Play Nice 2020 Non AFL Admin, Crowds, Ratings, Participation etc thread

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Aussie in exile

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From 20 odd football fans on a footy forum. Most just didn’t want to have to halt the entire season half way through for two months.
The fear was very strong from the AF community as a whole. It showed how insular the AFL was and still is
They had a real fear that the biggest sporting event in the world was coming here and they didn't know how to deal with it
 

Kwality

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The fear was very strong from the AF community as a whole. It showed how insular the AFL was and still is
They had a real fear that the biggest sporting event in the world was coming here and they didn't know how to deal with it
The own goals from the local soccer hierachy to FIFA remain mindboggling. The Womens event is something FA can deliver successfully & they will covid willing.
 

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HavUEvaSeenTheRain

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The fear was very strong from the AF community as a whole. It showed how insular the AFL was and still is
They had a real fear that the biggest sporting event in the world was coming here and they didn't know how to deal with it
I would say generally the ones with a vested interest, most people would’ve loved to see it here. The problem came about because football and league were expected to give up absolutely everything for no return, in fact it would leave them worse off.

I mean could you imagine what Americans would say if you told them you were shutting down the NFL and basketball for two months in the middle of their season for the Soccer World Cup or if there was a bigger event coming to England the EPL being told to shut down for two months? Football and League fans handled it a thousand times better then those countries would. It’s honestly embarrassing having a go at the AFL and it’s fans over the whole episode.
 

Kwality

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I would say generally the ones with a vested interest, most people would’ve loved to see it here. The problem came about because football and league were expected to give up absolutely everything for no return, in fact it would leave them worse off.

I mean could you imagine what Americans would say if you told them you were shutting down the NFL and basketball for two months in the middle of their season for the Soccer World Cup or if there was a bigger event coming to England the EPL being told to shut down for two months? Football and League fans handled it a thousand times better then those countries would. It’s honestly embarrassing having a go at the AFL and it’s fans over the whole episode.
It was as if the 1994 world Cup in the US had not happened. There was a template & it was ignored.
 

HavUEvaSeenTheRain

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It was as if the 1994 world Cup in the US had not happened. There was a template & it was ignored.
You clearly don’t follow American sports because it was out off season for the NFL and NBA and NHL and I can’t remember but there was a post about it somewhere that MLB didn’t shutdown they just played it in cities that didn’t host games. Did you really think those sports would step aside?
 

NoobPie

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It is my opinion that i the AFL didn't have the confidence in their ability to deal with it, why the yanks did
It is going on 8 sad years now Aussie in exile

Over 2000 posts of oscillating between an unsubtle concern troll with an NRL loving brother in law to losing your cover and going full-ranting offended football hater

You must hate yourself 😁
 
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Gigantor

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I remember this site going into melt down when the mere thought of the soccer world cup coming here. That was fear real fear
My memory is that most thought it was extremely unlikely to happen, and in any event, at least half the grounds getting used were AFL grounds.
I have a vague memory of many being truly delusional about Australia's chances of getting it.
 

RedV3x

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Interesting article on SuperBowl & Australias premier sports NOT from a sports journos point of view.
sports-marketers-on-why-australia-doesnt-have-a-cultural-marketing-moment-like-the-super-bowl-667512
Its not just population, nor is it limited to footy codes & international sports events held in Australia & televised to the world.
"marketing moment" ? the bigger the marketing moment the lesser the event for fans.

You obviously don't have to be too smart to get into marketing.
In Australian football you have naming rights of ovals, stadium signage, premiership naming, club sponsorship and player sponsorship.
WTF does this person think we're missing out on ?
On a population basis the AFL has more turnover than the NFL.
 

Kwality

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lol wut? What major US sporting leagues were shut down for months for the 1994 world cup?
None? How is that so?
There was a template (the US bid) & the FFA ignored it.
The FIA ignored the obvious flaws* in Australias bid, knowing it was just window dressing, with Aus taxpayer down $44mil.
* there is no equivalent in Aus of college footy grounds with seated capacity of over 50.000.

The Aus taxpayer was dudded & no one was held out to dry.
 

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Kwality

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You clearly don’t follow American sports because it was out off season for the NFL and NBA and NHL and I can’t remember but there was a post about it somewhere that MLB didn’t shutdown they just played it in cities that didn’t host games. Did you really think those sports would step aside?
No, the US did not have that problem, they steered around it, Aus appeared to miss it completely.
 

NoobPie

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None? How is that so?
There was a template (the US bid) & the FFA ignored it.
The FIA ignored the obvious flaws* in Australias bid, knowing it was just window dressing, with Aus taxpayer down $44mil.
* there is no equivalent in Aus of college footy grounds with seated capacity of over 50.000.

The Aus taxpayer was dudded & no one was held out to dry.
The template presumably involved the FFA crafting their bid for the Austrlian late spring or summer when the major football codes weren't using the stadia.

We were told at the time that was an impossibility because, devoid of any irony, there was no way the european club competitions would shut down for it.

Now, loaded with irony, the world cup will be held in by the bid that beat us in November
 

BobbyMorri

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anyway. A crowd of 17,922 for day 1 of the AO. The capacity was set at 30K. Last year it got 64K(and its max is normally around 90K)

Its not great. They have been giving free tickets to MCA tonight as well. Mostly to Day MCA ticket holders but never a good sign. 54% of all fans for the Open comes from Overseas(14%) or interstate(40%). So, even with reduced supply, perhaps the demand is just not there for normal Open prices. Add in the fact that it is not in the normal timeslot and it is covid times, then perhaps it should have been seen.

Still, it a 2-week long event. Things can change.
 

The_Wookie

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The fear was very strong from the AF community as a whole.
lol. every goddamn time this is mentioned its laughable. The AFL and its fans have nothing to fear from soccer. There was very real commercial and practical concerns that were never addressed.

It showed how insular the AFL was and still is
It was a classic example of people assuming that soccer is the juggernaut at a professional level that it has never been in this country outside of World Cup television audiences and the occasional national fixture.

They had a real fear that the biggest sporting event in the world was coming here and they didn't know how to deal with it
No one had a real fear of this at all. The only people that ever mention this "fear" are either media blowhards or fans of other codes.

It is my opinion that i the AFL didn't have the confidence in their ability to deal with it
On December 2nd, 2010, Football Federation Australia submitted a bid to host the 2022 World Cup to FIFA. It had also lodged a bid for the 2018 World Cup which it withdrew from in June 2010 to focus solely on the 2022 bid.

The bid was officially launched on June 14th, 2009, about 6 months after the bidding procedure began in January.

On December 5, the Heraldsun wrote that the AFL was preparing for the bid demands with a number of options being considered.
  • Close down the AFL for a full season.
  • Suspend fixtures mid-year to accommodate World Cup matches across the nation.
  • Run a shorter season in a World Cup year
On December 6, 2009, the Heraldsun reported that the AFL was reportedly upset with the lack of detail in the bid, including what constitutes major sporting events and whether matches could be played in Melbourne during the world cup. The FFA was reportedly seeking urgent clarification.

The AFL and MCC also claim to not have been advised of the modifications to the MCG that would potentially close it down for 4 months to other sports.

On December 7, 2009 the Heraldsun reported that the AFL was fuming over FFA demands pertaining to the world cup bid. These included the surprise when FFA told the MCG it would need a $140 million dollar refurbishment to suit soccer. This would put the ground out of action for the AFL for 4 months.

The AFL believed that the 4 week mandatory quarantine before and after World Cup stadium usage means it may not have access to some stadiums for vast lengths of the season.

Andrew Demetriou told ABC Radio’s AM program that the disruption caused by modifying the MCG would affect millions of regular football fans.
“It is an interruption of our broadcast rights. It is an interruption to contracts that we have with our corporate partners. I mean we are talking about a major disruption, not to mention how it would disaffect, I’m talking millions of people who actually go along to the games”
On December 8, NRL executives told the Daily Telegraph that they had concerns over the bid and were determined that the NRL wouldnt just disappear with concerns over Origin.
“We don’t want to try to block the bid but we do have concerns that we think are legitimate,”
– NRL CEO David Gallop
On December 9, 2009, The Age and Heraldsun reported that Docklands had officially declined to host World Cup matches, while the AFL accused the FFA of showing a lack of respect and saying it could not possibly run a season without at least one of Melbournes major stadiums available to it.

FFA believes that it has the option of seeking government intervention to sieze the privately owned Docklands. Being barred from the stadium almost certainly meant less games for Melbourne.

The Age says that the FFA initially didnt need Docklands preferring to use the new rectangular stadium, but when it didnt meet capacity evidently just added in Docklands without letting anybody in on their change of plan. The AFL says the first it knew of the issue was when they saw it in the paper. Demetriou told The Age
”It’s for them to go away and work out solutions. It’s not for us to come up with a solution of what to do about Etihad. We’ve got Etihad and we’ve got the MCG. People forget there are things called agreements in place”
On December 10, 2009, the Heraldsun reported that the FFA, Federal Government and State Governments were prepared to go even without the AFL’s co-operation, and believe that the AFL were the only remaining obstacle.

On February 10, 2010, Etihad CEO Ian Collins made the following statement in the Heraldsun.
“It’s pretty simple to us. Our major tenant is the AFL and they have pre-emptive rights on scheduling. And if the AFL decides that they want to schedule 100 footy matches here between February and September then they are entitled to do it.
“They have those rights. If it was in summer time it would be a different kettle of fish. But the real issue is the World Cup is going to be held during winter.
“The other issue is that there are a lot of contractual arrangements afoot here, whether that be naming rights or the commercial business with car parking. You can’t just close those businesses down or jettison somebody out of the area when they have strong contractual rights,” Collins said.”
On the issue of compulsory acquisition he added
“I didn’t know that we were at war … and that’s the only time I see where governments can seize control of private property. This is all private investors, who have put money into a venture to make it happen. Basically, they are entitled to their return on that investment and it would be pretty hard for the Government to seize something without some substantial compensation. I don’t think it has been thought through”
On March 2, The Age reported that the Victorian Government had nominated Kardinia Park to be used for the World Cup bid.

On March 15th, 2010, The Geelong Advertiser reported that the AFL was backing Kardinia Park to be the second stadium ahead, in order to free up Docklands for the AFL.

On March 17th, The Courier Mail reported that the NRL would seek compensation for having to move State of Origin.

On March 31, Frank Lowy told the Financial Review that FFA could do it without the AFl and Etihad Stadium.
“We’ll do it without them and we’ll succeed without them”
On May 1st, 2010, The Heraldsun reported that the AFL would seek up to $100 million in compensation for the larger stadiums it had given up for the world cup bid. Senior FFA officials are quoted as saying the AFL was holding the FFA to ransom. For its part, the AFL said no figure had been reached.

On May 10, afl.com.au claimed that the AFL would support the world cup after it had recieved assurances that its season would be able to continue uninterrupted, and that retaining Docklands stadium was integral to that plan.

The article states that the AFL had agreed to give up playing at the MCG, Subiaco, Kardinia Park, Carrara and Adelaide Oval – which would cause about 90 matches to be relocated.

On May 15th, 2010, The Australian reported that due to the AFL not releasing the Docklands stadium for the bid, the number of games available to Melbourne would be reduced.

On June 15, 2010, the SMH reported that the AFL was missing out on a golden opportunity to showcase its game before the international community due to its intransigence.

On July 12, 2010, David Duavutovic wrote an opinion piece in News LTd papers that accused the AFL of being a bully, including forcing radio stations to downgrade Aleagfue broadcast and leaking stories designed to take attention away from soccer in its moment of glory.

In October 2010, just weeks before the bid was officially lodged, Frank Lowy told Fairfax media that the bid was almost cancelled and blamed the AFL for being stubborn over the use of the MCG.
”They [the AFL] had certain demands, which were excessive, but we agreed in the end, and we have both moved on. The MCG got sorted out at the last minute. We didn’t have the MCG two days before the bid [was due to be finalised], and had we not got the MCG, we could not have fulfilled the requirements of the bid. We needed 12 grounds, and we only had 11 on the Sunday [May 9], and on the Tuesday [May 11] the bid book had to be submitted”
In the same interview he expresses confidence in Australias ability to win the rights to the 2022 world cup.

On October 15th, 2010 the Heraldsun reported that the MCG was still not a given unless the AFL cleared it due to a long term contract the AFL has with the ground. News reported that the ground would only be released if FFA could provide an assurance that the AFL season could go ahead.

On November 21, 2010, The ABC and The Age reported that the FIFA Evaluation report had said that the NRL and AFL seasons as well as the Queens Birthday holiday could interfere with the success of the World Cup.

On September 16, 2011, the Heraldsun reported that compensation agreed to in the last minute secret deal between the FFA and the AFL, NRL would be around $100 million. The AFL would move up to 90 games and matches during the Cup finals would be halted at the leagues discretion.

In March 16, 2012, former FFA CEO Archie Fraser told The Advertiser that soccers inability to stand up for itself led directly to a planned AFL stadium improvement boom.
“As a direct result of the World Cup bid the AFL has five stadia upgrades while our game will not benefit or hardly benefit from the government money spent because games will be rarely played there”
Timeline
  • Oct 14, 2010 – Lowy tells Fairfax he is confident we can win the 2022 world cup bidding.
  • Dec 2, 2010 – The FFA officially lodges its bid with the FFA for 2022
Referemces
 

Gigantor

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My memory of things accords with Wookie, that a lot of soccer fans were beating their chests over this, thinking they had boarded a juggernaut that would steamroll everything before them, and then were laughed out of Geneva with one solitary vote!
Also, it seems a lot of soccer fans had trouble understanding that the AFL Commission would give priority to running the AFL, first and foremost, and they would pay little heed to helping FIFA members line their own pockets.
What a strange set of priorities they had at the time!
 

jatz14

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It was an extremely weird time. Soccer fans seemed furious that the bosses of the AFL continued to see it as their job to run the AFL, and not bail the FFA out from their incompetence and lack of forethought.
 

kaypee

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I would say generally the ones with a vested interest, most people would’ve loved to see it here. The problem came about because football and league were expected to give up absolutely everything for no return, in fact it would leave them worse off.

I mean could you imagine what Americans would say if you told them you were shutting down the NFL and basketball for two months in the middle of their season for the Soccer World Cup or if there was a bigger event coming to England the EPL being told to shut down for two months? Football and League fans handled it a thousand times better then those countries would. It’s honestly embarrassing having a go at the AFL and it’s fans over the whole episode.
But soccer folk were quite explicit that the World Cup would destroy rugby and football and that was a reason they wanted it here. It was a feature not a bug.
 

HavUEvaSeenTheRain

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No, the US did not have that problem, they steered around it, Aus appeared to miss it completely.
Exactly and the AFL and NRL were unbelievably accommodating compared to followers of any other sports codes from around the world would’ve been. Saying it was fear is complete bull crap. The cooperation the AFL and even more so the NRL and their followers were giving the FFA would be ten times what any other foreign major sport/competition would’ve done. I realise at the time die hard soccer supporters got caught up in it all and were angry at the AFL because of the passion they had but if you can’t look back now ten years later with a clear mind and see the AFL and NRL done way more then should be expected to aid the bid then that’s just embarrassing.
 

Kwality

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My memory of things accords with Wookie, that a lot of soccer fans were beating their chests over this, thinking they had boarded a juggernaut that would steamroll everything before them, and then were laughed out of Geneva with one solitary vote!
Also, it seems a lot of soccer fans had trouble understanding that the AFL Commission would give priority to running the AFL, first and foremost, and they would pay little heed to helping FIFA members line their own pockets.
What a strange set of priorities they had at the time!
The media played the game with its 'shock & awe' coverage from every codes point of view. The early reports of the submission fired fear more generally with so many loose ends.

Those that prepared a very inept bid for the World Cup got away scot free.
 

Our Game

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anyway. A crowd of 17,922 for day 1 of the AO. The capacity was set at 30K. Last year it got 64K(and its max is normally around 90K)

Its not great. They have been giving free tickets to MCA tonight as well. Mostly to Day MCA ticket holders but never a good sign. 54% of all fans for the Open comes from Overseas(14%) or interstate(40%). So, even with reduced supply, perhaps the demand is just not there for normal Open prices. Add in the fact that it is not in the normal timeslot and it is covid times, then perhaps it should have been seen.

Still, it a 2-week long event. Things can change.
Yeah hopefully the crowds will build up as the tournament reaches the quarter finals.
Don't forget its not during the usual holidays,schools are back and people are back at work plus no international travellers allowed.
 

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