2021 Draft and Trade thread

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bungalow_bill

Norm Smith Medallist
Dec 11, 2010
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View attachment 1090061
Brayshaw and Cerra led the Freo midfield on the weekend.

Serong has looked good because he doesn’t have to do it all, and his skill set meshes perfectly with Brayshaw and Cerra.

Yes Fremantle could use Allen, but he was never discussed as a potential top 10 pick. So Freo never passed on him.

And West Coast couldn’t pick all the WA talent. They drafted the two best tall talents available at their first two picks, and hoped Tim Kelly would fall to their next pick.

A lot of WA draft watchers were dirty on Brisbane selecting Starcevich, thinking he would fall to mid draft.

A lot of good WA kids in the first 25 picks, that WC and Freo couldn’t pick them all.
Cerra's DE of 67% isn't great for a kid who had massive wraps on his kicking
 

briztoon

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Freo were linked to him before the draft however, and many speculated that they'd trade back a few spots to take him. You know as well as I do that many young KPPs move around when they're young. Ben King was talked about as moving to defence pre-draft for example.
Because Ben King played defence most of his junior career, before Max did his acl, then Ben was moved forward to take Max’s role.
 

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Johnny Bananas

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That’s got nothing to do about the point you tried making about Ben King originally.
It has everything to do with the point, which is that young KPPs are often moved forward or back once coaches give them a proper appraisal. You're choosing to concentrate on the example rather than the point. And Ben King supports that point, having been moved forward after Max's injury and very quickly beginning to dominate there. I can keep going. Pavlich was drafted as a forward, moved back, then moved forward again.
 

Quigley

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I don’t have any genuine information sorry. Anecdotally, I’ve heard our academy has the lowest spend of the four northern academies, and everything else I’ve heard appears to back that up.
I thought the Lions, until a few years ago, had been investing fairly heavily in the academy. More than GC and GWS (who largely outsourced development of their kids to Vic schools).

It is a major advantage and asset we have. To fail to adequately invest and make use of it seems very stupid to me. I am hoping the changes made this year to the coaching staff signal a major change in approach. At the moment we are trailing all the other academies.
 

briztoon

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It has everything to do with the point, which is that young KPPs are often moved forward or back once coaches give them a proper appraisal. You're choosing to concentrate on the example rather than the point. And Ben King supports that point, having been moved forward after Max's injury and very quickly beginning to dominate there. I can keep going. Pavlich was drafted as a forward, moved back, then moved forward again.
I’ll readily acknowledge the point that KPP’s get moved around after they are drafted.

But I didn’t believe Ben King was a good example of that, when you tried making the point.
 

briztoon

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I thought the Lions, until a few years ago, had been investing fairly heavily in the academy. More than GC and GWS (who largely outsourced development of their kids to Vic schools).

It is a major advantage and asset we have. To fail to adequately invest and make use of it seems very stupid to me. I am hoping the changes made this year to the coaching staff signal a major change in approach. At the moment we are trailing all the other academies.
As I said, from what I have heard, Gold Coast easily out spend us on their academy. Not only that, they have good relationships with the clubs and schools in their zones, to the point that many of the Gold Coast and Cairns state schools now have AFL high performance programs.

You only have to read the QAFL board to get a sense about what the QAFL clubs think of the Lions academy.

And again, what I’ve heard about GWS is they increased the focus on their academy after they had the Riverina taken from them.

We might have out spent GC and GWS in the past, but they doesn’t appear to be the case over recent years.

But again, this is all hearsay.
 

Brisair

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Nov 14, 2020
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You must have a Max Heath radar. Where ever he’s mentioned, you pop up. The North board, the St Kilda board, VFL board, etc.

How much of Sandy do you watch?
You’re right mate,I have a ruck radar because the Lions need to develop a decent ruck. I have not only spoken about Max Heath but also Henry Walsh and Kalin Lane. Those 3 are very strong contenders for our ruck stocks, which as you know are poor at the moment. They are all project players, so I can’t believe we didn’t draft one of them.
 

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Jason mp

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You’re right mate,I have a ruck radar because the Lions need to develop a decent ruck. I have not only spoken about Max Heath but also Henry Walsh and Kalin Lane. Those 3 are very strong contenders for our ruck stocks, which as you know are poor at the moment. They are all project players, so I can’t believe we didn’t draft one of them.
We did draft a development ruck, Henry Smith, I saw him a few times at training in the off season and to my eye he has something.

Oscar McInerney, Archie Smith and Henry Smith is similar to how most clubs set up their ruck stocks ie. one main man, a good back up and a developing ruck, IMO we do need another experienced 23-26 year old ruck to replace Archie who I don't think is going to make it as a consistent AFL level performer/reliable injury backup.

Tom Fullarton also a chance to develop as a backup ruck, he said in the post game coverage last night that he has only been working on his ruck craft since this off season, he is good around the ground in general play(had 17 disposals last night) a few more off seasons and some extra work in the weights room and he'll come good as a 3rd tall forward and a very good 2nd ruck type player IMO.
 

Brisair

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We did draft a development ruck, Henry Smith, I saw him a few times at training in the off season and to my eye he has something.

Oscar McInerney, Archie Smith and Henry Smith is similar to how most clubs set up their ruck stocks ie. one main man, a good back up and a developing ruck, IMO we do need another experienced 23-26 year old ruck to replace Archie who I don't think is going to make it as a consistent AFL level performer/reliable injury backup.

Tom Fullarton also a chance to develop as a backup ruck, he said in the post game coverage last night that he has only been working on his ruck craft since this off season, he is good around the ground in general play(had 17 disposals last night) a few more off seasons and some extra work in the weights room and he'll come good as a 3rd tall forward and a very good 2nd ruck type player IMO.
Don’t know about Henry Smith but I think we should draft some decent rucks. I’m a loyal supporter but I don’t like the ruck stocks on display atm.
 

briztoon

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Don’t know about Henry Smith but I think we should draft some decent rucks. I’m a loyal supporter but I don’t like the ruck stocks on display atm.
I believe Smith is more a ruck forward, than a pure ruck, going off his junior performances

He’s tall, and solidly built already, but you can see he has the physique to put more muscle on.

Looks like he’s a much better runner than Big O.

Haven’t seen him play yet, so no idea on his rucking ability.

Still has a bit of the young giraffe look about him, in that he’s not coordinated at his size yet.
 

KissKiss

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Im not convinced by Fullerton's forward work. Doesnt seem to know where to run and gets caught out of position a lot. Its not too detrimental as his ground work is great for a big man, but I'm not sure he's playing the right role as a forward.

But with that ground work he looks better in the middle. If he can strengthen up and play as a ruck he could be decent
 

Brisair

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I believe Smith is more a ruck forward, than a pure ruck, going off his junior performances

He’s tall, and solidly built already, but you can see he has the physique to put more muscle on.

Looks like he’s a much better runner than Big O.

Haven’t seen him play yet, so no idea on his rucking ability.

Still has a bit of the young giraffe look about him, in that he’s not coordinated at his size yet.
Is he aggressive? The 19 year olds are and that’s what I like about them. They can also play forward.
 

Johnny Bananas

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I do actually wonder if it's worth drafting rucks unless they're Grundy or Naitanui-level talent. Their bodies are rarely mature enough to be useful AFL players until they're at least 23. And in that case, why not just grab a mature player of that age instead of having someone take up a list spot for five years with little return? Tom Hickey went to Sydney for a song this past summer.
 

martinson

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I do actually wonder if it's worth drafting rucks unless they're Grundy or Naitanui-level talent. Their bodies are rarely mature enough to be useful AFL players until they're at least 23. And in that case, why not just grab a mature player of that age instead of having someone take up a list spot for five years with little return? Tom Hickey went to Sydney for a song this past summer.
I'm in this camp unless you get an absolute obvious gun.

We did ok with Stef. LT more than serviceable ruckman out of nothing.
 

Brisair

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I'm in this camp unless you get an absolute obvious gun.

We did ok with Stef. LT more than serviceable ruckman out of nothing.
Disagree. I think rucks need to be on the AFL system and developed gradually. They are worth their weight in gold to a midfield. I don’t agree with Buckley’s comments last night either. Mids do not negate a hit out dominance. A decent ruck will set their mids up and serve it down their throat. Grundy is not a good tap ruckman. Times are changing, ruck men and talls will play a big part in this new style of game.
 

Jason mp

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I'm in this camp unless you get an absolute obvious gun.

We did ok with Stef. LT more than serviceable ruckman out of nothing.
Couldn't agree more.
Disagree. I think rucks need to be on the AFL system and developed gradually. They are worth their weight in gold to a midfield. I don’t agree with Buckley’s comments last night either. Mids do not negate a hit out dominance. A decent ruck will set their mids up and serve it down their throat. Grundy is not a good tap ruckman. Times are changing, ruck men and talls will play a big part in this new style of game.
Agree but let another club spend 4-5 years developing them and then snap them up, we've wasted 7 years on Archie Smith.

IMO mids do negate a hit out dominance, hit outs are the most irrelevant stat in the game.
 

Brisair

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Couldn't agree more.

Agree but let another club spend 4-5 years developing them and then snap them up, we've wasted 7 years on Archie Smith.

IMO mids do negate a hit out dominance, hit outs are the most irrelevant stat in the game.
Archie Smith was not a good selection.
 

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