Ultimate Glory 2021 Peter Crimmins Medal - Congrats Tom Mitchell!

Who wins the PCM?

  • Tom Mitchell

    Votes: 36 87.8%
  • Chad Wingard

    Votes: 1 2.4%
  • Jaeger O’Meara

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Blake Hardwick

    Votes: 2 4.9%
  • Jack Scrimshaw

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Dylan Moore

    Votes: 2 4.9%

  • Total voters
    41

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TheFourPillars

Brownlow Medallist
May 6, 2009
11,690
27,098
AFL Club
Hawthorn
So what you are saying is, the coaches rate 10 players, on average ahead of him due to coaches voting on only the line they coach and Clarko floating across the team but favouring mids? Amd that among defenders, the two main ones ahead of him are superior defensively, even though their offensive output is often lower?

an implication of the way you described the voting process as by coaching line is that Tom Mitchell received A shed load of 4 vote performances and almost never anything lower than a 3. He averaged 7.3 votes per game. What a freak! But does that stack up? 🤔

it also means that the highest tally you can get from only your line coaches is 88 if you get 22 4 vote games. And 4 votes are restricted to players who perform exceptional performances so shouldn’t be handed out four times a week. Yet we have 6 players who have more than 88 votes. Both Hardwick and omeara average over 6 votes a game. As did chad. Don’t think that is possible unless coaches are voting across lines.
Yes otherwise Gunston wouldnt have won it last year
 

Simon Crawshay

Club Legend
Jun 4, 2016
2,098
5,224
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Tom Mitchell. What a star he is at hawthorn. In the four seasons he has played (I exclude 2019 as he didn’t play a game), he has gone 1, 1, 2, 1 in the pcm. Incredible!
We certainly got out money's worth for that trade. He has been so consistent, a true pro.

That's how I rate the really good players, the ones that bring it every single week.

That's why I think Sam Mitchell is top 3 Hawk of all time, he played 300 games for the club and I would suggest at least 280 of those games where absolute top shelf quality.
 

Lotus

Premium Platinum
Aug 6, 2016
1,806
4,277
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Don't we have the most improved player this year? Or is that why Dylan Moore was getting interviewed?

So happy for Howe, polled well with few rounds getting the max votes(16).

Also good interview with Gunston, looks like he's staying 😊.
 

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grumbleguts

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 14, 2011
11,674
25,414
Tully FNQ
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Tom MITCHELL161
Blake HARDWICK126
Jaeger O’MEARA121
Dylan MOORE101
Chad WINGARD100
Sam FROST95
Daniel HOWE83
Changkuoth JIATH79
James WORPEL74
Liam SHIELS74
Luke BREUST73
Jack SCRIMSHAW70
Kyle HARTIGAN69
Ben McEVOY67
Jacob KOSCHITZKE63
Jonathon CEGLAR57
Jarman IMPEY54
Tom PHILLIPS48
Mitchell LEWIS47
Tim O’BRIEN45
Harry MORRISON42
Shaun BURGOYNE41
Lachlan BRAMBLE41
Will DAY30
Conor NASH22
Tyler BROCKMAN19
James COUSINS17
Oliver HANRAHAN*13
Jai NEWCOMBE12
Denver GRAINGER-BARRAS10
Damon GREAVES*9
Ned REEVES*8
Michael HARTLEY7
Joshua MORRIS1
Finn MAGINNESS1
 

grumbleguts

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 14, 2011
11,674
25,414
Tully FNQ
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Conor Nash 20 votes, and if you consider the likelihood that all of those votes were from the last 4 rounds, Nash averaged 5 votes per game as a midfielder.
 

Pessimistic

Make me an Admin!
Sep 13, 2000
81,914
38,770
Melbourne cricket ground. Australia
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I've changed my thinking on this. At the time I was convinced Howe just made the wrong decision and Clarko covered for it. I'm convinced now it was bad coaching. We had Geelong on the ropes. That ball HAD to hit the top of the square.

Anyway, no harm done in the scheme of things. Geelong still blew it come September and Howe had a career best season. Happy ending!
‘Didn’t Hodgey once do that? Howe in good company
 

4THAWN

Club Legend
Mar 25, 2019
2,215
2,568
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Personally bit surprised to see Hardwick polling 2nd in BnF.

Not that I don't rate him, just felt like he's still been a bit down on his 2018 form.
 

Ned Ryerson

Future Captain
Sep 23, 2012
16,763
54,021
Punxsutawney, PA
AFL Club
Hawthorn
I thought he was superb this year. Back to his best for mine.
Had a career year for both disposals and rebound 50s. Was an absolute rock down back. Games I was lucky enough to go to where you get to notice far more of the off the ball stuff he was absolutely at his best this year.
 

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darthmann

Premiership Player
Jun 11, 2013
3,657
9,480
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Hawthorn
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GSW
Had a career year for both disposals and rebound 50s. Was an absolute rock down back. Games I was lucky enough to go to where you get to notice far more of the off the ball stuff he was absolutely at his best this year.
he was the only one i thought had any chance of knocking off Tom

didn't even come close, but 2nd is a great result for him
 

Guardian Hawk

Premiership Player
Oct 16, 2003
3,692
5,380
Murrumbeena
AFL Club
Hawthorn
So glad for whipping boy Dan Howe and also Bramble. 41 votes in 10 matches is very impressive for this seasons PSD pick up.

Hope all you guys (and families and pets) voted for TOB in the mark of the year. Would be nice for him to win it.
Had Bramble played every game, extrapolating his votes over 10 rounds to 22 rounds would have placed him 7th! That's amazing for any first year player, let alone a supplementary selection.
 

darthmann

Premiership Player
Jun 11, 2013
3,657
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GSW
Had Bramble played every game, extrapolating his votes over 10 rounds to 22 rounds would have placed him 7th! That's amazing for any first year player, let alone a supplementary selection.
i usually believe that, in spite of all the promise and flashes of brilliance they can show, first-year players are typically a net-negative. This is often due to defensive awareness, and it's less noticeable to supporters because we don't really watch for accountability to opponents or structural setups. There are obviously exceptions — Cyril, Sam Walsh, Rowell in his first few games, etc.

But for the most part, if you compared their contribution to the contribution they allow their opponents to make (through whatever deficiencies you may have as a rookie), it would be negative. It's just less pronounced in the AFL because it's so complex and there's 18 people on the ground, as opposed to say, the NBA where rookies are almost constantly exposed on one end of the floor (usually defensive).

With the exception of the game against Richmond, in my eyes, Bramble was 100% a net positive. This is reflected in that extrapolated PCM vote count, which would very likely take into account defensive awareness, adherence to structures/plan etc. He more than doubled Brocky's votes from less games, quintipled Reeves' from double the games, and had a similar ratio compared to Duke. Kosi's vote count was very impressive too, but Bramble would've smashed him if they played the same number of games.

This might all stem from his maturity relative to the other blokes on the list, but basically the only thing I want people to take away from this post is:

Lachie Bramble is a ******* gun
 

Bedi

Premiership Player
Mar 8, 2014
3,972
4,400
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Sneaky chance for a Brownlow?
Glad to see JOM poll so well. Loved his season this year. Much more consistent and great to see him employ one of the best 'Don't Argues' in the league
 

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