List Mgmt. 2020 List Management

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

All good points, let’s just say we add a Williams, a Kelly, a Papley or another two guys who are best 10 players, it pushes a lot of these guys, that everyone is saying should be playing, well down the pecking order. I don’t want to see us having guys like LOB not part of the side all year in 2021, when if that’s what the coaches were thinking, just trade him.

Now it doesn’t have to be LoB, insert any name. If we recruited a gun mid, and we have Kemp, Dow and heaps of other kids, some will become surplus to requirements and they should be traded earlier rather than later.

From our side on the weekend all of Newnes, Cuningham, Simpson, Murphy, Moore, Kennedy and Betts spots are all pretty much up for grabs for anyone who can show really good signs, or for talented recruits imo. that’s almost a third of our side who’s positions are far from safe next year. atm Walsh is the only young mid who I’m really bullish on becoming an a grader so I’d be very nervous about moving any of the younger mids on yet until we know what we’ve got.

 

[SurreyBlue]

I've had a little time on my hands and so have produced:
Right hand side is the future 22 predictions.
Left hand side is the depth/unknows and probable delisting.

These are very subjective and I'm sure you will not all agree but you get the idea. BTW - Thanks Jimmae

 

[Own The Future]

I've had a little time on my hands and so have produced:
Right hand side is the future 22 predictions.
Left hand side is the depth/unknows and probable delisting.

These are very subjective and I'm sure you will not all agree but you get the idea. BTW - Thanks Jimmae

View attachment 927267

Who is backup ruck in the future best 22?

 

[SurreyBlue]

Who is backup ruck in the future best 22?

Good question - currently McKay but if Pittonet plays in our 22, TDK goes forward and one of the midfielders will be moving out. Happy to see how that unfolds with Mac but I think we'll be looking to add another TDK in the next 2 drafts as well!!

BTW - I was also considering extending the bench to cover some of these questions and include emergencies.

 

[ItsAllAboutMe]

My point with the above is that, lots of people have all of these inclusions but never really mention who goes out. Ask yourself, who goes out for Charlie, then who goes out for Marchbank, who goes out for Kemp and who goes out for SOS?

We are slow and have a tall on ball brigade, we currently, if fit are playing two KPF and Gov, if SOS is fit, who does he replace? With our current side, I would hate to think we would drop a running/faster player, which would further slow us down.

Im just not sure where he fits.

Gov has been better this year but I would start JSOS ahead of him every day of the week.

 

[HBF]

Gov has been better this year but I would start JSOS ahead of him every day of the week.

I think I would as well.

 

[Juice030103]

What i personally would target in order (bit controversial)
- Williams (pace in backline, dont see it happening though)
- draft a key defender with our first rounder
- Papley (DONT GIVE 2 FIRSTS)
- Perryman
- Caldwell
- Hately
- Crouch
- wines
-petreculle

 

[ItsAllAboutMe]

What i personally would target in order (bit controversial)
- Williams (pace in backline, dont see it happening though)
- draft a key defender with our first rounder
- Papley (DONT GIVE 2 FIRSTS)
- Perryman
- Caldwell
- Hately
- Crouch
- wines
-petreculle

IMO these targets are easy cheap easy out of contract targets, we have already tried this and it’s failed... we need to be completi our midfield with something top shelf.. if we have to give up heaps and overpay so be it.. but a contract should only be a minor hurdle, we need to be aggressive..

IMO I would be looking at good 22-26yo players who are in their prime but wanting to come to a side on the up, and be prepared to over pay them. Why not look at someone like Clayton Oliver, Jack Macrae, Jacob Hopper, Tim Taranto, Bradshaw Etc

 

[Jeremias]

IMO these targets are easy cheap easy out of contract targets, we have already tried this and it’s failed... we need to be completi our midfield with something top shelf.. if we have to give up heaps and overpay so be it.. but a contract should only be a minor hurdle, we need to be aggressive..

IMO I would be looking at good 22-26yo players who are in their prime but wanting to come to a side on the up, and be prepared to over pay them. Why not look at someone like Clayton Oliver, Jack Macrae, Jacob Hopper, Tim Taranto, Bradshaw Etc

Wines will not be cheap and is in the exact age bracket you have mentioned. Crouch will cost nothing by way of picks but will attract a pretty serious salary.

The others are kids who have shown varying degrees of promise.

Which cheap easy out of contract targets have we tried and failed with?

 

[Gethelred]

The reason you get Wines is different to why you get Crouch.

Port made finals the year Wines was drafted, and while they've been up/down since he arrived they've had something of a culture that more closely resembles success than what we've had over the same time. We drastically need that Callan Ward-esque figure for our team; a leader to complement those we already have, but one with more of a successful background than ours.

This week, we had Cripps not knowing what to do to get us going, Weitering trying to get us going, Walsh running his heart out; individuals trying to jumpstart us. We need to add to that, increase smarts and leadership density across the ground. Wines would assist with that, in addition to being a bloody good player as well.

 

[ItsAllAboutMe]

Wines will not be cheap and is in the exact age bracket you have mentioned. Crouch will cost nothing by way of picks but will attract a pretty serious salary.

The others are kids who have shown varying degrees of promise.

Which cheap easy out of contract targets have we tried and failed with?

Lang, Fasolo, Newman, Kennedy, Lobbe, Smedts, Pickett, Palmer, Sumner, Lamb, Phillips, Jaksch, Whiley,

 

[Ricky Mott]

SOS not best 22.. Not sure what more he needs to do to show his worth to our side. He is pivitol, his aggression and 1% are everything we need in our side and are clearly being missed ATM.. Would love for him to be a better set shot for goal, but if he sorted that out he would average 1-1.5 goals a game and be easily best 22.

Agree

My point with the above is that, lots of people have all of these inclusions but never really mention who goes out. Ask yourself

My point with the above is that, lots of people have all of these inclusions but never really mention who goes out. Ask yourself, who goes out for Charlie, then who goes out for Marchbank, who goes out for Kemp and who goes out for SOS?

We are slow and have a tall on ball brigade, we currently, if fit are playing two KPF and Gov, if SOS is fit, who does he replace? With our current side, I would hate to think we would drop a running/faster player, which would further slow us down.

Im just not sure where he fits.

wow not sure I would have McGovern ahead of him. McGovern runs underneath the ball, doesn’t chase and tackle and plays careful. He averages 7.5 possessions a game yet is a lock in. Ver very overrated player.
Give me someone who gives effort, chases and tackles and when actually given an opportunity to play midfield knocks over Fyffe and Oliver.
We. get carried away with to many players who certainly have more ability but don’t have the heart and competitiveness that Jack has. Hopefully our coaches will wake up and realise that we have a big body mid and forward on our hands.

 

[Own The Future]

The reason you get Wines is different to why you get Crouch.

Port made finals the year Wines was drafted, and while they've been up/down since he arrived they've had something of a culture that more closely resembles success than what we've had over the same time. We drastically need that Callan Ward-esque figure for our team; a leader to complement those we already have, but one with more of a successful background than ours.

This week, we had Cripps not knowing what to do to get us going, Weitering trying to get us going, Walsh running his heart out; individuals trying to jumpstart us. We need to add to that, increase smarts and leadership density across the ground. Wines would assist with that, in addition to being a bloody good player as well.

We were discussing this in the other thread - and these are the players I’d be pushing to get to the Blues. Players with premiership experience who know what it takes to win.
Luke Parker (only 28, and although he is battle worn due to his style of play he has some good years ahead)
Dom Sheed (looks about 35, but is only 25 - versatile player, tough)
Liam Duggan (only 23, Victorian, old fashioned player)
Nic Vlastuin (only 26, can play multiple roles in defence, accurate kick, great mark for his size)
Kane Lambert (28, tough as nails)

Not saying any of these are likely - or even possible - but these are the types who I feel would bring some toughness and winning attributes to the team, as well as filling needs on field.

 

[Gethelred]

No fan of Wines, Juddernaut08?

 

[Juddernaut08]

No fan of Wines, Juddernaut08?

Not at his cost.

Before the emergence of Kennedy and Setterfield I would have been.

 

[Gethelred]

We were discussing this in the other thread - and these are the players I’d be pushing to get to the Blues. Players with premiership experience who know what it takes to win.
Luke Parker (only 28, and although he is battle worn due to his style of play he has some good years ahead)
Dom Sheed (looks about 35, but is only 25 - versatile player, tough)
Liam Duggan (only 23, Victorian, old fashioned player)
Nic Vlastuin (only 26, can play multiple roles in defence, accurate kick, great mark for his size)
Kane Lambert (28, tough as nails)

Not saying any of these are likely - or even possible - but these are the types who I feel would bring some toughness and winning attributes to the team, as well as filling needs on field.

Don't like Lambert or Vlastuin; both role players who are reliant on superior players to get by. Sheed would be interesting, but he seems happy at WC. Duggan I want, and Parker I want.

 

[Own The Future]

Don't like Lambert or Vlastuin; both role players who are reliant on superior players to get by. Sheed would be interesting, but he seems happy at WC. Duggan I want, and Parker I want.

Yeah the likelihood of either Tiger leaving Richmond to come to us is little to none.
Sheed is WA born and bred, so again unlikely to leave.
Duggan being a Vic boy could be worth trying to shake loose, but Parker being co-captain may make it virtually impossible to get him to move.

 

[Jeremias]

Lang, Fasolo, Newman, Kennedy, Lobbe, Smedts, Pickett, Palmer, Sumner, Lamb, Phillips, Jaksch, Whiley,

A few points here:

1) One of these players is in our best side, and we paid a future 4th round pick for him. How on earth is that a failure?

2) One of these players is currently is a 23 year old midfielder who is currently in our senior side and has played 2 excellent games out of the 4 he has featured in at senior level. Hardly a failure at the moment.

3) Context is king. You have chosen to completely ignore the context behind why many of these players were brought to the club. Consider the whole picture rather than looking at things superficially, and a fair few of them were very reasonable pickups.

4) The vast majority of these players cost 3/4 of **** all. Literally only one could be argued to have been a **** up by the club, being the Jaksch/Whiley trade which went down the year before our rebuild started.

5) It's pretty nonsensical to suggest we need to be bold, yet in the same breath be adamant that we shun ignore future opportunities because not every trade has resulted in bringing a superstar to the club in a period where we won...20 odd games in 2 years

6) Every club has misses at the draft and trade tables. That shouldn't and doesn't stop them from looking at every avenue available to them to improve their squad. Our list may be longer, but I dare say we've traded more than pretty much every other club over that period of time, save for perhaps the expansion clubs.

 

[HBF]

Yeah the likelihood of either Tiger leaving Richmond to come to us is little to none.
Sheed is WA born and bred, so again unlikely to leave.
Duggan being a Vic boy could be worth trying to shake loose, but Parker being co-captain may make it virtually impossible to get him to move.

I watched Duggan as a junior and I thought this kid would be a star in the midfield. I think if he could be shaken loose he could be a very handy mid. Would be worth an enquiry.

 

[Own The Future]

I watched Duggan as a junior and I thought this kid would be a star in the midfield. I think if he could be shaken loose he could be a very handy mid. Would be worth an enquiry.

He’s contracted until the end of 2021, and doubt he’d look to leave. Can’t hurt to ask the question though.

 

[DangerousD]

Agree


wow not sure I would have McGovern ahead of him. McGovern runs underneath the ball, doesn’t chase and tackle and plays careful. He averages 7.5 possessions a game yet is a lock in. Ver very overrated player.
Give me someone who gives effort, chases and tackles and when actually given an opportunity to play midfield knocks over Fyffe and Oliver.
We. get carried away with to many players who certainly have more ability but don’t have the heart and competitiveness that Jack has. Hopefully our coaches will wake up and realise that we have a big body mid and forward on our hands.

I was surprised with the Gov Pick up and it has made things difficult now, Unless he ups his output then I tend to agree he is overrated and I wonder why he is a lock.
It’s a bit of a stretch to criticise gov though in comparison to SOS, Gov averages 10.13 disposals, SOS averages 10.94, the difference is negligible, I think people overstate his ability as he seriously struggles to find the ball, in more than a third of his games he has got less than 10 touches. He too also needs to lift his output, or he will be passed by.

I don’t see the midfielder to be honest, not once has he got over 20 possessions and regularly gets under 10.

 

[DangerousD]

Not at his cost.

Before the emergence of Kennedy and Setterfield I would have been.

Emergence of Kennedy? Are you confident Kennedy can keep improving?

 

[Juddernaut08]

Emergence of Kennedy? Are you confident Kennedy can keep improving?

Im optimistic.

But even if he doesnt, Setters. SOS. Kemp.

We need speed not size. Wines is better than all those I named sure, but we have a massive hole in other areas the cap and draft assets are better used for.

 

[DangerousD]

1) One of these players is in our best side, and we paid a future 4th round pick for him. How on earth is that a failure?

Newman is out injured and it’s subjective whether He is in our best side, he might have played every game, we don’t know and he might be passed by next year.

2) One of these players is currently is a 23 year old midfielder who is currently in our senior side and has played 2 excellent games out of the 4 he has featured in at senior level. Hardly a failure at the moment.

Hardly a failure at the moment, but I don’t see a future with him and unless he cements himself as a regular best 22, I’d say it would be a failure.

3) Context is king. You have chosen to completely ignore the context behind why many of these players were brought to the club. Consider the whole picture rather than looking at things superficially, and a fair few of them were very reasonable pickups.

Lots of people don’t need pages of excuses why we picked up who we did, the fact some lasted 1 season and others two before being delisted Or others barely making the side in 3 seasons says enough. Context is subjective, I have 9 out of those 13 as being very bad.

4) The vast majority of these players cost 3/4 of fu** all. Literally only one could be argued to have been a fu** up by the club, being the Jaksch/Whiley trade which went down the year before our rebuild started.

Most of the list and you could add 4 or more to that might have cost stuff all picks, but all cost a list spot for 1-3 years, all took a list spot from someone else that could have contributed to the football club, all contributed to the revolving door of players coming and going from our club, lots of their attitudes to playing were questioned during their time at the club. We talk about culture a bit, bringing in so many players only to turf them straight away, did not help in that regard.

I cringe when I see people defend the recruitment of some of these players and the excuses some throw about, their recruitment has held our rebuild back, SOS“s biggest blemish for me.

 

[ItsAllAboutMe]

A few points here:

1) One of these players is in our best side, and we paid a future 4th round pick for him. How on earth is that a failure?

2) One of these players is currently is a 23 year old midfielder who is currently in our senior side and has played 2 excellent games out of the 4 he has featured in at senior level. Hardly a failure at the moment.

3) Context is king. You have chosen to completely ignore the context behind why many of these players were brought to the club. Consider the whole picture rather than looking at things superficially, and a fair few of them were very reasonable pickups.

4) The vast majority of these players cost 3/4 of fu** all. Literally only one could be argued to have been a fu** up by the club, being the Jaksch/Whiley trade which went down the year before our rebuild started.

5) It's pretty nonsensical to suggest we need to be bold, yet in the same breath be adamant that we shun ignore future opportunities because not every trade has resulted in bringing a superstar to the club in a period where we won...20 odd games in 2 years

6) Every club has misses at the draft and trade tables. That shouldn't and doesn't stop them from looking at every avenue available to them to improve their squad. Our list may be longer, but I dare say we've traded more than pretty much every other club over that period of time, save for perhaps the expansion clubs.

my point that you have completely missed, is that we have built a good list but are in desperate need of a top liner to support Cripps, we can not wait another 2-3 years hoping one of these fringe players comes good... we need to be aggressive and get a proven player who will waltz into our midfield round 1 2021.