List Mgmt. 2021 List Management: Draft, Trade, Free Agency and Academy

[SandiHill]

He’s barely been in the team. Hardly has had an extended time on field. Geelong prefer to play a 32 year old Isaac Smith to win a flag quickly.
We need a winger. Someone with pace.
Would you rather Tucker with his slow decision making with hardly any kicks on the wing. Vs Clark who can be similar to Langdon.

I get that but I was highlighting his off field stuff. I am a fan of Tucker and can see him being our Cerra replacement short term

 

[Taylor]

If we get English I want him being the target out of defence

 

[freo_leo29]

I'll say it again, English is like a tall midfielder, he is not a good forward.


He is more of a Nik Cox but not as agile to play everywhere


Recruiting him as a forward is dumb, recruiting him as a ruck is dumb, recruiting him as a mid is dumb (can find plenty mids 190 or lower)

Enlgish is playing ruck/fwd just because he is tall, he isn't any good at those actual roles


It makes no sense, Lobb is far better to have in our team, he is actually a forward/ruck

 

[Paracleet]

English has only gone forward this year and it was only really a permanent thing in the second half. He has far superior handball and kicking skills than Lobb.

This is not even remotely true. He has played no. 1 ruck virtually all year. The only time he played forward was a few games early in the year when Martin was fit (stats).
I would want a bit more of a sample before handing over high currency for him as a forward.

 

[wakojako]

I'll say it again, English is like a tall midfielder, he is not a good forward.


He is more of a Nik Cox but not as agile to play everywhere


Recruiting him as a forward is dumb, recruiting him as a ruck is dumb, recruiting him as a mid is dumb (can find plenty mids 190 or lower)

Enlgish is playing ruck/fwd just because he is tall, he isn't any good at those actual roles


It makes no sense, Lobb is far better to have in our team, he is actually a forward/ruck

Well looks like we found our big fish

 

[GingerDocker]

Pros - Erasmus
Cons - Other

I think I'd still rather Rachele and a WA KF than solely Erasmus.

Unless he's really, really good.

 

[Mags98]

Given English is a poor ruck, do you reckon the appeal of coming to Freo and being 80 forward/20 ruck is appealing to him?
He wouldn't get that chance at Dogs, from what I've seen he does alright as a forward just doesn't get much opportunity there (this is purely my opinion from the 3-5 dogs games I've seen this year, I haven't looked at stats)

he plays majority forward for the dogs now with martin, they brougght in some young kid to play ruck over him too when stef was out

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

So if Lobb was already on their list, with Martin fit again, who do you think they would play out of the three in the GF?

They were reduced to playing Lachie Young in the ruck for significant periods only 2 matches ago remember because English couldn't compete against Oscar McInerney of all people.

If we're going pay a premium for him to come over here and play primarily as a forward / ruck I'd want to see some evidence he could actually play there and succeed. All we've seen of him so far is someone failing to come on as no. 1 ruck.

Again I'm not saying he won't develop into a better player, either as a no. 1 or ruck / forward, but because it hasn't happened yet I say, given the likely price, the risk isn't worth it.

If Lobb was on their list they'd probably prefer English because he's better in the ruck and better around the ground than Lobb which is what they need more of (I really really dont like Lobb's rucking).

I dont think the number 1 ruck point is even relevant. Neither Lobb or English are good number 1 forwards or number 1 rucks. Their value is that they are handy forwards and handy rucks. Like all-rounders in cricket, people dont appreciate the value a player provides if he's useful at two things rather than elite at 1. I think English has shown he is a good forward/ruck and if you dont think he is, I'd want to know who you think is a good forward/ruck?

Finally, depends on what you'd call a premium, I think the contract status is irrelevant and as the trade only happens if him and Lobb are happy to swap then paying a 2nd round pick on top of Lobb to get a version of Lobb more in line with our timeline is fine by me

 

[wakojako]

Dayts if we got pick 6, who would you choose in the draft?

 

[SandiHill]

Can't we just keep Lobb (don't reckon he's leaving), not trade for Clark or anyone else's scraps, extract max value for Cerra, and hit the draft hard given the WA talent

 

[Docker82]

This season’s disposal efficiency
Ed Langdon-72%
Jordan Clark -80%
Hayden young- 80.5%

I’ve chose to add Young because I deem him to be one of our best users.

Can we now move on from Clark has poor disposal?



Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

Can we move on from this completely useless stat?

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

Can't we just keep Lobb (don't reckon he's leaving), not trade for Clark or anyone else's scraps, extract max value for Cerra, and hit the draft hard given the WA talent

Alternatively, if we trade well, hit the draft with two top 10 picks, a top 30 pick, get Benning as a Cat B, make Lobb 5 years younger and get Clark?

 

[SandiHill]

Alternatively, if we trade well, hit the draft with two top 10 picks, a top 30 pick, get Benning as a Cat B, make Lobb 5 years younger and get Clark?

That's a big 'if' on the trading well part...

 

[Paracleet]

If Lobb was on their list they'd probably prefer English because he's better in the ruck and better around the ground than Lobb which is what they need more of (I really really dont like Lobb's rucking).

I dont think the number 1 ruck point is even relevant. Neither Lobb or English are good number 1 forwards or number 1 rucks. Their value is that they are handy forwards and handy rucks. Like all-rounders in cricket, people dont appreciate the value a player provides if he's useful at two things rather than elite at 1. I think English has shown he is a good forward/ruck and if you dont think he is, I'd want to know who you think is a good forward/ruck?

Finally, depends on what you'd call a premium, I think the contract status is irrelevant and as the trade only happens if him and Lobb are happy to swap then paying a 2nd round pick on top of Lobb to get a version of Lobb more in line with our timeline is fine by me

Lobb is a better number 1 ruck than English thus far, this is not open to reasonable debate. English can improve, Lobb won't.

I think a good forward ruck is someone who has actually played more than half a dozen games in that position. Don't try and paint me some kind of anti forward ruck poster. I think they are very valuable in that if they can cover both roles adequate (rather than starring at one or the other or both which is not a reasonable expectation) they free up an extra position in the 22. So there I 100% agree with you (which would put us in a minority on this board). English doesn't do that yet as he is a demonstrably inadequate ruckman to this point and an unproven forward ruck.

Finally there is zero chance they trade English for Lobb and second, zero. They'd expect a much better return than that. Would I trade Lobb and 27 for English? Yes. That would price the risk of English not improving acceptably for me.

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

Lobb is a better number 1 ruck than English thus far, this is not open to reasonable debate. English can improve, Lobb won't.

I think a good forward ruck is someone who has actually played more than half a dozen games in that position. Don't try and paint me some kind of anti forward ruck poster. I think they are very valuable in that if they can cover both roles adequate (rather than starring at one or the other or both which is not a reasonable expectation) they free up an extra position in the 22. So there I 100% agree with you (which would put us in a minority on this board). English doesn't do that yet as he is a demonstrably inadequate ruckman to this point and an unproven forward ruck.

Finally there is zero chance they trade English for Lobb and second, zero. They'd expect a much better return than that. Would I trade Lobb and 27 for English? Yes. That would price the risk of English not improving acceptably for me.

I think its up for debate given I saw Acres ruck better than Lobb this year. Feel English has proven himself as a forwad/ruck, can agree to disagree there.

I'd value English as about 10-15. I'd value Lobb in the 20s, the only difference between the two being age. I think Dogs understand English's limitations as well given they played Young in the ruck over him.

Because we are talking about Lobb and English, two contracted players, there is no premium to be paid for getting out of contract. The deal only happens IF English has indicated he like to head back if possible. If English has said he'd like to head back, it makes a lot of sense for Dogs to do that trade this year, get Lobb in the door to lose nothing while in prime flag hunting position while getting points for Darcy who will replace Lobb in 4 years.

 

[Taylor]

If we pay some of Lobbs wage I wouldn't want to have to include anything with him for English.

 

[Taylor]

And if we get 25 for Cerra then both 25 and 27 with Lobb for English and 17

 

[malpaso]

This is not even remotely true. He has played no. 1 ruck virtually all year. The only time he played forward was a few games early in the year when Martin was fit (stats).
I would want a bit more of a sample before handing over high currency for him as a forward.

English literally goes forward after centre bounce even though he's technically No.1 ruck in those games. Lewis Young started 3-4 games in the ruck and played in there more than English.

 

[Paracleet]

I think its up for debate given I saw Acres ruck better than Lobb this year. Feel English has proven himself as a forwad/ruck, can agree to disagree there.

I'd value English as about 10-15. I'd value Lobb in the 20s, the only difference between the two being age. I think Dogs understand English's limitations as well given they played Young in the ruck over him.

Because we are talking about Lobb and English, two contracted players, there is no premium to be paid for getting out of contract. The deal only happens IF English has indicated he like to head back if possible. If English has said he'd like to head back, it makes a lot of sense for Dogs to do that trade this year, get Lobb in the door to lose nothing while in prime flag hunting position while getting points for Darcy who will replace Lobb in 4 years.

I'm sorry but I can't let this point go, in what universe has he proven himself as a forward? How many matches has he played in his career primarily as a forward, half a dozen? He hasn't and you passing off as agreeing to disagree, come on..

As for the rest on values that's all opinion and fair enough. Why should we argue about it anyway it's not like he's actually coming...

Isn't he? Christ it is him isn't !

 

[Johnny Dalmas]

If we pay some of Lobbs wage I wouldn't want to have to include anything with him for English.

This.

But surely the Dogs need a pure ruck more than a forward/ruck. I wonder how much Lloyd would be worth to them?

 

[Ge3ks]

If we pay some of Lobbs wage I wouldn't want to have to include anything with him for English.

Fair call.

I don't mind this hypothetical trade. Lobb wants to be in Vic. English wants to be in WA. Win win.

 

[Swiggy]

So Clark told the club this morning he wants out.

Where you see that?

 

[Paracleet]

English literally goes forward after centre bounce even though he's technically No.1 ruck in those games. Lewis Young started 3-4 games in the ruck and played in there more than English.

Given English kicked 3 goals in the last 6 games Young played in that's not super encouraging.

 

[Carnthedockers]

Where you see that?

It hasn’t been released yet.

 

[Ge3ks]

It hasn’t been released yet.

Only to you? Are you his mum?