List Mgmt. 2021 Mid-Season Draft

In the 2021 MSD, Carlton should select...

  • Charlie McKay (F/S)

    Votes: 10 8.4%
  • Dominic Akuei (NGA)

    Votes: 9 7.6%
  • Best available mature age player

    Votes: 49 41.2%
  • Best available U19 (overlooked in last year's draft)

    Votes: 40 33.6%
  • Other - Specify

    Votes: 11 9.2%

  • Total voters
    119

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Jimmyonesix

Club Legend
Jun 7, 2019
1,503
2,462
AFL Club
Carlton
We can't draft players who play for other AFL teams. He would have to be an end of year trade target.
I know those the rules unless your jumping back fences - but he is the right age size position our list needs.. taking a mid season off the back of last year with no football with said player is worse than a National draft -- maybe get 6 months extra training for next year into someone who missed getting drafted -- basically I'm saying this mid season draft is a crap shoot - take a holiday put some time into a player at right price who will impact next year .
 

Jeremias

Moderator
Sep 26, 2004
39,508
42,998
AFL Club
Carlton
I know those the rules unless your jumping back fences - but he is the right age size position our list needs.. taking a mid season off the back of last year with no football with said player is worse than a National draft -- maybe get 6 months extra training for next year into someone who missed getting drafted -- basically I'm saying this mid season draft is a crap shoot - take a holiday put some time into a player at right price who will impact next year .
Again, I'm not sure how taking a rookie pick now has any impact on our ability to trade for a player like Riccardi at the end of the season.
 

Jimmae

Brownlow Medallist
Nov 4, 2003
16,460
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It's 42 players (senior and Cat A) + 2 cat B to get to 44.

The maximum of 6 Cat A goes with the minimum 36 senior to get 42. The minimum 1 Cat A is if you have less than a full list.
That's how it normally works, but the wording was so strange I figured there was an intention behind it. 🤷‍♂️

Guess not!
 

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Juddernaut08

Norm Smith Medallist
Nov 8, 2007
8,426
10,966
Melbourne
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I know those the rules unless your jumping back fences - but he is the right age size position our list needs.. taking a mid season off the back of last year with no football with said player is worse than a National draft -- maybe get 6 months extra training for next year into someone who missed getting drafted -- basically I'm saying this mid season draft is a crap shoot - take a holiday put some time into a player at right price who will impact next year .
Completely illogical.
 

Blue__Balls

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 22, 2014
10,849
35,788
AFL Club
Carlton
Current reserves listed players we can use in senior AFL team = 0
Number who are available if we draft one = 1
Number who are available if we don't = 0
Odds of the player we take actually getting a game are slim. Guarantee you there's an equal or better option to Wooler/Crocker/Hirst/Radavanovovich/whoever floating around somewhere else who gives us the same emergency option for the seniors but also improves our reserves stocks.
 

branedotorg

Premium Platinum
Nov 9, 2007
3,414
6,071
melbourne
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Carlton
Please show your workings.

Here's mine:

Our current senior list is A.
Our current reserve list is B.

A=42
B=18
(Probably not exact, can't be arsed counting names)

A+B=60

If we take a player from the reserves list in the mid season draft it's:

(A+1)+(B-1)=60

If we sign a player from literally anywhere else it's:

(A+1)+(B)=61

Take a player from somewhere else and we gain a resource. Take a player from the reserves and we're just moving names around.
But in case or senior injury we can't take a player from the reserves and promote them, it's a seperate team list.
 

The Return of the Paf

Team Captain
Aug 22, 2020
353
333
AFL Club
Carlton
Odds of the player we take actually getting a game are slim. Guarantee you there's an equal or better option to Wooler/Crocker/Hirst/Radavanovovich/whoever floating around somewhere else who gives us the same emergency option for the seniors but also improves our reserves stocks.
Good point. I like Wooler and Radavanovovich but maybe for a late pick at the ND or as rookie selections.
 

Blue__Balls

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 22, 2014
10,849
35,788
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But in case or senior injury we can't take a player from the reserves and promote them, it's a seperate team list.
But if we take someone from outside the club, we can still promote them. No loss - we've still got an extra player to utilise at senior level in case of emergency, but we've got an extra option for the ressies every week.
 

branedotorg

Premium Platinum
Nov 9, 2007
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But if we take someone from outside the club, we can still promote them. No loss - we've still got an extra player to utilise at senior level in case of emergency, but we've got an extra option for the ressies every week.
I'm not sure what you're getting at to be honest, as it is we can't play Wooler or Crocker to cover Casboult so if we draft one of them or a player from somewhere else entirely it's the same outcome for the AFL list.
 

Dramoth

Premium Platinum
Jul 19, 2005
27,769
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Bunbury, WA
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I know those the rules unless your jumping back fences - but he is the right age size position our list needs.. taking a mid season off the back of last year with no football with said player is worse than a National draft -- maybe get 6 months extra training for next year into someone who missed getting drafted -- basically I'm saying this mid season draft is a crap shoot - take a holiday put some time into a player at right price who will impact next year .
We can't take Riccardi because he is currently listed with GWS. If we want him... we have to take him at the end of the year. We currently have 1 list spot from the LTI to Marchbank, and there is still a rookie spot to fill. It's pointless talking about Riccardi now because we need to fill holes in our list in the MSD.

Now, please stick to the topic at hand... the mid-season draft.
 

mrjones

All Australian
Nov 27, 2009
639
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South East Qld
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I know those the rules unless your jumping back fences - but he is the right age size position our list needs.. taking a mid season off the back of last year with no football with said player is worse than a National draft -- maybe get 6 months extra training for next year into someone who missed getting drafted -- basically I'm saying this mid season draft is a crap shoot - take a holiday put some time into a player at right price who will impact next year .
Liked your post because my wife doesn’t like it when I’ve had 20 beers and then try and say stuff. Good effort though.
 

The Return of the Paf

Team Captain
Aug 22, 2020
353
333
AFL Club
Carlton
I'm not sure what you're getting at to be honest, as it is we can't play Wooler or Crocker to cover Casboult so if we draft one of them or a player from somewhere else entirely it's the same outcome for the AFL list.
BB is saying that he suspects there might be similar but better available options from outside Carlton. Even if they don't end up playing seniors this year, it at least boosts the VFL to help with development.
 

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Blue1980

Brownlow Medallist
Jun 9, 2011
14,320
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I'll tell you who I don't want us to take instead - anyone already in our reserves squad. Serves almost no purpose whatsoever. Said player will still be playing in the ressies every week barring a catastrophic series of injuries. And said player won't be enough to right our season in the face of that catastrophic series of injuries.

Draft Wooler and our squad makeup is exactly the same as it is now.

Draft a decent prospect - raw, mature, tall, small, whatever - from anywhere else and we're adding another resource to the reserves as well as a break glass option for the seniors.
Don’t agree, at the moment we can’t pick someone like a Wooler for AFL, even if he’s out performing the AFL listed players.

In an ideal world, all clubs would be able to select anyone in their VFL teams, just have an extended supplementary/rookie list for them, and pay whatever they are paid now, plus AFL match payments if they play.
 

The Return of the Paf

Team Captain
Aug 22, 2020
353
333
AFL Club
Carlton
Don’t agree, at the moment we can’t pick someone like a Wooler for AFL, even if he’s out performing the AFL listed players.

In an ideal world, all clubs would be able to select anyone in their VFL teams, just have an extended supplementary/rookie list for them, and pay whatever they are paid now, plus AFL match payments if they play.
That might be begging the question that he'll be the best available player. It also wreaks of fearing someone else will take him. I wouldn't complain if we drafted him but I wouldn't be letting possessiveness influence our decision. He's a smart enough player and has a big tank for a tall but there's a chance he lacks the power and explosiveness for the AFL.
 

Blue__Balls

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 22, 2014
10,849
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I'm not sure what you're getting at to be honest, as it is we can't play Wooler or Crocker to cover Casboult so if we draft one of them or a player from somewhere else entirely it's the same outcome for the AFL list.
That's right - the same outcome for the AFL list, but if the player we draft is from another club then we also strengthen the reserves list at the same time. Win/win.

Paf seems to get what I'm saying. Draft Wooler and yes, he can play seniors, but if he doesn't then we haven't benefited at all. Draft someone else and they can play seniors too, plus they add to our reserves.
 

Arr0w

Brownlow Medallist
Nov 13, 2015
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Carlton
That's right - the same outcome for the AFL list, but if the player we draft is from another club then we also strengthen the reserves list at the same time. Win/win.

Paf seems to get what I'm saying. Draft Wooler and yes, he can play seniors, but if he doesn't then we haven't benefited at all. Draft someone else and they can play seniors too, plus they add to our reserves.
Very logical to me

As long as we target the best available need, which is a spine player
 

Dunna Heartknee

Team Captain
Jul 4, 2020
410
1,101
AFL Club
Carlton
That's right - the same outcome for the AFL list, but if the player we draft is from another club then we also strengthen the reserves list at the same time. Win/win.

Paf seems to get what I'm saying. Draft Wooler and yes, he can play seniors, but if he doesn't then we haven't benefited at all. Draft someone else and they can play seniors too, plus they add to our reserves.
I don't know Whether this analogy stands up
If another club takes Wooler/Parsons and they get 15 to 20 possies a game at Afl level, as well as kicking a couple of goals a week.
Fueling the crystal ball Carlton supporter anger, could you imagine the catastrophe in here in that scenario.
Leading to a new thread "bring back SOS get rid of Austin sack the coach this boards useless yada yada yada".
 

Coona Blues

Director of Coaching
Nov 3, 2011
3,278
9,089
Bundaberg, Qld
AFL Club
Carlton
The hiatus in the NAB League season is ill timed for us to assess McKay and Akuei, will be watching today’s audition game intently. An athletic and talented tall from our NGA is an attractive proposition. Undersized high leaping ruck/KPP is a great list fit. Just what his trajectory will be is very problematical. Continue to provide highlights and will be guaranteed to be taken in the National Draft, thus no opportunity to get him as a Cat B rookie “freebie”. Similarly McKay is a good prospect. Can’t be overstated as a great prospect, as not yet enough body of work to gauge his merits. I would back him to be a quality AFL player, and possesses a hard edge which would be very welcome on our list. Inside midfielder/defender, it is fair to say he would be groomed as a back in our group.

I love the romance of the Father/Son acquisitions, given Charlie’s lineage, his work ethic is a virtual guarantee. Akuei Would join a growing line of African heritage players impacting the AFL. Turns 19 on Tuesday so mid season eligible. Not sure if the lads need to have already nominated for the MSD to play in today’s Young Guns’ game, but would assume so. Hopefully, our list management guys can get a line on the likelihood or otherwise of other clubs nabbing the boys in the MSD.

My preference would be to draft a young ruckman through the mid season draft. Moyle, Podhajski, Flockhart, Edwards, Heath, Gundry and a couple of other overage boys have shown themselves to be decent ruck prospects. Surely we would welcome one of them. I also do not want to miss Charlie or Dom.

It is likely a major conundrum for our recruiting team, with only one spot available at the moment.
 
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Foucault1989

Premiership Player
Oct 16, 2016
3,962
8,131
AFL Club
Carlton
I don't mind Crocker as a fwd back up option, considering the fragile nature of our mid fwds currently on the list. Has a knack of finding the goals and might respond to a last chance.
I agree. He is a natural forward. Reward guys who are clearly performing rather than some abstract nobody with upside/talent but will need years of development
 

Coona Blues

Director of Coaching
Nov 3, 2011
3,278
9,089
Bundaberg, Qld
AFL Club
Carlton
I don't mind Crocker as a fwd back up option, considering the fragile nature of our mid fwds currently on the list. Has a knack of finding the goals and might respond to a last chance.
Agree Crocker is “killing” it as is the more relevant Wooller who fits a list shortcoming. Parsons, North and Radovanovic all have some claims on history and early season output. We are spoilt for options, with the above and the kids mentioned in my earlier post. Our overall list balance for me must be the over riding factor.
 

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