List Mgmt. 2021 Team & Beyond...

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Dahlhaus seems to be the type of guy who gets criticized every time we lose despite being a really important player for us. He works his ass off, is great defensively and much more clever with the ball than most realise. The GF was a perfect example where people are criticising him but he was probably in our best 10 players (4 score involvements while being really good defensively). Apart from being quiet in the prelim he was in our better players in the other 3 finals. He has one bad moment in the GF (miscommunication with Hawkins) and suddenly people say he'll struggle to get games. His contract runs out basically on his 30th birthday and so far he's finished 6th in our B&F and had a really solid year this year where he was miles inside our best 22 (he's a very similar in style to Atkins but much clearly a couple of rungs higher in class). We gave up nothing for him except a moderate salary and we'll likely get 4 years of good footy out of him. Sounds like a really good result to me.
 
Johnny Cattery said:
For quite a while took Geelong clearly tried to draft at least one Indigenous player each year:
2017 Tim Kelly
2016 Brandan Parfitt, Quinton Narkle and Jamaine Jones (rookie)
2014 Nakia Cockatoo
2013 Zac Bates (rookie)
2012 Brad Hartman
2011 Joel Hamling
2009 Allen Christensen
2008 Steven Motlop, Adam Varcoe (rookie)
2006 Nathan Djerrkura
2005 Travis Varcoe, Matthew Stokes

It seemed to stop in 2019 and 2018, although you could also say that in those years we didn’t have picks for the good Indigenous players that were available (like Rankine, say).

Over the last tnen years we’ve had a lot of fringe players go to other clubs and not make an impact. But the first-team players who have gone on to play consistently at other clubs have disproportionately been Indigenous: Varcoe, Christesen, Kelly, and likely Cockatoo. An untried player (Hamling) chose a list spot at the Bulldogs over a rookie spot with us. Probably the reasons for leaving were different in each case, but if Cockatoo and Narkle both go (again, for different reasons) then Parfitt will be the only Indigenous player left, and it starts to look a bit like a pattern.

I hope there are a couple of Indigenous players around for this and next year’s draft that we are considering.
Click to expand...
In 2018 we added Kreuger & Schlensog to the list

Last year was the first time for a few years we didn't add an Indigenous player to the list
 
Johnny Cattery said:
For quite a while took Geelong clearly tried to draft at least one Indigenous player each year:
2017 Tim Kelly
2016 Brandan Parfitt, Quinton Narkle and Jamaine Jones (rookie)
2014 Nakia Cockatoo
2013 Zac Bates (rookie)
2012 Brad Hartman
2011 Joel Hamling
2009 Allen Christensen
2008 Steven Motlop, Adam Varcoe (rookie)
2006 Nathan Djerrkura
2005 Travis Varcoe, Matthew Stokes

It seemed to stop in 2019 and 2018, although you could also say that in those years we didn’t have picks for the good Indigenous players that were available (like Rankine, say).

Over the last tnen years we’ve had a lot of fringe players go to other clubs and not make an impact. But the first-team players who have gone on to play consistently at other clubs have disproportionately been Indigenous: Varcoe, Christesen, Kelly, and likely Cockatoo. An untried player (Hamling) chose a list spot at the Bulldogs over a rookie spot with us. Probably the reasons for leaving were different in each case, but if Cockatoo and Narkle both go (again, for different reasons) then Parfitt will be the only Indigenous player left, and it starts to look a bit like a pattern.

I hope there are a couple of Indigenous players around for this and next year’s draft that we are considering.
Click to expand...
Indigenous:
Kreuger?
Close?

Black:
Sav?
Okunbor?

And then the Irish boys.

We are not mono-cultural.
 

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rocker_oz33 said:
Chook been told to look for another Hen house ...explore he's options .
Click to expand...

No surprises there. Was clearly a fair way down the list of options, can only play as a mid and guys like Guthrie and Parfitt transitioning so well to full-time midfielders and Simpson breaking out meant the writing was likely on the wall.
 
Footy Smarts said:
No surprises there. Was clearly a fair way down the list of options, can only play as a mid and guys like Guthrie and Parfitt transitioning so well to full-time midfielders and Simpson breaking out meant the writing was likely on the wall.
Click to expand...

Yep.
They tried to get him to work on other things to improve he's game.

Heard there was noone interested in him.
 
I think Geel really after Saturdays GF - really need to quietly pause and stop - and do a 360%

You look at Rich - Geel to compete need speed all over the park - so what is the use of recruiting a 28 year old centre half forward - and coming off a shocking 2020 season and worse still give up some of those precious early draft picks . But Cook wont do that - because he opened his big mouth and said we are into Jeremy Cameron big time

Geel need run out of the defence - Taylor has done a good job - but he is stationary

No Higgins - no Isac Smith - no more Jack Stevens ( absolutely shocking ) no more Josh Jenkins - no more tired old hacks - let them contribute to their own Super fund

Please go the youth track - even it means a fair spell out of the finals - im sick of it
 
Goggin Our Best said:
I think Geel really after Saturdays GF - really need to quietly pause and stop - and do a 360%

You look at Rich - Geel to compete need speed all over the park - so what is the use of recruiting a 28 year old centre half forward - and coming off a shocking 2020 season and worse still give up some of those precious early draft picks . But Cook wont do that - because he opened his big mouth and said we are into Jeremy Cameron big time

Geel need run out of the defence - Taylor has done a good job - but he is stationary

No Higgins - no Isac Smith - no more Jack Stevens ( absolutely shocking ) no more Josh Jenkins - no more tired old hacks - let them contribute to their own Super fund

Please go the youth track - even it means a fair spell out of the finals - im sick of it
Click to expand...


Richmond have a system that suits their players.

Agree they have speed all over the ground.

Add some youth with some with some other picks but not all old Farts.
 
Goggin Our Best said:
I think Geel really after Saturdays GF - really need to quietly pause and stop - and do a 360%

You look at Rich - Geel to compete need speed all over the park - so what is the use of recruiting a 28 year old centre half forward - and coming off a shocking 2020 season and worse still give up some of those precious early draft picks . But Cook wont do that - because he opened his big mouth and said we are into Jeremy Cameron big time

Geel need run out of the defence - Taylor has done a good job - but he is stationary

No Higgins - no Isac Smith - no more Jack Stevens ( absolutely shocking ) no more Josh Jenkins - no more tired old hacks - let them contribute to their own Super fund

Please go the youth track - even it means a fair spell out of the finals - im sick of it
Click to expand...

I hold the complete opposite view to this
 
Commando said:
I hold the complete opposite view to this
Click to expand...

Whatever view we each hold of our preferred future in terms of list management, it's surely mistaken to think that the club is going to greatly alter its approach at this point in the team's development. We just went closer to a flag than we have for almost 10 years, and have a limited window before a number of generational players retire. We have some natural attrition taking place, but also have plans before next season to:

(a) recruit a quality forward to maintain the team's balance in F50 for some time beyond Tomahawk's departure;
(b) take the highest number of early picks we've had in quite a while to the draft.

We also have some players on the list who took large strides forward this year, and some on the periphery who still show signs of being worth a decent look as well.

With all that in place, it's hard to see how the club will be contemplating abandoning the current policy of mix and match in developing our list, through a continued hybrid approach around draft/trade/FA.

For those who'd like some years out of the finals, that could still come soon enough. But surely for the moment we can't realistically expect the club to intentionally dive down the ladder when we'll take at least 20 players from this year's GF side (with at least one very notable addition) into next season. Having come this far, I can understand why the club would be 'chips in' on trying to push through with the current strategy until all hope of success with this group is realistically eliminated.

In the end, being more than two goals up at half-time (and it should have been more) in a GF against the competition's latest juggernaut is hardly grounds to objectively suggest we are miles off and should now rush to raze the list.
 
goyoucatters said:
Whatever view we each hold of our preferred future in terms of list management, it's surely mistaken to think that the club is going to greatly alter its approach at this point in the team's development. We just went closer to a flag than we have for almost 10 years, and have a limited window before a number of generational players retire. We have some natural attrition taking place, but also have plans before next season to:

(a) recruit a quality forward to maintain the team's balance in F50 for some time beyond Tomahawk's departure;
(b) take the highest number of early picks we've had in quite a while to the draft.

We also have some players on the list who took large strides forward this year, and some on the periphery who still show signs of being worth a decent look as well.

With all that in place, it's hard to see how the club will be contemplating abandoning the current policy of mix and match in developing our list, through a continued hybrid approach around draft/trade/FA.

For those who'd like some years out of the finals, that could still come soon enough. But surely for the moment we can't realistically expect the club to intentionally dive down the ladder when we'll take at least 20 players from this year's GF side (with at least one very notable addition) into next season. Having come this far, I can understand why the club would be 'chips in' on trying to push through with the current strategy until all hope of success with this group is realistically eliminated.

In the end, being more than two goals up at half-time (and it should have been more) in a GF against the competition's latest juggernaut is hardly grounds to objectively suggest we are miles off and should now rush to raze the list.
Click to expand...

No - what you say overlooks one important and unique point - Geel got big overs for Kelly - so they have got some lovely draft picks which they can reset and propel the club forwards - instead of wasting some of them on a CHF who will be 30 when Hawkins retires - and a CHF who according to Malthouse ( and dont give me this nonsense that he doesnt know because unlike us he is a premiership player and 3 time flag coach ) tries when he feels like it - and is coming off a woeful 2020 season .
 
Goggin Our Best said:
No - what you say overlooks one important and unique point - Geel got big overs for Kelly - so they have got some lovely draft picks which they can reset and propel the club forwards - instead of wasting some of them on a CHF who will be 30 when Hawkins retires - and a CHF who according to Malthouse ( and dont give me this nonsense that he doesnt know because unlike us he is a premiership player and 3 time flag coach ) tries when he feels like it - and is coming off a woeful 2020 season .
Click to expand...

It's not clear that the club will be 'wasting' picks on Cameron at this point. Could still be compo pick alone, as far as we know right now. And, even if it's not, the idea that the club will willingly choose to slide down the ladder (while still having a list that was good enough to go all the way to the GF this year) is simply improbable in my view.

We have plenty on the list at the moment that helped to propel the club forward to what we achieved this season. And of the 22 who played in the GF, only five of them were first-round picks. We've had two top ten picks in the draft since 2003, and have missed the finals twice since 2004.

I agree that it would be great to take all three first-rounders to the draft. But the idea that we're doomed if we don't simply isn't borne out by the evidence of how our club has performed in recent seasons.
 
Last edited:

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CatToTheFuture said:
I think trade radio literally just mixed up which Higgins it was talking about. Wouldn't get your hopes up
Click to expand...

I havent listened to trade Radio.

I think snags want to just play bit like Butler just year.


I rather him over Old man Smith.

I understand he's health issues.
But I think he's worth it..

# getsnags.
 
bellpark said:
Good God no - you can’t be serious. It looks like this plodding average silvertail has been lined up for President but if that happens, we are going backwards quickly. Colin Carter had a sustained record of real success, as did Frank Costa. This clown screwed Cricket Australia royally ( they are still damaged even now culturally) due to his leadership. He got a high TV deal because there were competing bids. So what. Every other aspect of CA has been a disgrace - cheating, corporate incompetenc.old boys club etc. Why would a strong proud regional club who has fought for 20 years to build good governance and an aligned culture then make the classic boys club mistake of appointing someone with such a poor record. My God look at the hub situation with his son where the club was forced to argue that he and his son got golden tickets because he could ‘advise on living away from home for sports teams’. NO-ONE believed that rubbish and I certainly felt insulted by them arguing that - made me feel the club was taking its members as idiots. As soon as this guy is involved, we will be treated like idiots.
Click to expand...
I said the exact same think the day they added him to the board.
Presided over sandpaper gate and was involved in the blues cap cheating.
 
Goggin Our Best said:
No Higgins - no Isac Smith - no more Jack Stevens ( absolutely shocking ) no more Josh Jenkins - no more tired old hacks - let them contribute to their own Super fund

Please go the youth track - even it means a fair spell out of the finals - im sick of it
Click to expand...

Completely agree apart from one thing. Don’t think we need to plummet out of the finals. Can still remain extremely competitive while blooding the right replacements.
 
Footy Smarts said:
Dahlhaus seems to be the type of guy who gets criticized every time we lose despite being a really important player for us. He works his ass off, is great defensively and much more clever with the ball than most realise. The GF was a perfect example where people are criticising him but he was probably in our best 10 players (4 score involvements while being really good defensively). Apart from being quiet in the prelim he was in our better players in the other 3 finals. He has one bad moment in the GF (miscommunication with Hawkins) and suddenly people say he'll struggle to get games. His contract runs out basically on his 30th birthday and so far he's finished 6th in our B&F and had a really solid year this year where he was miles inside our best 22 (he's a very similar in style to Atkins but much clearly a couple of rungs higher in class). We gave up nothing for him except a moderate salary and we'll likely get 4 years of good footy out of him. Sounds like a really good result to me.
Click to expand...

Dahlhaus is great defensively?
He isn't great at all. He's below average in many key areas such as tackling, one percenters and only manages 11 pressure acts per game.

When Sam Simpson came back into the side, it was immediately noticeable what great defensively is all about. Gary Rohan, Gary Ablett, Luke Dahlhaus were three of the most ineffectual defensive minded forwards in the team.

While it is sad to see the little master retire, our team will be better off for it in 2021. The moment Gary Rohan and Luke Dahlhaus get pushed aside (somehow), is the day we have a much more potent and reliable forward line.
 
catscollector said:
Dahlhaus is great defensively?
He isn't great at all. He's below average in many key areas such as tackling, one percenters and only manages 11 pressure acts per game.

When Sam Simpson came back into the side, it was immediately noticeable what great defensively is all about. Gary Rohan, Gary Ablett, Luke Dahlhaus were three of the most ineffectual defensive minded forwards in the team.

While it is sad to see the little master retire, our team will be better off for it in 2021. The moment Gary Rohan and Luke Dahlhaus get pushed aside (somehow), is the day we have a much more potent and reliable forward line.
Click to expand...

No no no. You don't understand footy clearly. Rohan is great defensively. I've been "called out" in facto for daring to suggest otherwise. Opposition teams are in terror of him.

In fact, "we need to remember this game as a marker of the influence Rohan can have without many stats." Indeed. His influence was profound.
 
Johnny Cattery said:
For quite a while took Geelong clearly tried to draft at least one Indigenous player each year:
2017 Tim Kelly
2016 Brandan Parfitt, Quinton Narkle and Jamaine Jones (rookie)
2014 Nakia Cockatoo
2013 Zac Bates (rookie)
2012 Brad Hartman
2011 Joel Hamling
2009 Allen Christensen
2008 Steven Motlop, Adam Varcoe (rookie)
2006 Nathan Djerrkura
2005 Travis Varcoe, Matthew Stokes

It seemed to stop in 2019 and 2018, although you could also say that in those years we didn’t have picks for the good Indigenous players that were available (like Rankine, say).

Over the last tnen years we’ve had a lot of fringe players go to other clubs and not make an impact. But the first-team players who have gone on to play consistently at other clubs have disproportionately been Indigenous: Varcoe, Christesen, Kelly, and likely Cockatoo. An untried player (Hamling) chose a list spot at the Bulldogs over a rookie spot with us. Probably the reasons for leaving were different in each case, but if Cockatoo and Narkle both go (again, for different reasons) then Parfitt will be the only Indigenous player left, and it starts to look a bit like a pattern.

I hope there are a couple of Indigenous players around for this and next year’s draft that we are considering.
Click to expand...
what pattern is that??
ALL different reasons for leaving, as you say.
We have hung onto Cocky way too long, and if comes good at Lions, I'll be spewing.
Kelly was not our choice.
Narkle and Jones just not that good.

I would love to know exactly what happened with Cocky this year. Very disappointing that after all the care and treatment, he is finally on the hunt for Lions .
 
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