List Mgmt. 2021 List Management: Draft, Trade, Free Agency and Academy

[Joao]

Why laughable?

We put an offer to him.

West Coast need to be in ball park to keep him.

Keep the Wet Toast honest and Limits their salary cap ability.

Sure most players stay.

It's laughable because it's so obvious it won't happen. I'll bet any sum of money you like that Allen won't play for us beyond something like picking him up after retirement.

I'm sure 10+ clubs throw a contract at him, but that's not the same thing as actively targeting him thinking you're actually a chance at getting him. I'm pretty sure we would have thrown out the feelers for J.Cameron but the odds of that actually happening were similar to Allen's in the future - <1% rounded down to zero.

 

[Dockeroo]

We did pick Sturt but he can’t get on the field. In that 2018 superdraft, our best selection at this stage is looking like Schultz at pick 57.

yep. My thoughts too

 

[Docker82]

In 2 drafts WC drafted 6 forwards out of their 9 picks plus got Waterman fs. It’s paying dividends now. We’ve had a few good drafts lately whereby our midfield should be ok, so now we need to focus on forwards almost exclusively. Our drafting 2015 - 2017 where we ignored small creative forwards and forwards in general was a massive blunder. Richmond showed the way but we didn’t take the hint.

Think we took best available almost exclusively in the first two rounds tbh.

Only exception might be Sean Darcy.

 

[eastfreo75]

In 2 drafts WC drafted 6 forwards out of their 9 picks plus got Waterman fs. It’s paying dividends now. We’ve had a few good drafts whereby our midfield should be ok, so now we need to focus on forwards almost exclusively. Our drafting 2015 - 2017 where we ignored small creative forwards and forwards in general was a massive blunder. Richmond showed the way but we didn’t take the hint.

What I like about Trent Cooper is him seeing the importance of having a dangerous forward line.

Ebony was moved from the backline to a key forward last season and this year as an attacking midfielder.

Drafting can be difficult to get what you need. Reaching for a player isn't a great idea.

I do get your point that the forward line is important.

Chapman, Serong, and Young were no brainer picks.

2020 O'Driscoll was a good selection but a forward might have better pick. Treacy was a good pick.

2019 Frederick was a great selection. Something he needed a forward/wing. Pina was a good choice but COVID killed his opportunity.

2018 Hogan was traded which was a need. Sturt was a forward and good choice. Valente was too good. Curtis Taylor might have been a better pick in terms of need. Schultz was a need and so was Bewley. Watson was a good choice as well.

2018. Mid Season draft O'Reilly was a shocking pick.

 

[Scham]

What I like about Trent Cooper is him seeing the importance of having a dangerous forward line.

Ebony was moved from the backline to a key forward last season and this year as an attacking midfielder.

Drafting can be difficult to get what you need. Reaching for a player isn't a great idea.

I do get your point that the forward line is important.

Chapman, Serong, and Young were no brainer picks.

2020 O'Driscoll was a good selection but a forward might have better pick. Treacy was a good pick.

2019 Frederick was a great selection. Something he needed a forward/wing. Pina was a good choice but COVID killed his opportunity.

2018 Hogan was traded which was a need. Sturt was a forward and good choice. Valente was too good. Curtis Taylor might have been a better pick in terms of need. Schultz was a need and so was Bewley. Watson was a good choice as well.

2018. Mid Season draft O'Reilly was a shocking pick.

The last 3 drafts have been good but we’re playing catch up from miles behind. From the 5 previous drafts 2013 - 2017 we currently have what Swita and Tabs as the only forwards to show from those drafts. We traded for Gumbleton and Bennell...sigh...

However, things are on the up but it’s going to take a while before we can reap any rewards. Our list management and recruitment 2013 - 2017 set us back years.

 

[Docker82]

What I like about Trent Cooper is him seeing the importance of having a dangerous forward line.

Ebony was moved from the backline to a key forward last season and this year as an attacking midfielder.

Drafting can be difficult to get what you need. Reaching for a player isn't a great idea.

I do get your point that the forward line is important.

Chapman, Serong, and Young were no brainer picks.

2020 O'Driscoll was a good selection but a forward might have better pick. Treacy was a good pick.

2019 Frederick was a great selection. Something he needed a forward/wing. Pina was a good choice but COVID killed his opportunity.

2018 Hogan was traded which was a need. Sturt was a forward and good choice. Valente was too good. Curtis Taylor might have been a better pick in terms of need. Schultz was a need and so was Bewley. Watson was a good choice as well.

2018. Mid Season draft O'Reilly was a shocking pick.

McCarthy, Bennell and Hogan performing as we intended would’ve helped a lot.

Should’ve been a premiership standard forward line. Instead it’s pretty easy to say we shouldn’t have traded for any of them (yes, the overall McCarthy trade worked out but take him out and it looks better).

 

[eastfreo75]

McCarthy, Bennell and Hogan performing as we intended would’ve helped a lot.

Should’ve been a premiership standard forward line. Instead it’s pretty easy to say we shouldn’t have traded for any of them (yes, the overall McCarthy trade worked out but take him out and it looks better).

100%

Easy said and done.

Draft is a lottery of what players fall to you.

All three examples were high risk high reward and had "issues".

My point is that Serong, Young and Chapman were no brainer picks.

 

[Docker82]

The last 3 drafts have been good but we’re playing catch up from miles behind. From the 5 previous drafts 2013 - 2017 we currently have what Swita and Tabs as the only forwards to show from those drafts. We traded for Gumbleton and Bennell...sigh...

However, things are on the up but it’s going to take a while before we can reap any rewards. Our list management and recruitment 2013 - 2017 set us back years.

Call me crazy but I’d trade a pick in the 50s for Scott Gumbleton again if we were as close as we were.

Sure it didn’t work out but if we’d got 10 games from him at the right time it could’ve won us a flag. A pick in the 50s isn’t a high price on that risk.

 

[Alfonz]

It's a bit erroneous to say we haven't tried to address the forward line. We have made some blunders by not picking Darling or Ryan (the year before WC took him). But we simply have just stuffed up all attempts at making it work. Our forward stocks could have looked something like this:

Bennell Hogan Walters
McCarthy Lobb Simpson
Depth: Taberner, Apeness, Crozier, Sturt, Henry,

This is what we have acquired using top 20 picks, plus our best two forwards who were late picks.

 

[theGav56]

It's a bit erroneous to say we haven't tried to address the forward line. We have made some blunders by not picking Darling or Ryan (the year before WC took him). But we simply have just stuffed up all attempts at making it work. Our forward stocks could have looked something like this:

Bennell Hogan Walters
McCarthy Lobb Simpson
Depth: Taberner, Apeness, Crozier, Sturt, Henry,

This is what we have acquired using top 20 picks, plus our best two forwards who were late picks.

Amazingly only Simpson and Walters from the draft in your named forward line, but all your depth players.

 

[Docker82]

Amazingly only Simpson and Walters from the draft in your named forward line, but all your depth players.

It’s about getting quality players on your list. Couldn’t care less how we go about making that happen.

As long as it’s within the rules of course.

 

[george2]

Amazingly only Simpson and Walters from the draft in your named forward line, but all your depth players.

I remember watching Josh Simpson’s draft highlights, wow! He had the talent to be absolutely anything. An all to familiar story with too many of our past players.

 

[theGav56]

It’s about getting quality players on your list. Couldn’t care less how we go about making that happen.

As long as it’s within the rules of course.

Collectively the traded in list has the better quality players and they were paid for with better quality picks. But they have not produced a better outcome for us. It indicates that we have a problem with "how we go about making that happen."

 

[Docker82]

Collectively the traded in list has the better quality players and they were paid for with better quality picks. But they have not produced a better outcome for us. It indicates that we have a problem with "how we go about making that happen."

Can’t argue with that. In almost all circumstances off field issues were prominent before coming to Freo. Once the club made the decision to trade these players into the club they were hardly going to draft players who played the same position in case it didn’t work - AFL clubs simply don’t have enough picks for that.

 

[Wally Walpamur]

I would entertain the idea of Cerra for Jackson.

I would also entertain Cerra for Naughton plus a 2nd but Bulldogs don’t need another midfielder.

 

[purplerunsdeep2]

I would entertain the idea of Cerra for Jackson.

I would also entertain Cerra for Naughton plus a 2nd but Bulldogs don’t need another midfielder.

Cerra for Jackson id do.


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[Freomaniac]

Could work both ways tbh - what if Meek performs so well he’s offered three years and a no.1 ruck spot at another club?

Happy with what we did in the draft last year but ideally we’d have another ruckman on the list. Ideally it’d be a forward/ruck but there’s probably a handful of good forward/rucks in the league - they’re much harder to find.

would be crazy if Meek plays 20-22 games this season..... Just saying.

Zac Clarke played 21 games in his 1st 3 years. Sean Darcy played only 25 games in his 1st 3 years.

If Meek really does step up and ends up being traded to another club we should get a reasonable pick in return no?

Unlikely...

Only way Freo gets a 2nd rounder for meek is Meek plays all 22 games and even then that 2nd rounder will be pick 30-35.

More likely to get a 3rd or 4th rounder.

Jono Griffin was traded for like pick 61 in 2010 and thats an early 4th rounder.

Depends entirely on how much Darcy is injured to give him gets AFL exposure. The ruck market is pretty crazy and a desperate club could part with something decent (2nd round AT MOST) if he performs at AFL level

Depends. Right now, Meek is worth next to nothing as he hasnt played an AFL game yet.

 

[freo1997]

Any chance at all we put Lobb on the Long term injury list and add someone thru SSP?

It closes today! Can we do it in the eleventh hour and bring a tall Fwd/Ruck.

 

[Joao]

I wouldn't mega trade for either Jackson or Naughton. Jackson because he hasn't actually done anything and Naughton seems injury prone and we have enough of that already.

Also our big ticket item trading history is just awful.

 

[theGav56]

I wouldn't mega trade for either Jackson or Naughton. Jackson because he hasn't actually done anything and Naughton seems injury prone and we have enough of that already.

Also our big ticket item trading history is just awful.

So you would prefer to draft an unknown KPF with say pick 8 than trade for a former pick 5 forward/ruck just starting to emerge?

I also think a possible scenario where Cerra requests a trade brings Jackson into the discussion.

 

[Docker82]

would be crazy if Meek plays 20-22 games this season..... Just saying.

Zac Clarke played 21 games in his 1st 3 years. Sean Darcy played only 25 games in his 1st 3 years.
Unlikely...

Only way Freo gets a 2nd rounder for meek is Meek plays all 22 games and even then that 2nd rounder will be pick 30-35.

More likely to get a 3rd or 4th rounder.

Jono Griffin was traded for like pick 61 in 2010 and thats an early 4th rounder.

Depends. Right now, Meek is worth next to nothing as he hasnt played an AFL game yet.

I’m not suggesting we’d want to trade Meek if he proves to be AFL standard. I’m suggesting suitors would be lining up for Meek and/or Darcy if that happened and it’ll be impossible to keep both.

We only kept Zac Clarke because we played two rucks at the time. For as long as Lobb is on our list he’ll be the second ruck getting games.

 

[Patty_Moz]

So you would prefer to draft an unknown KPF with say pick 8 than trade for a former pick 5 forward/ruck just starting to emerge?

I also think a possible scenario where Cerra requests a trade brings Jackson into the discussion.

That’s exactly what we should be doing and the truth of it is we probably have to use more than one top 5-10 pick to find a generational kpf.

Trading has never worked for us in 25 years it’s time to bite the bullet and start selecting kpf with our top picks. We may have to do this over a number of years. We desperately need some talent in our fwd line.

In today’s game you don’t win without at least one and more recently 2 quality kpfs. We have 1 who had had 1 good season and is 28, we really need to find 2 if we are going to win a premiership in the next 5 years.


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[Dockeroo]

That’s exactly what we should be doing and the truth of it is we probably have to use more than one top 5-10 pick to find a generational kpf.

Trading has never worked for us in 25 years it’s time to bite the bullet and start selecting kpf with our top picks. We may have to do this over a number of years. We desperately need some talent in our fwd line.

In today’s game you don’t win without at least one and more recently 2 quality kpfs. We have 1 who had had 1 good season and is 28, we really need to find 2 if we are going to win a premiership in the next 5 years.


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The likes of Mitch Georgiades in a trade for Brennan Cox, would be the kind of thing we’d need to be considering to address this KPF need via trade. Probably some picks added in to the above to balance it out too.

 

[Bring back Drum]

The likes of Mitch Georgiades in a trade for Brennan Cox, would be the kind of thing we’d need to be considering to address this KPF need via trade. Probably some picks added in to the above to balance it out too.

If we’re going to take Brennan Cox out of our backline, it’s to play him in our forward line not remove him from the list. He’s just too good.

 

[theGav56]

That’s exactly what we should be doing and the truth of it is we probably have to use more than one top 5-10 pick to find a generational kpf.

Trading has never worked for us in 25 years it’s time to bite the bullet and start selecting kpf with our top picks. We may have to do this over a number of years. We desperately need some talent in our fwd line.

In today’s game you don’t win without at least one and more recently 2 quality kpfs. We have 1 who had had 1 good season and is 28, we really need to find 2 if we are going to win a premiership in the next 5 years.


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Never worked out? Trading in BHill worked, and so did trading him out. Trading got us MacPharlin and Hamling. Any newly drafted KPF can be expected to take a couple of years before they begin to impact, and that is exactly where Jackson sits. If we are only going to rely on the draft we need to be planning post Fyfe in terms of being in contention.