List Mgmt. 2021 List Management: Draft, Trade, Free Agency and Academy

[Yeti]

Why would we use top 20 picks on forwards?

Seems like a bloody stupid list management strategy.

 

[Swiggy]

Wonder if cerra & lobb do stay weather freo will try to swap picks with brisbane or Richmond to get 2 picks in topn 20?

 

[Joao]

Super interesting hearing what Briztoon thinks about Cerra and some draft prospects. Would read again.

Doubt it’s 4 wins outside the 8 by the end of the year, given how each team is performing. I maintain we are a couple of wins outside the 8, a couple of wins that can be made up with natural progression and continuity. We are miles off competing, not making the 8. Agree to disagree

If someone gets to 11 wins (doesn't matter who unless its the Saints and even they could overtake) thats 4 wins because our % is toilet. That's not an opinion so we can't disagree about it unless one of us wants to be objectively wrong. Agree on the disagree about the rest (not sure we even do because I said the gap was large but could be closed quickly - ie Sydney this year).

How come non of Hawks / North are being brought up with the Cerra trade talk?
I don’t get it, if he wants out shouldn’t they be on the cards just as much ?

Cerra has to want to go there. He's fresh off 4 years rebuilding, does he really want another 3-5 years doing it? I'd highly doubt it. Richmond also carries significant risk as history would tell you they are unlikely to be competing for premierships in the next 5-7 years although its feasible they could next year. So Carlton possibly on the precipise of a mini-rebuild might be the most advanced team interested if Essendon are out.

I know North have won some games lately but that's not off the back of amazing youth, its off the back of getting 9 100 game players on the park. They are still in a full rebuild and the worst may still be to come. Remember Carlton's low point came after Bolton's first couple of years where they won like 6 or 7 games.

 

[briztoon]

No offence but you are on our clubs board with a nuffie argument here.
“Until we see these kids in the system you can’t say Cerra will be the better player”
Eh? This applies to not only the 3 players you mentioned, but every single player that will be drafted in not only the main draft later this year but also the rookie draft.
That’s why it’s a silly point of view.

Hey Dockeroo, yup I’m on your board, because you guys are pretty cool and level headed, and are good for a discussion, and don’t lose your sh!t at opposition posters. Try going to the Richmond board (rabid nutters) or the North board (chip on their shoulder & persecution complex).

It might be a nuffie argument, but it was a question from Dayts I was trying to answer.

So let’s forget the players I mentioned and try a different question.

What pick do you believe Cerra is worth?

There’s a quote I like from an AFL podcast, “Draft picks are like new cars, they have a known value, but once you use them, they lose much of their value”.

Has Cerra increased his value since he was drafted?

Is he a better player now, than what he was projected to be?

My opinion, looking at the player he was projected to be before he was drafted, is that he’s tracking pretty much to be the player people thought he could be. He’s not better or worse, he is pretty much exactly what draft watchers thought he would be.

 

[Purple Jesus]

Hey Dockeroo, yup I’m on your board, because you guys are pretty cool and level headed, and are good for a discussion, and don’t lose your sh!t at opposition posters. Try going to the Richmond board (rabid nutters) or the North board (chip on their shoulder & persecution complex).

It might be a nuffie argument, but it was a question from Dayts I was trying to answer.

So let’s forget the players I mentioned and try a different question.

What pick do you believe Cerra is worth?

There’s a quote I like from an AFL podcast, “Draft picks are like new cars, they have a known value, but once you use them, they lose much of their value”.

Has Cerra increased his value since he was drafted?

Is he a better player now, than what he was projected to be?

My opinion, looking at the player he was projected to be before he was drafted, is that he’s tracking pretty much to be the player people thought he could be. He’s not better or worse, he is pretty much exactly what draft watchers thought he would be.

Can’t argue with that assessment. However 4 years of development and warming up the engine, so to speak, is not worth nothing. Anything less than 2 first rounders and a competent player aged 22-25 in return would be disappointing.

 

[briztoon]

Wonder if cerra & lobb do stay weather freo will try to swap picks with brisbane or Richmond to get 2 picks in topn 20?

As a Brisbane supporter, if one of Goater, Erasmus, Johnson or Sinn was available at your pick, I would make the trade.

If I was a Fremantle supporter, I wouldn’t make such a trade.

 

[salim malik]

It's not a popular opinion but our key defenders are not all lollipops and rainbows.
Hamling and Pearce are regulars in the medical rooms and Cox with his off the bone hamstring is also a worry. Logue is a 3rd tall
For to many seasons we have muddled through with a defence of one tall and a mixture of mid size half back flankers and running backs.
Our talls at both ends are either injury prone or non existent.
It will take seasons to overcome the problem.
I hope we start this draft.

 

[Docker82]

Apparently Reece Conca

6

Reece Conca

Age

31

Ht

181cm

Wt

84kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

18.2

5star

K

10.8

4star

HB

7.4

5star

M

3.4

3star

T

3.6

5star

MG

228.0

3star

D

13.8

3star

K

11.2

4star

HB

2.7

2star

M

3.7

4star

T

2.5

3star

MG

228.0

3star

D

15.8

4star

K

8.0

3star

HB

7.8

5star

M

4.2

4star

T

2.0

4star

is two games short of his contract trigger. Think his fate is sealed tbh.

 

[rgauci]

It's not a popular opinion but our key defenders are not all lollipops and rainbows.
Hamling and Pearce are regulars in the medical rooms and Cox with his off the bone hamstring is also a worry. Logue is a 3rd tall
For to many seasons we have muddled through with a defence of one tall and a mixture of mid size half back flankers and running backs.
Our talls at both ends are either injury prone or non existent.
It will take seasons to overcome the problem.
I hope we start this draft.

Key defenders are relatively easy to come by. We offered Hamling money and a 2nd rounder got the deal done.

I don’t think we should spend more draft capital on tall defenders.

Roughead at pies. Adams at Brisbane. Aliir at Port. Lever and May at Melbourne. There’s one at Western Bulldogs. It’s easier to trade for a key backman, or even manufacture one from a failed forward (Essendon).

 

[Ge3ks]

Apparently Reece Conca is two games short of his contract trigger. Think his fate is sealed tbh.

He has effectively delisted himself by opting to remain out of quarantine, making himself unavailable for selection. He knows the writing is on the wall.

 

[Swiggy]

As a Brisbane supporter, if one of Goater, Erasmus, Johnson or Sinn was available at your pick, I would make the trade.

If I was a Fremantle supporter, I wouldn’t make such a trade.

Think if freo can get a mid & key forward most would be happy to do it

 

[mightymouse75]

He has effectively delisted himself by opting to remain out of quarantine, making himself unavailable for selection. He knows the writing is on the wall.

Dummy spit ?

 

[Walkingwounded]

Bangers and Chris, Bastyy will be a lad and back me up as well.

Must have been shoced when you saw Twomey's rating today then re Goater

I rate Goater, watched the recent VM v VC game and thought his attributes were great and he was one of the standouts, very Danger like how he worked at the center bounces.

Nek Minut the commentary was all about Daicos.

 

[ubiquitous226]

Dummy spit ?

Doesn't seem the type, has been a committed team player for both Richmond and Freo.
Maybe he has his sights set on something after footy, or realises his opportunities will be very limited next year regardless.

We also played him the first 9 games in a row and made him the medical sub for one game which wouldn't make much sense if we were trying to avoid the contract trigger.

 

[Bender571]

Unreal given he's contracted for two years. The language is the classic early posturing, not the, "he loves it here, dont know where this noise is coming from"

Who the fu** is after him so hard, I'm so confused

Personally I don't think anyone is chasing him hard.

I think his partner has expressed an interest to move to Melbourne, and Lobb has said "well I'm still contracted here for 2 more years, but I'll ask my manager to look around so we know what our options are and from there we can make a decision".

I expect Lobb to stay once they realise that no other club is going to pay him the same salary and pay Freo what they need to release him.

 

[briztoon]

Think if freo can get a mid & key forward most would be happy to do it

Say it’s Richmond’s two picks as they currently stand, picks 9 and 17.

Who do you hope to take at pick 9?

Going on my own personal rankings, Goater and Erasmus are both likely gone. Johnson is 50/50 to be there. Other mids I have around the mark are Hobbs, Ward, Chesser or Sonsie.

I believe it’s to early to draft one of the WA KPP’s there, unless Amiss is a stand out of the Championships. But I believe there’s a fair chance Amiss goes before pick 17.

Personally I hope Brisbane gives serious consideration to Amiss at our first pick.

At pick 17, one of Williams or Van Rooyen should be there. I do have questions about their athleticism and length. I really would like to see them show elite speed or jump, or the go go gadget arms of Ben Brown, to know they’re going to be able to compete against the top KPD’s in the league.

Again, I personally don’t have Williams or Van Rooyen rated in my top 20.

 

[Taylor]

Take Sinn at #8, Williams at #9, Van Rooyen at #17

 

[briztoon]

Can’t argue with that assessment. However 4 years of development and warming up the engine, so to speak, is not worth nothing. Anything less than 2 first rounders and a competent player aged 22-25 in return would be disappointing.

Can you be more specific?

My personal view would be Richmond’s two first round picks, with your second round pick going back would be more than a fair trade.

If it was a single pick, in this draft, I’d say a single pick between 2 and 5 would be fair value.

No way am I including a player in either scenario, unless it’s an end of list, contracted player or an unrestricted free agent and we’re just helping them move to a new club.

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

Can’t argue with that assessment. However 4 years of development and warming up the engine, so to speak, is not worth nothing. Anything less than 2 first rounders and a competent player aged 22-25 in return would be disappointing.

We arent getting 2 first rounds (regardless of where those firsts are) and a young best 25 player for Cerra.

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

Bell's comments on Lobb for anyone that couldnt be bothered to listen to the interview


“There's always a lot of talk at this time of year and there are more and more mechanisms for players to potentially move clubs,” Bell said.

“Rory is a really important player for us with the structure that he is able to provide as that tall forward and the work as a second ruck.

“Rory's a big part of our future and absolutely a required player.”

There is more posturing in those comments then a yoga studio, really seems like Lobb is trying to leave

 

[malpaso]

It's not a popular opinion but our key defenders are not all lollipops and rainbows.
Hamling and Pearce are regulars in the medical rooms and Cox with his off the bone hamstring is also a worry. Logue is a 3rd tall
For to many seasons we have muddled through with a defence of one tall and a mixture of mid size half back flankers and running backs.
Our talls at both ends are either injury prone or non existent.
It will take seasons to overcome the problem.
I hope we start this draft.

What number on the roster fixes it though? 5, 6 ?

Hamling, Pearce, Cox and Logue. Yes injuries are significant and just bad luck. If you add a 5th tall, what's to say 4 of them don't go down again? A lot of teams are running 2 KPDs with a third tall. We have 3 KPDs and Logue. Ideally Pearce, Cox and Logue are in the starting lineup next year.

Would we be adding an 18/19 year old tall or a mature age tall? I'd prefer to add a mature KPD through trade, FA or the Rookie draft.

Up forward is where I'd use a draft pick to add a KPF.

 

[malpaso]

Bell's comments on Lobb for anyone that couldnt be bothered to listen to the interview


“There's always a lot of talk at this time of year and there are more and more mechanisms for players to potentially move clubs,” Bell said.

“Rory is a really important player for us with the structure that he is able to provide as that tall forward and the work as a second ruck.

“Rory's a big part of our future and absolutely a required player.”

There is most posturing in those comments then a yoga studio, really seems like Lobb is trying to leave

What would you prefer him to say if indeed Lobb is trying to leave? "Yes, Rory wants to leave, he's not really good and won't be best 22 for us next year, please give your best offers"

 

[Swiggy]

Say it’s Richmond’s two picks as they currently stand, picks 9 and 17.

Who do you hope to take at pick 9?

Going on my own personal rankings, Goater and Erasmus are both likely gone. Johnson is 50/50 to be there. Other mids I have around the mark are Hobbs, Ward, Chesser or Sonsie.

I believe it’s to early to draft one of the WA KPP’s there, unless Amiss is a stand out of the Championships. But I believe there’s a fair chance Amiss goes before pick 17.

Personally I hope Brisbane gives serious consideration to Amiss at our first pick.

At pick 17, one of Williams or Van Rooyen should be there. I do have questions about their athleticism and length. I really would like to see them show elite speed or jump, or the go go gadget arms of Ben Brown, to know they’re going to be able to compete against the top KPD’s in the league.

Again, I personally don’t have Williams or Van Rooyen rated in my top 20.

Neil Erasmus & Amiss & JVR for me

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

What would you prefer him to say if indeed Lobb is trying to leave? "Yes, Rory wants to leave, he's not really good and won't be best 22 for us next year, please give your best offers"

I think you are mis-interpreting my post. Bell is doing the right thing, I just cant believe some other club is prepared to deal with what they'll have to pay him and give us for him. I am surprised it seems like he's trying to leave, not Bell's posturing

 

[mattis117]

When I look at the three I mentioned.

Callaghan posses very similar skills and traits to McCluggage and plays somewhat similar. Except he’s a better runner, is taller, and can take a contested mark.

Goater. Twomey had Taranto in his rankings at 22 for most of 2016, only moving him in to the teens after Sandringham won the TAC Cup. Didn’t move him in to his top 10 until a month before the draft.

Goater is taller, faster, a higher jumper, and more agile than Archie Perkins. Plays somewhat similar, has shown more ability in the midfield and keeps improving as the season goes on.

And Erasmus is doing the same as Goater, over in WA.

Goater and Erasmus posses the physical attributes, along with the skill sets, to be match winners, similar to Dangerfield or Fyfe. To big, to powerful for opponents to stop, once they’ve put mass and fully grown in to their bodies in an AFL system.

Cerra is a good midfielder, with very good skills and game sense. Has he won a game yet for Freo? Has there been a game where he’s stepped up, and fans have said, Cerra won us that game?

I don't think you get it. Richard Tambling was gonna be a star too right?
Even top draft picks are a gamble, even the ones that look certainties. A guy who has nearly100 games in for seasons is as close to a side thing as you're gonna get.