List Mgmt. 2020 Draft and Trade Hypotheticals

[Bear31]

Firstly I apologise, secondly really hard to pick up sarcasm in text without that emoji of the dude looking up.

I will do that next time. I thought I was so obvious. hehe

 

[mtooler]

I would literally still do nothing. I’d rather have to ruck McLean than pay Hickey for 3 years and pay picks for the privilege.

Fair point.

 

[mtooler]

Imagine Hickey is only a third round pick swap at best.

 

[TheMase]

Imagine Hickey is only a third round pick swap at best.

When I saw someone earlier say Aliir for Hayes and pick 46 I immediately thought:

46 to WCE for Hickey (MAYBE something back)

Naismith to retire

We keep one of McLean and Amartey... which I would go McLean as I think he could be a serviceable player (at best) whilst I am not as confident about Amartey. (I am an advocate for this regardless of what happens personally)

Not saying I want the above to happen but it would better contextualise getting a guy like Hickey in for a few years.

 

[Membling]

Would only be keen to move AA at all if Ladhams or Hayes was involved.

Hickey is stop gap at absolute best

Edit: for accuracy

 

[Bear31]

Worked well? Based on what? We finished third last this year? Saying “we have good kids” doesn’t mean anything if you don’t win games of football.
I’m not saying this group can’t get there but how you can say it’s worked out is beyond me.

I never said anything worked out. Yes we have good kids. But I can see what Sydney is building.

 

[dazedjosh]

I'm actually okay with Hickey being offered 3 years, it gives us options and Hickey won't be on that much money. Sinclair might be looking at retirement at the end of next season. Naismith might be completely cooked thanks to his repeat ACL's. Hickey, despite his age, has only played 102 games and I can't think of any of those games where he was the sole ruckman, so he would have significantly less wear and tear on his body compared to Sinclair and his 114 games of constant damage. If Sinclair and Naismith both leave after next season, and they are both out of contract and chances to retire considering their physical damage, then Hickey will still be here and we can look at another starting ruck.

Out of contract next year we have the following rucks. Some that will obviously be more gettable than others.

• Reilly O'Brien
• Oscar McInerney
• Marc Pittonent
• Lloyd Meek
• Max Gawn (UFA)
• Sam Hayes
• Callum Coleman-Jones
• Callum Jamieson

Remember, we're not doing this deal to find a number 1 ruck, we're doing this deal to provide a genuine second ruck option in case Sinclair gets injured or in case we want to play a dual ruck setup. Thereby allowing Aliir to play as a pure defender.

Aliir is the primary objective here.

 

[Corpuscles]

Imagine Hickey is only a third round pick swap at best.

IF it is all true and Swans are that desperate then:
- the afl article says WCE want picks and Swans have trouble satisfying them
- they will sense the desperation
- Maybe 3rd rounder (from somewhere) must be paid outright?

Worse is why
- Has Aliir secretly already or likely advised trade request?
- Has Sinkers had it cooked?
- Has Naismith after 3 years out and facing another rehab called it quits? But Swans trying to keep it quiet?

At least his name is Tom.... they tend to be good Swans footballers

Those that do the trade radio thing keep us informed pls

 

[brad cooper]

the whole 3 year contract for hickey story came from Tom Morris, realistically this probably means we've offered a 4 year deal to Lloyd Meek of Fremantle.

 

[Bear31]

I'm actually okay with Hickey being offered 3 years, it gives us options and Hickey won't be on that much money. Sinclair might be looking at retirement at the end of next season. Naismith might be completely cooked thanks to his repeat ACL's. Hickey, despite his age, has only played 102 games and I can't think of any of those games where he was the sole ruckman, so he would have significantly less wear and tear on his body compared to Sinclair and his 114 games of constant damage. If Sinclair and Naismith both leave after next season, and they are both out of contract and chances to retire considering their physical damage, then Hickey will still be here and we can look at another starting ruck.

Out of contract next year we have the following rucks. Some that will obviously be more gettable than others.

• Reilly O'Brien
• Oscar McInerney
• Marc Pittonent
• Lloyd Meek
• Max Gawn (UFA)
• Sam Hayes
• Callum Coleman-Jones
• Callum Jamieson

Remember, we're not doing this deal to find a number 1 ruck, we're doing this deal to provide a genuine second ruck option in case Sinclair gets injured or in case we want to play a dual ruck setup. Thereby allowing Aliir to play as a pure defender.

Aliir is the primary objective here.

Finally some sanity,
And we do not have the draft capital to pursue any of them because we have not much to trade this year

 

[dazedjosh]

IF it is all true and Swans are that desperate then:
- the afl article says WCE want picks and Swans have trouble satisfying them
- they will sense the desperation
- Maybe 3rd rounder (from somewhere) must be paid outright?

Worse is why
- Has Aliir secretly already or likely advised trade request?
- Has Sinkers had it cooked?
- Has Naismith after 3 years out and facing another rehab called it quits? But Swans trying to keep it quiet?

At least his name is Tom.... they tend to be good Swans footballers

Those that do the trade radio thing keep us informed pls

2nd and 3rd options are very possible I reckon. Though both of them only have one contract year left so it won't be a massive problem cap wise if they call it quits tomorrow.

As for 3rd rounders, there are a few teams looking for small forwards, and we still have Ronke and Foot on the books, so they could be trade bait. That's probably more hopeful than likely, but it's a start.

 

[mtooler]

When I saw someone earlier say Aliir for Hayes and pick 46 I immediately thought:

46 to WCE for Hickey (MAYBE something back)

Naismith to retire

We keep one of McLean and Amartey... which I would go McLean as I think he could be a serviceable player (at best) whilst I am not as confident about Amartey. (I am an advocate for this regardless of what happens personally)

Not saying I want the above to happen but it would better contextualise getting a guy like Hickey in for a few years.

Very happy with that outcome

 

[dazedjosh]

Finally some sanity,
And we do not have the draft capital to pursue any of them because we have not much to trade this year

I wasn't saying we chase them this year, I was saying we stick with Hickey for 2021 and worry about chasing them next year. We'll have a lot more trade capital next year.

Unless we want to trade pick 3. Which I know a lot of people are against, including myself, but I think such an outcome is probably more likely than before due to all the compo picks being thrown around.

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

Just curious how do we have 46? i thought our draft order was 3, 22, 54, 56 and 76 before any matched bids.

 

[Bear31]

I wasn't saying we chase them this year, I was saying we stick with Hickey for 2021 and worry about chasing them next year. We'll have a lot more trade capital next year.

Unless we want to trade pick 3. Which I know a lot of people are against, including myself, but I think such an outcome is probably more likely than before due to all the compo picks being thrown around.

No. I agree with you. I think we will agressively pursue a ruck next year if Sinclair falls off a cliff and Naismith does not recover. I also think this year we should draft one or two rookie rucks as well

 

[Millky95]

Just curious how do we have 46? i thought our draft order was 3, 22, 54, 56 and 76 before any matched bids.

Cause we don't

3, 24, 57, 61, 81 currently

 

[dazedjosh]

No. I agree with you. I think we will agressively pursue a ruck next year if Sinclair falls off a cliff and Naismith does not recover. I also think this year we should draft one or two rookie rucks as well

Yeah I'd be very keen to see us draft a rookie ruck this year.

 

[TheMase]

Just curious how do we have 46? i thought our draft order was 3, 22, 54, 56 and 76 before any matched bids.

Port Adelaide have 46. It was brought up in relation to a trade proposed by someone here who said Aliir for Hayes AND 46 (which is exactly what my post not too far above just said).

 

[mikey_san]

If we're looking for a ruck Al Horford is gettable. Hell of a contract though.

 

[caesar88]

Compelling that you have been able to analyse his play in such detailed timeline fashion to be able to deduce what you have.

Me well I tend not to go hot and cold on him. Over the entirety of his play I think there are weaknesses as outlined. Even in his good times he has these weaknesses. If you recall when he first made his debut he had a streak of games where he was lauded for his rebounding only to then end up being caught with the ball several times and dropped. He always occasionally loses track of his opponent. His space awareness is average. That is his problem. These are NOT the traits of a top flight defender. In fact a team that has those lapses from a permanent 22 member will unlikely win a GF through that weakness.

The reason I have that timeline is because I've been consistent all along that when Aliir is left to be a defender, he becomes a massive asset to the team, and unfortunately Horse has just given me too much material to work with.

Fair enough if you really don't rate Aliir that much. I can't be bothered going through your post history to find out if you've been consistent on this point or not, so I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. But what irks me is that there is never a mention of these faults that Aliir supposedly has, until he is out of form, and then suddenly they've always been a major issue and he's expendable.

 

[Olian]

Hickey is a taller version of last years recruiting success story in one L Taylor. Sad thing is in our ruck depth it’s not like we have someone who will come through in a few years.

 

[Gra_76199]

I'm actually okay with Hickey being offered 3 years, it gives us options and Hickey won't be on that much money. Sinclair might be looking at retirement at the end of next season. Naismith might be completely cooked thanks to his repeat ACL's. Hickey, despite his age, has only played 102 games and I can't think of any of those games where he was the sole ruckman, so he would have significantly less wear and tear on his body compared to Sinclair and his 114 games of constant damage. If Sinclair and Naismith both leave after next season, and they are both out of contract and chances to retire considering their physical damage, then Hickey will still be here and we can look at another starting ruck.

Out of contract next year we have the following rucks. Some that will obviously be more gettable than others.

• Reilly O'Brien
• Oscar McInerney
• Marc Pittonent
• Lloyd Meek
• Max Gawn (UFA)
• Sam Hayes
• Callum Coleman-Jones
• Callum Jamieson

Remember, we're not doing this deal to find a number 1 ruck, we're doing this deal to provide a genuine second ruck option in case Sinclair gets injured or in case we want to play a dual ruck setup. Thereby allowing Aliir to play as a pure defender.

Aliir is the primary objective here.

The voice of reason I'm after here

 

[caesar88]

I’m really struggling to understand how some are happy we are signing a bloke who has never been good and on recent form has been terrible. Not only that but we are trading for him and giving him a 3 year deal when other clubs are trying to cut dead wood.

The only defensible thing people have said is that it’s being done to keep a player happy whose form has also been bad, was dropped this year, and might end up leaving anyway.

Gross.

I don't know anyone who would be happy by it. It's a shitty situation the club is in and are trying to make it less shitty.

 

[caesar88]

Ok. I’ll be more comfortable with at least some runs on the board, because at the moment it’s failed trades, bottom four, no ruckman and zero development to players like Florent, Blakey and Hayward.

And drafting quality kids, and winning games without some of our best players (including the 2 guys who "carry us"), and retaining so many who we want to retain, and changing our game plan, and seeing guys turning their careers around (Cunningham, Fox, Melican), and seeing youngsters like McCartin and Rowbottom playing the kind of footy that could see them become genuinely elite??

No? None of that garners a mention?

 

[Gra_76199]

I don't know anyone who would be happy by it. It's a shitty situation the club is in and are trying to make it less shitty.

Who would be happy with this situation? It's a dumpster fire. We just have to trust they know what they are doing. Not like they want to make it worse on purpose.