2020 International Cup Divisions

[RedV3x]

but it gets tricky.

Yes.

so it's not fair

Nothing is fair.

we are fans, and we are going to have our criticisms.

And I believe you're in Europe.
Most people here are criticizing and don't even attend.

 

[thewitness]

Trying to figure out divisions is close to impossible until only a few of weeks out when teams confirm that they are either coming or not. From what I heard at this IC the Tongan Women's team only pulled out a couple of weeks ago.
We can however play crystal ball stuff. The format from the IC17 wasn't the best for Div1 but it wasn't that bad, it achieved what it mainly set out to do, which was provide a competition for those who wanted to come.

The two complaints you usually here from the teams are uneveness and being drawn against regional neighbours, who in Europe and North Americas case, you sometimes play in between ICs.

So this is my ideal men's format (Women's despite needing divisions for the new comers doesn't yet have enough teams to allow this).

Div 1 (takes some explaining so go with me on this)
12 teams (based on rankings or past performance)
4 groups of 3 (split by region/ranking).
1st 3 rounds you play the 3 teams from an opposing group (therefore no byes and no games against neighbours).
Top of group - Semis, finals
2nd in group 5th-8th play-offs
3rd in group 9th-12th play-offs.

In theory bottom team or 2 relegated to Div2 for next time. (Wouldn't happen as same top 14 teams never return).

Example IC2020 (Tonga & Denmark return, replace with Germany/France/China/Japan if not)

Pacific/Africa Pot
1 seed PNG
1 seed NZ
2 seed Nauru
2 seed South Africa
3 seed Tonga
3 seed Fiji

Europe/North America Pot
1. Ireland
1. USA
2. GB
2. Canada
3. Denmark
3. Croatia

Group A
PNG
South Africa
Tonga

Play only the 3 teams from Group B
Ireland
GB
Croatia

Group C play against Group D
NZ USA
Nauru vs Canada
Fiji Denmark

Semis and play-offs (winners vs winners, losers vs losers for positions)
A vs D
B vs C

eg. PNG vs USA, NZ vs Ireland
Tonga (finished 2nd in group A) vs Canada, Nauru vs GB
South Africa (finished 3rd in group A) vs Denmark, Fiji vs Croatia.

This way you have semis, don't play against regional neighbours until last round (wouldn't always be perfect splits but still manageable) and are being ranked in groups only against teams who have played the same opposition (Ireland's argument this time).

All other teams into Div2
Its unlikely that a nice number of teams would arrive for Div2. Ideally 8 split into 2 groups of 4, or 6 and just play each other team once. An odd number of teams would create a problem but the AFL could bring in a Multi-cultural team like they have in the past.

 

[Gigantor]

^ That's a pretty good way of doing it with 12 teams. You are right that near neighbours prefer not to meet at the IC because they play each other so often (in case of US/Canada, annually).

It's good to have two different ways of doing it ( 8 or 12 teams) depending on the teams which end up nominating.

Either way, we should always aim to have Div 1 working out neatly as a priority, and use Div 2 (or even Div 3) for all the odds and ends.

 

[Abram Jones]

And I believe you're in Europe.

the states actually

 

[BigBrainUSA]

Div 1 (takes some explaining so go with me on this)
12 teams (based on rankings or past performance)
4 groups of 3 (split by region/ranking).

I like this idea, but I don't like having odd numbers of teams in the group, even with the cross-over.

Better to be three groups of four.
Winners of each group plus best 2nd go to semis. The "best 2nd" team plays the team with the best record not in its group.
The two remaining 2nd place teams play the two 3rd place teams with the best record, with winners playing for 5/6 and losers 7/8
Remaining 3rd place team and all 4th place teams play for 9/10 and 11/12

I think groups are the best way to go going forward to ensure fairness. The massive ten team group ensured that there were several dead rubbers. I personally would've liked to have seen the 12 team structure I proposed for D1, and the remaining six teams play a straight round robin for D2 honors.