2021 NON AFL Thread - finance, ratings, participation etc.

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Rob

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Stirring the Melbourne/Sydney battle, tongue in cheek look at the F1 AGP location with Melbourne paying to keep the gig whilst Covid locks it out.

'Some years ago, The Herald Sun exclusively revealed that the overall cost of the five-year Melbourne F1 contract was $50m for the 2015 year. For some reason, four successive state governments had kept this secret for almost two decades. So, post-Covid you would expect the bastions of Bleak City would be sending F1 owners Liberty Media Corporation (NASDAQ: FWONK, $80 last close) an annual cheque for $70m.

So, is $80m a fair price for Sydney to pay? As we’ll see the price of hosting the traditionally powered petrol vehicles is about to jump, but all the local pollies would have to do is divert the fines from two well placed speed cameras for a year, so maybe $80m is a steal.'
It's a good question. Short answer is probably no, it isn't worth it. Not for a city like Sydney anyway which everyone around the world knows about. But if they're thinking about running a track near the harbour then maybe, it might be the sort of thing that inspires a lot of tourism post event.
 

Professor Knowall

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Pretty ordinary 23,314 crowd at the socceroos match against Saudi Arabia on Thursday night in Parramatta! ...
What I found most curious was that 3 of "our" socceroos have never lived in Australia, one was on his very first visit to our shores, another was on just his second visit while the third had been selected to represent "his" country before he had even got an Australian passport.
 

SBD Gonzalez

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Kidding, right?
What I found most curious was that 3 of "our" socceroos have never lived in Australia, one was on his very first visit to our shores, another was on just his second visit while the third had been selected to represent "his" country before he had even got an Australian passport.
Wow, I did not know that. Are there any criteria for being an “Australian” player other than an ability to boot a ball and a willingness to don the jersey?
 

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BobbyMorri

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Wow, I did not know that. Are there any criteria for being an “Australian” player other than an ability to boot a ball and a willingness to don the jersey?
Any player who refers to assume a new nationality and who has not played international football [in a match (either in full or in part) in an official competition of any category or any type of football] shall be eligible to play for the new representative team only if he fulfils one of the following conditions:
a) He was born on the territory of the relevant association;
b) His biological mother or biological father was born on the territory of the relevant association;
c) His grandmother or grandfather was born on the territory of the relevant association;
d) He has lived continuously for at least five years after reaching the age of 18 on the territory of the relevant association.

We take a few, we lose a few.

A few Aussies have played for other countries. For example, Lyndon Dykes was born on the Gold Coast and played rugby league as a kid but is playing for Scotland.


Edit: will also mention that Boyle, Souttar and Krancic all have parents who were either born here or are Australian.
 
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NoobPie

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What I found most curious was that 3 of "our" socceroos have never lived in Australia, one was on his very first visit to our shores, another was on just his second visit while the third had been selected to represent "his" country before he had even got an Australian passport.
I've got no problem with it personally - play for wherever you have an affinity or can get game.

It demonstrates something that shouldnt really be in doubt anyway....

..... Any claim that Australian soccer through perhaps marginally higher club participation rates necessarily produces better players is absurd.

How many males in Scotland between the ages of 20 and 30 have an Australian parent?
If it's four figures that would surprise me.
 

BobbyMorri

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I've got no problem with it personally - play for wherever you have an affinity or can get game.

It demonstrates something that shouldnt really be in doubt anyway....

..... Any claim that Australian soccer through perhaps marginally higher club participation rates necessarily produces better players is absurd.

How many males in Scotland between the ages of 20 and 30 have an Australian parent?
If it's four figures that would surprise me.
8,279 Australian born people were in Scotland in 2011. Out of 113K for the whole of the UK.


not sure what your point is.
 

NoobPie

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8,279 Australian born people were in Scotland in 2011. Out of 113K for the whole of the UK.

....which I suspect would have the number of males in their 20s with an Australian parent below 1,000


not sure what your point is.


Point was remarkably easy to follow I thought....



It demonstrates something that shouldnt really be in doubt anyway....

..... Any claim that Australian soccer through perhaps marginally higher club participation rates necessarily produces better players is absurd.

How many males in Scotland between the ages of 20 and 30 have an Australian parent?
If it's four figures that would surprise me.
Many an Australian soccer fan has tried to claim that raw participation rates mean there is more athletic sporting talent in Australian soccer than Australian football

But then, from the few hundred scot's of age with an Australian mum, there a 3 players that squeeze out the 9 million Australian's playing soccer from 3 of the Socceroos spots

Apologise to everyone else who no doubt grasped this point on the previous post
 

BobbyMorri

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....which I suspect would have the number of males in their 20s with an Australian parent below 1,000

Point was remarkably easy to follow I thought....


Many an Australian soccer fan has tried to claim that raw participation rates mean there is more athletic sporting talent in Australian soccer than Australian football

But then, from the few hundred scot's of age with an Australian mum, there a 3 players that squeeze out the 9 million Australian's playing soccer from 3 of the Socceroos spots

Apologise to everyone else who no doubt grasped this point on the previous post
No, I thought that was your "point." Even for you, that is a big reach that I couldn't believe what you were saying.

For one, I think most Aussie soccer fans wish that they had access to more talent, not the other way round. I have never heard the claim that you are saying regarding "soccer fans", but you seem to linger more on soccer forums than I do, so who knows.

Two, It is 2 Aussie males out of all the current Socceroos and Matildas. They are Martin Boyle and Harry Souttar. Fran Karačić is not a Scot, as you can tell by his name.

which leads me to 3 perfectly. Karačić is a Croat-Aussie. They have a population of 4 Mil and made the World Cup final. Participation is a factor for the strength of a national team, but far more important is how you train that "athletic" talent and mould him into a rare talent capable of playing at the top level. As you can tell by Croatia. it is why China sucks, despite having 300x greater population.

For me, Participation is a factor for interest and tv ratings. But how large a factor is hard to qualify. I would say small based on personal experience. A mate of mine loves playing soccer but can't stand to watch it. Another mate loves watching soccer but never played it.
 
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Aussie in exile

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No, I thought that was your "point." Even for you, that is a big reach that I couldn't believe what you were saying.

For one, I think most Aussie soccer fans wish that they had access to more talent, not the other way round. I have never heard the claim that you are saying regarding "soccer fans", but you seem to linger more on soccer forums than I do, so who knows.

Two, It is 2 Aussie males out of all the current Socceroos and Matildas. They are Martin Boyle and Harry Souttar. Fran Karačić is not a Scot, as you can tell by his name.

which leads me to 3 perfectly. Karačić is a Croat-Aussie. They have a population of 4 Mil and made the World Cup final. Participation is a factor for the strength of a national team, but far more important is how you train that "athletic" talent and mould him into a rare talent capable of playing at the top level. As you can tell by Croatia. it is why China sucks, despite having 300x greater population.

For me, Participation is a factor for interest and tv ratings. But how large a factor is hard to qualify. I would say small based on personal experience. A mate of mine loves playing soccer but can't stand to watch it. Another mate loves watching soccer but never played it.
The pinnacle of any sport is to represent your country
It's ok to play for your home town or city or state, but the ultimate is international level
 

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NoobPie

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What sort of audience watched the T20 final ?
129K apparently....


Decent given when it was held.

Certainly in cricket, as much as any sport, the international competition is the pinnacle of the game. True also in rugby union. So true in the two traditional sports of the English upper crust

Either not true or at best very debatable in any other professional team sport I can think off. Debatable in soccer and very much not true in:
  • Basketball
  • American football
  • Australian football
  • Ice hockey
  • Baseball
  • Rugby League (accept in the most deluded of brains)
 

Aussie in exile

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But.... Australian football doesn't have international representation and yet it's the pinnacle of Australian sport !
On a domestic level yes, but the country has a population less that some cities in the world.
Only about 25% of the population watch the AFL grand final, which = about 75% of the population of the country aren't interested and other sports here are even less. I have no figures for how many people watched this years GF outside of Australia, but very few i suspect.
Look how many people worldwide would have seen the Super Bowl final and look how quickly NFL games sell out in London and like the AFL the NFL is a domestic competition
Cricket and union and basketball worldwide are light years ahead of AF and are sports which you can play for your country.
 

Aussie in exile

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129K apparently....


Decent given when it was held.

Certainly in cricket, as much as any sport, the international competition is the pinnacle of the game. True also in rugby union. So true in the two traditional sports of the English upper crust

Either not true or at best very debatable in any other professional team sport I can think off. Debatable in soccer and very much not true in:
  • Basketball
  • American football
  • Australian football
  • Ice hockey
  • Baseball
  • Rugby League (accept in the most deluded of brains)
Your fear of Rugby League is showing again.
Have you ever though why Rugby League has professional and semi professional teams outside of Australia and AF doesn't?
 

HavUEvaSeenTheRain

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On a domestic level yes, but the country has a population less that some cities in the world.
Only about 25% of the population watch the AFL grand final, which = about 75% of the population of the country aren't interested and other sports here are even less. I have no figures for how many people watched this years GF outside of Australia, but very few i suspect.
Look how many people worldwide would have seen the Super Bowl final and look how quickly NFL games sell out in London and like the AFL the NFL is a domestic competition
Cricket and union and basketball worldwide are light years ahead of AF and are sports which you can play for your country.
Even in the US ~70% of people “aren’t interested” in the Super Bowl.
I imagine the World Cup final which is the pinnacle in that sport would also show ~80-90% of people not interested in most soccer countries.
 

Aussie in exile

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Even in the US ~70% of people “aren’t interested” in the Super Bowl.
I imagine the World Cup final which is the pinnacle in that sport would also show ~80-90% of people not interested in most soccer countries.
That raises questions when why do US advertisers pay huge rates to pay for air time at the Super Bowel?
 

SBD Gonzalez

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Kidding, right?
That raises questions when why do US advertisers pay huge rates to pay for air time at the Super Bowel?
Because it's an absolutely massive event. But the perception that the whole of America stops for it is clearly quite wrong.

(Mind you, you didn't say Super Bowl, but Super Bowel, which is a very different thing, and may well be a massive event; I wouldn't know ;))
 

NoobPie

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On a domestic level yes, but the country has a population less that some cities in the world.
So? Your point was this...


The pinnacle of any sport is to represent your country
It's ok to play for your home town or city or state, but the ultimate is international level
I demonstrated that was nonsense.


Only about 25% of the population watch the AFL grand final, which = about 75% of the population of the country aren't interested and other sports here are even less. I have no figures for how many people watched this years GF outside of Australia, but very few i suspect.
Look how many people worldwide would have seen the Super Bowl final and look how quickly NFL games sell out in London and like the AFL the NFL is a domestic competition
So? Another purely domestic one country sport is more popular globally than the AFL?

How is this relevant to supporting your completely wrong claim ?

It just reinforces my point - in the US as well as Australia, the dominant sporting code does not have any international representation. How can that be possible without a "pinnacle"?

Cricket and union and basketball worldwide are light years ahead of AF and are sports which you can play for your country.
In no way is international representation the pinnacle of basketball

Rugby union isn't "light years" ahead of AF. Rugby union doesn't have anything like the AFL in terms of club competitions. I saw something a couple of year's ago showing its global revenues are less than double that of the AFL.

Your fear of Rugby League is showing again.
Have you ever though why Rugby League has professional and semi professional teams outside of Australia and AF doesn't?
Says the rugby league troll who is about to celebrate 8 sad, sad years making of 2,500 posts on a forum of a sport he clearly hates!

I said nothing offensive towards rugby league - just to the very small subset of League fans who are deluded enough to think the international game is the "pinnacle" of that sport rather than SoO or the NRL.
 

Bjo187

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Your fear of Rugby League is showing again.
Have you ever though why Rugby League has professional and semi professional teams outside of Australia and AF doesn't?
Because it's an english sport and the British empire spread their culture throughout the world. Same as american culture now and basketball being popular. Australia has zero relevance on the world stage and had even less when these sports were growing. I'm actually more amazed at how small rugby league is internationally for being a British sport.
 

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