List Mgmt. 2020 Trade Thread - Part I

[BrutThough]

I think anyone thinking Hanners is going to get back to anywhere near his best is dreaming , he will be just another player for us IMO, I hope im wrong though

I dont think anyone expects him to get back to his best - which was one of the best players in the competition - but if he can do what he did at the end of last season, then we will be very happy.

And don't discount how invaluable his experience and voice on the field will be this year with a basically new side.

 

[pebblesofsand]

Re Hannebery - so its seems he's completely shot, his body' gone and he's a complete dud, yet miraculously he's still averaging 25 possessions a game with us.

 

[CaptainRisky]

E="pebblesofsand, post: 65219464, member: 126173"]
Re Hannebery - so its seems he's completely shot, his body' gone and he's a complete dud, yet miraculously he's still averaging 25 possessions a game with us.
[/QUOTE]

What i was saying is you wont see this again ,

[TD valign="top"]● [/TD]
[TD valign="top"]30 disps (18 kicks 12 hballs), 12 marks, 8 tackles and 2 goals in Rd 9 50-pt win over St Kilda at Marvel Stadium (20 May 2017)[/TD]

[TD valign="top"] ● [/TD]
[TD valign="top"]37 disps (20 kicks 17 hballs), 7 marks and a goal in Rd 21 70-pt win over St Kilda at Marvel Stadium (13 Aug 2016)[/TD]

[TD valign="top"] ● [/TD]
[TD valign="top"]41 disps (24 kicks 17 hballs), 8 marks and a goal in Rd 19 90-pt win over Fremantle at Domain Stadium (31 Jul 2016)[/TD]

[TD valign="top"] ● [/TD]
[TD valign="top"]39 disps (19 kicks 20 hballs) and 7 marks in Rd 22 97-pt win over St Kilda at Marvel Stadium (30 Aug 2015)[/TD]

[TD valign="top"] ● [/TD]
[TD valign="top"]40 disps (16 kicks 24 hballs), 10 marks and 3 goals in Rd 18 52-pt win over Adelaide at the SCG (1 Aug 2015)[/TD]

[TD valign="top"] ● [/TD]
[TD valign="top"]34 disps (18 kicks 16 hballs), 8 marks, 7 tackles and a goal in Rd 14 10-pt win over Port Adelaide at the SCG (2 Jul 2015)[/TD]

[TD valign="top"] ● [/TD]
[TD valign="top"]42 disps (23 kicks 19 hballs) and 5 marks in Rd 10 52-pt win over Gold Coast at Metricon Stadium (6 Jun 2015)[/TD]

[TD valign="top"] ● [/TD]
[TD valign="top"]40 disps (17 kicks 23 hballs), 5 marks, 6 tackles and a goal in Rd 8 19-pt win over Hawthorn at ANZ Stadium (9 May 2014)[/TD]

[TD valign="top"] ● [/TD]
[TD valign="top"]40 disps (17 kicks 23 hballs), 4 marks and 2 goals in Rd 17 34-pt win over West Coast at Domain Stadium (21 Jul 2013)[/TD]

[TD valign="top"] ● [/TD]
[TD valign="top"]42 disps (19 kicks 23 hballs), 6 marks and a goal in Rd 11 77-pt win over Adelaide at AAMI Stadium (8 Jun 2013)[/TD]

 

[pebblesofsand]

E="pebblesofsand, post: 65219464, member: 126173"]
Re Hannebery - so its seems he's completely shot, his body' gone and he's a complete dud, yet miraculously he's still averaging 25 possessions a game with us.

What i was saying is you wont see this again ,

[TD valign="top"]●[/TD]
[TD valign="top"]30 disps (18 kicks 12 hballs), 12 marks, 8 tackles and 2 goals in Rd 9 50-pt win over St Kilda at Marvel Stadium (20 May 2017)[/TD]

[TD valign="top"]●[/TD]
[TD valign="top"]37 disps (20 kicks 17 hballs), 7 marks and a goal in Rd 21 70-pt win over St Kilda at Marvel Stadium (13 Aug 2016)[/TD]

[TD valign="top"]●[/TD]
[TD valign="top"]41 disps (24 kicks 17 hballs), 8 marks and a goal in Rd 19 90-pt win over Fremantle at Domain Stadium (31 Jul 2016)[/TD]

[TD valign="top"]●[/TD]
[TD valign="top"]39 disps (19 kicks 20 hballs) and 7 marks in Rd 22 97-pt win over St Kilda at Marvel Stadium (30 Aug 2015)[/TD]

[TD valign="top"]●[/TD]
[TD valign="top"]40 disps (16 kicks 24 hballs), 10 marks and 3 goals in Rd 18 52-pt win over Adelaide at the SCG (1 Aug 2015)[/TD]

[TD valign="top"]●[/TD]
[TD valign="top"]34 disps (18 kicks 16 hballs), 8 marks, 7 tackles and a goal in Rd 14 10-pt win over Port Adelaide at the SCG (2 Jul 2015)[/TD]

[TD valign="top"]●[/TD]
[TD valign="top"]42 disps (23 kicks 19 hballs) and 5 marks in Rd 10 52-pt win over Gold Coast at Metricon Stadium (6 Jun 2015)[/TD]

[TD valign="top"]●[/TD]
[TD valign="top"]40 disps (17 kicks 23 hballs), 5 marks, 6 tackles and a goal in Rd 8 19-pt win over Hawthorn at ANZ Stadium (9 May 2014)[/TD]

[TD valign="top"]●[/TD]
[TD valign="top"]40 disps (17 kicks 23 hballs), 4 marks and 2 goals in Rd 17 34-pt win over West Coast at Domain Stadium (21 Jul 2013)[/TD]

[TD valign="top"]●[/TD]
[TD valign="top"]42 disps (19 kicks 23 hballs), 6 marks and a goal in Rd 11 77-pt win over Adelaide at AAMI Stadium (8 Jun 2013)[/TD]

[/QUOTE]
He was so far off peak fitness last year and still averaged 25 possessions - agree he won't get back to his absolute best but its a fair chance he'll crack 30+ regularly this season. Apart from Seb Ross - we struggle with mids who can get that mount of possessions.

 

[Impatient Saint]

It's funny that hasn't worked, because Long was a HB, Lonie was and is a mid, Hind is a HB, Kent was a depth player at Melbourne and Sincs l dunno, but it wasn't a small forward.

Whilst others may differ I've come to the belief that unless we send Dunny and our 1st to Port for Ollie Wines then we should break with tradition and draft an elite small forward that can come straight into the team.

Taking more 18yo mids right now will just create a log jam and we'd be far better to throw the kitchen sink at Williams and grab a Caldwell / Hatley for a good price.
We don't want to be developing for another 3 years, there's got to be some urgency about it..

Small forward is really the only position a draftee can come straight in, and for the life of me l can't remember the last one we actually drafted..

The realities are there are not that many Charlie Cameron's, Steven Milne, Eddie Betts esq in the comp, and like dominant tall forwards they dont come around that often. What you can do however, with some clever drafting and trading is arrange a winning midfield and we are a couple of players away from that.

I am one who has always believed that if you build a dominant midfield the remainder will fall in place, meaning you can cover holes else where. The overlap of talented midfielders then fill positions like the flanks and pockets and can develop their games in those positions. For too long we have drafted players for specific positions and then had fools like Richardson pidgeon hole players and stymied their natural games.

So for me we need midfielders, midfielders and more bloody midfielders - all shapes and sizes with quality skills.

 

[Therealsaint]

Hill is an issue in my opinion. He seems so outside so will rely on a very good midfield or at least a winning one on the day. Not sure that suits our midfield. At best we usually just win but most times we are losing or working very hard to break level. Also not sure the midfield has the class to feed it out

I will give it more than one game to comment on that,but saints knew what they were getting, expect him to finish top 2 in b&f

 

[ScrappyDo]

The realities are there are not that many Charlie Cameron's, Steven Milne, Eddie Betts esq in the comp, and like dominant tall forwards they dont come around that often. What you can do however, with some clever drafting and trading is arrange a winning midfield and we are a couple of players away from that.

I am one who has always believed that if you build a dominant midfield the remainder will fall in place, meaning you can cover holes else where. The overlap of talented midfielders then fill positions like the flanks and pockets and can develop their games in those positions. For too long we have drafted players for specific positions and then had fools like Richardson pidgeon hole players and stymied their natural games.

So for me we need midfielders, midfielders and more bloody midfielders - all shapes and sizes with quality skills.

I agree we need mids badly but foe me it'sa matter of timing.
Bytel and Byrnes are yet to play a game and if we get another kid he won't see action for several years.
I'd prefer we get slightly older to mature players this year like Caldwell, Pjelly, etc - Williams, Wines
to accelerate our progress.
Time's a wasting! !

 

[gringo2011]

I agree we need mids badly but foe me it'sa matter of timing.
Bytel and Byrnes are yet to play a game and if we get another kid he won't see action for several years.
I'd prefer we get slightly older to mature players this year like Caldwell, Pjelly, etc - Williams, Wines
to accelerate our progress.
Time's a wasting! !

I'm not so sure, we are sort of where we are because we are always trying to get it done quicker. Same with Melbourne and Carlon. None of us wanted to do the hard yards at the draft. The only problem is good players don't move unless they are broken down, shit people or have other baggage. They especially don't move to a club not in the window.

 

[ScrappyDo]

I'm not so sure, we are sort of where we are because we are always trying to get it done quicker. Same with Melbourne and Carlon. None of us wanted to do the hard yards at the draft. The only problem is good players don't move unless they are broken down, shit people or have other baggage. They especially don't move to a club not in the window.

I think that's partially correct.
It's a combination of several things.
The past is the past, but had Paddy and Hugh worked out we would have probably taken Rozee instead of Ming, and Doogs trade would have probably gone to a mid too.
Sending the pick for JOM put us back incrementally but on balance we've won that one.
The pick for Clav hasn't even seen a game yet and could have got Warpel or Pjelly.
And then there was Cho.
Could Seb, Dunny, Jill, GOAT and JB have done better at a different club? Probably IMO.

Like any good plane crash, it was a combination of failures in different areas over different time frames.

Below average drafting, into a below average system, under a below average coach, and way below average luck with Paddy, Robbo, Koby, and Hugh all struck down.

I don't think we tried to do it quicker than is reasonable.

Most of the guys we were relying on are in their prime years now, which is when the club touted we'd be there abouts.

Like you noted, Brizzy have rebuilt twice in this time....

 

[plugger66]

I will give it more than one game to comment on that,but saints knew what they were getting, expect him to finish top 2 in b&f

Have a look at the mids he has worked with. Hope you are right. The game against north and especially the second half was very disappointing

 

[Mowman]

I will give it more than one game to comment on that,but saints knew what they were getting, expect him to finish top 2 in b&f

one of the 2 best wingman in the league

 

[plugger66]

one of the 2 best wingman in the league

Agreed when he has mids that can get it out to him. Black and white with some red.

 

[lewdogs]

I thought Hannebery was actually pretty good in the second half against North, he seemed to be one of the few that stepped up when the game was going against us. It will be interesting to see how he goes if he can string a few games together, we haven't had a taste of what he can do yet due to injury. Think he can get back to being very good once fit.

 

[SaintSteele9]

Agreed when he has mids that can get it out to him. Black and white with some red.

You’re both right. Hill is a gun but his style leaves him being a little susceptible to only being as good as his midfield allows him to be at times. We’ve got a great asset- now we need to complement it.

 

[plugger66]

You’re both right. Hill is a gun but his style leaves him being a little susceptible to only being as good as his midfield allows him to be at times. We’ve got a great asset- now we need to complement it.

Totally agree. The problem is at the moment we can use that asset and I doubt it changes this year. We need Clark to become an inside mid and then either recruit another or hope bytel is the other because what we have isn’t going to do it.

 

[Gosaints12]

I might rewatch some of the game a week out from June 11. Just to see and remind myself how we are.

 

[pebblesofsand]

I might rewatch some of the game a week out from June 11. Just to see and remind myself how we are.

Watch the first half only - at least then you'll still be thinking finals!!!

 

[Saintbloke]

You’re both right. Hill is a gun but his style leaves him being a little susceptible to only being as good as his midfield allows him to be at times. We’ve got a great asset- now we need to complement it.

We seem to be ok with outside runners, but the strong mid who actually gets the ball out to those runners and can run hard themselves (when a game is in balance)is a big weakness. I would try a few radical selections through the midfield and see if someone clicks- maybe Marsh, Parker, Long..who knows.

 

[mightymalaka]

Agreed when he has mids that can get it out to him. Black and white with some red.

I can't see how Heath ( Black) Branden ( White ) and Ed Phillips ( Ranga ) is going to improve Hill's game further!

 

[SaintsSeptember]

We seem to be ok with outside runners, but the strong mid who actually gets the ball out to those runners and can run hard themselves (when a game is in balance)is a big weakness. I would try a few radical selections through the midfield and see if someone clicks- maybe Marsh, Parker, Long..who knows.

I think we are better off relying on the likes of Clark, Bytel, Dunstan and Steel, i know there's a lot of hope in there, but Long through the midfield totally reeks of desperation.

 

[pebblesofsand]

We seem to be ok with outside runners, but the strong mid who actually gets the ball out to those runners and can run hard themselves (when a game is in balance)is a big weakness. I would try a few radical selections through the midfield and see if someone clicks- maybe Marsh, Parker, Long..who knows.

Bit short but Zac Jones looked the part as a midfielder - I'd rather keep Parker forward but I think Marsh is the interesting one.

 

[hayes]

Bit short but Zac Jones looked the part as a midfielder - I'd rather keep Parker forward but I think Marsh is the interesting one.

I was pretty happy with Jones as well. Stuffed up a couple of easy shots on goal but 12 contested touches and we know he’s super quick. We’d be mad not to persist with him in there.

 

[gringo2011]

I was pretty happy with Jones as well. Stuffed up a couple of easy shots on goal but 12 contested touches and we know he’s super quick. We’d be mad not to persist with him in there.

His drive out of the middle was good but he looked at home kicking raking behinds and bombing on the heads of a pack over and over. Hopefully it will settle down, if he was getting the centre breaks he did and actually scoring from them, he'd be like an instant Stuv replacement.

 

[The_Steadier]

His drive out of the middle was good but he looked at home kicking raking behinds and bombing on the heads of a pack over and over. Hopefully it will settle down, if he was getting the centre breaks he did and actually scoring from them, he'd be like an instant Stuv replacement.

I hope jones turns into a midfielder as much as anyone but he is miles away from being anything close to a stuv replacement.

He's barely a dunstan replacement currently... which goes without saying is about as far away from a 4 time bnf winning champion as you can get.

 

[ScrappyDo]

His drive out of the middle was good but he looked at home kicking raking behinds and bombing on the heads of a pack over and over. Hopefully it will settle down, if he was getting the centre breaks he did and actually scoring from them, he'd be like an instant Stuv replacement.

I think it was Lethers or maybe Gags said in an interview prior to last trade season, that we were missing and looking for a player to "set the tone" in the middle.

I figure Jones was their man for that, so skill errors aside l think he's doing what he was recruited for.

He's still finding his feet as a mid and will probably become the upgrade to Dunny. He and Jack Steele will be the grunts, Hunter and Bytel for the class.