and has been building back into his best form lately.

Zac Williams hasn't been All Australian yet. He might make it this year but he's no certainty.

Laird is averaging 28 touches this season. Williams is averaging 24. Smith 22. Worth noting Smith has played more as a half forward at times this year too.

If we're looking at metres gained - a key stat for a rebounding defender - Smith has averaged 507 metres gained this season while Williams is on 489. Granted though Williams does significantly edge out Laird in this area, but that's largely because Laird sets up play more by handball than kicking.

I think Rory Laird is a completely unrealistic hope, as he's probably in the top two or three players Adelaide wouldn't want to lose. Smith would be in their top 10 I think.

What about Zac Williams makes him significantly better than those two in your mind? I've seen a fair bit of all three play and am struggling to see it myself.
Some good alternative suggestions with Laird and Smith, I’d personally still have Williams as my preference thou, however unlikely any of them are.

Smith i view very similar to Witho, good kick and someone you’ll get good meters gained out of. I also see him somewhat limited athletically, not quick and I don’t think we’d see enough intercepting. Nice player but I’d hope Witherden develops to a superior player, maybe a little too similar to have both in the same side.

Laird is a great accumulator, seen in the past (geelong I think) you limit his output and you can really choke the crows up big time. I don’t view us as really needing a backline accumulator thou, we seem to share that responsibility around. I also think he can be a liability on defense at times, someone you can get a miss match with and potentially do some decent damage. Much like Caleb Daniel, the positive he offers far outweighs the negative, that’s why he had a great career to date.

Williams offers real speed the other two do not, and has the ability to really defend. Can seem to remember a few games where he’s been moved and he completly shut down dangerous forwards that usually give us trouble. He offers great rebound, comparable to anyone in the league, and would really fit in with our high damage/low possession style of play, seems to have a good game sense and not manic like similar players (Saad as an example)

I’m really big on our defensive setup, the club has done a great job setting that area up
Andrew - #1 KPF (Lynch, Hawkins, Kennedy)
Adams - #2 KPF / explosive forward (Darling, Martin, Stringer, Ziebell, Riewoldt)
Dizzy - The awkward match up (Gunston, Breust, Gray, Wingard)
Answerth - Dizzy understudy but with a little more toe.
Rich / Witherden - The main rebounders, wothout being a liability.

The real express forwards (Stephenson, Walters, AMT) is still an area of concern thou, I really think Williams could offer something there in games we need it. Could be unleashed in games where we don’t need Thames’s type covered, he has also played high up the ground to great effect at times this year too.

If I could pick anyone to add to that part of the ground, it would be Williams. That potential set up covers nearly everyones attack setup, offers good rebound / interception. Would set us up in that area for the next 6+ years.

I agree it does seem unlikely thou.
 

jackess

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Before Answerth it probably would’ve been Dizzy who has played on Betts quite a bit. It’s a team defence though. If Charlie is on and the getting good supply from the midfield nobody could beat him.
 
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