List Mgmt. 2021 Trade & List Management Thread II - IN: CCJ

[giantroo]

Spoiler: Lore's 2021 Draft Order

Spoiler: Lore's 2022 Future Picks Draft Order

 

[Le Grille]

Most could see it without hindsight


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he didn’t come on due to the concussions he was on a similar path than most KPFs, I mean in terms of output yeah it’s a bust but it wasn’t necessarily the wrong pick

 

[DocSholl]

Every list management strategy looks genius after a flag. Melbourne was looking down the barrel of consecutive bottom four finishes 2/3 way through last year.

 

[Le Grille]

Every list management strategy looks genius after a flag. Melbourne was looking down the barrel of consecutive bottom four finishes 2/3 way through last year.

^ this

 

[Le Grille]

Every list management strategy looks genius after a flag. Melbourne was looking down the barrel of consecutive bottom four finishes 2/3 way through last year.

Even Richmond looked like middle table fodder before it clicked could even say Geelong circa 2006, drafting is part of it but finding that thing to make it click is what wins the flag.

 

[The Warlord]

A lot has been said about the Dees list build, but the dogs has also been good.

- Both sides used real pointy picks on mids, which created a foundation of competition star mids (Trac, Oliver, Brayshaw, Bont, Macrae, Smith).
- Both sides have brought in an early pick KPP once the mid is established (Jackson, Naughton).
- Both sides used a first rounder on a elite small forward (Weightman, Pickett).
- Both sides have nailed their second & third round picks (Rivers, Fritsch, Dale, Daniel to name a few but there are quite a few more).

Then in regards to trading:
- Both sides addressed their KPD stocks via trading (May, Lever, Keath, Gardner).
- The dees were very specific with their trading for KPDs & paid what many thought was “overs” for exactly what they wanted, you could argue that this is why their back 6 is stronger then the Dogs who didn’t pay a premium for theirs.
- The Dees trade for Langdon has proved to be a master stroke & the Brown trade was very smart in a role that they needed.
- Dogs lucked out with the Collingwood mess by netting Treloar.

We have a few years to go…

POTY (for this thread)

 

[tales129]

Let’s be open about the small forward role.

they don’t get measured individually, last night fritsch bobbed up and took the opportunity, whereas against the cats they spread that load and kozi kicked 3 and fritsch 2.

look at the prelim for the dogs and their small defenders ******* completely blanketed ports small forwards and that allowed them to restrict ports fire power. That didn’t happen last night due to weight of numbers from the midfield.

As an aside, Jackson has been absolutely pivotal to them allowing Gawn to play forward but also be fresh and have more impact when max plays on the ball. Just go back to that 3rd quarter against us where Jackson tore goldy a new one and they kicked 6 odd goals.

if I was freo I’d want cerra to be choosing Melbourne, then have a genuine crack at bringing Jackson home.

 

[Ashley B]

Having a good cohesive administration also is helpful in winning a flag. But don’t forget luck , you do need an ounce of luck , but then using it to your advantage is the key.

 

[Le Grille]

Let’s be open about the small forward role.

they don’t get measured individually, last night fritsch bobbed up and took the opportunity, whereas against the cats they spread that load and kozi kicked 3 and fritsch 2.

look at the prelim for the dogs and their small defenders ******* completely blanketed ports small forwards and that allowed them to restrict ports fire power. That didn’t happen last night due to weight of numbers from the midfield.

As an aside, Jackson has been absolutely pivotal to them allowing Gawn to play forward but also be fresh and have more impact when max plays on the ball. Just go back to that 3rd quarter against us where Jackson tore goldy a new one and they kicked 6 odd goals.

if I was freo I’d want cerra to be choosing Melbourne, then have a genuine crack at bringing Jackson home.

Yeah on the small forwards it’s such an in exact science, if they get 3 kicks and 3 goals that’s a good day yet if they don’t hit the scoreboard, lay tackles or get assists they are a black hole

 

[Le Grille]

Having a good cohesive administration also is helpful in winning a flag. But don’t forget luck , you do need an ounce of luck , but then using it to your advantage is the key.

Most definitely, St Kilda 2004-2010 had easily a stronger side and could’ve easily won 3 flags.

 

[Kangaroos techno]

Let’s be open about the small forward role.

they don’t get measured individually, last night fritsch bobbed up and took the opportunity, whereas against the cats they spread that load and kozi kicked 3 and fritsch 2.

look at the prelim for the dogs and their small defenders ******* completely blanketed ports small forwards and that allowed them to restrict ports fire power. That didn’t happen last night due to weight of numbers from the midfield.

As an aside, Jackson has been absolutely pivotal to them allowing Gawn to play forward but also be fresh and have more impact when max plays on the ball. Just go back to that 3rd quarter against us where Jackson tore goldy a new one and they kicked 6 odd goals.

if I was freo I’d want cerra to be choosing Melbourne, then have a genuine crack at bringing Jackson home.

Agreed. Hats off to Shermanator for being all over Jackson early. I never saw it but he's a ripper and has come on surprisingly quickly. Melbourne have hit the jackpot there and the transition from gawn to jackson will be seamless. Should prolong Gawn's career too.

It's hard to get through the demons wall when you have lever, may, and gawn sitting back while Jackson rucks.

 

[DocSholl]

Even Richmond looked like middle table fodder before it clicked could even say Geelong circa 2006, drafting is part of it but finding that thing to make it click is what wins the flag.

Yep there is usually a point where there is a cultural "click". Or they get the right mix of assistant coaches etc.

I wouldn't focus too much on how a flag list is built as it is different for every team (although obviously it's important to get list management decisions right). It more speaks to getting the culture within your playing and coaching groups right.

 

[AnEmptyChair]

Hopefully last night puts an end to the thoughts of using high picks on small forwards. 2 gems out there last night, in Weightman and Picket, 11 touches between them 0 score.

Not a position to waste a good pick on!

LOL yes, two 20 year olds playing the hardest position on the ground not having a big impact in the biggest game of all is a reason why you shouldn't pick a player high if they're super talented and in a position which is a clear need.

That's just bizarre logic. You also have to do all the work beforehand to get to the grand final.

 

[Swallow_Wood]

Yep there is usually a point where there is a cultural "click". Or they get the right mix of assistant coaches etc.

I wouldn't focus too much on how a flag list is built as it is different for every team (although obviously it's important to get list management decisions right). It more speaks to getting the culture within your playing and coaching groups right.

I guess a good analogy is a restaurant. Its a combination of the quality of the ingredients used and the chefs cooking it that determine its greatness. You can have the highest quality food but average chefs and the food will be good, but not the best it can be. Or you can have mediocre ingredients but amazing chefs and the food will be really good and look good, but won't be top shelf, award winning stuff.

But give a quality chef a really good selection of quality ingredients and its gonna be a hell of a meal.

As it stands I think we are still figuring out what the quality is like in both areas at North. There are some excellent signs that we have some of the quality ingredients in place over the medium to long term, but could do with a few more goes of access to the best shops. Its a bit harder to understand how good the chefs are because that is a bit more nuanced, but from afar they seem to have their kitchen in order at least and know what it is they want to do.

 

[TennisPlayerAndy]

Melbourne had 16 players who played 22+ games.

A superb injury run.

 

[krakouers]

Melbourne had 16 players who played 22+ games.

A superb injury run.

Meanwhile North start the season like every season 5 players out

 

[Kangaroo Cat]

Meanwhile North start the season like every season 5 players out

In a good year maybe

 

[krakouers]

In a good year maybe

Sigh, yeah

 

[Le Grille]

Still tentatively booking a caravan for a drive for next years GF worst to first baby

 

[ferball]

Tim O'Brien is like Hawthorns Mason Wood.

Almost a running joke from their supporter base how he has managed a 10+ year career to date given how strong their list has been during that period.

He's always just about to come good.....

While Clarko was coach.

If anything that makes him look a little bit better tbh.

 

[shinboner magic]

Yep there is usually a point where there is a cultural "click". Or they get the right mix of assistant coaches etc.

I wouldn't focus too much on how a flag list is built as it is different for every team (although obviously it's important to get list management decisions right). It more speaks to getting the culture within your playing and coaching groups right.

Whoever got Petracca to get fitter is why they are premiers- he was degoey like with a few good games a season.
Now he’s almost unstoppable and can’t be tackled - skills are off the charts as well.
Can Zurhaar get to that level

 

[Le Grille]

One thing I’ll say about Melbourne was they put together a great assistant coach corps, Richardson and Williams developed some of those kids magnificently

 

[Le Grille]

Whoever got Petracca to get fitter is why they are premiers- he was degoey like with a few good games a season.
Now he’s almost unstoppable and can’t be tackled - skills are off the charts as well.
Can Zurhaar get to that level

Horney Frank

 

[Ligma]

 

[Ashley B]

Melbourne had 16 players who played 22+ games.

A superb injury run.

There is some of the luck I am speaking of. But you still have to utilise it to take advantage of it, which they did.

 

[ferball]

Gee whiz, bit a mayo conveniently wiped off the shirt in that article......anyone remember how the dogs ended up with pick 6 and 7 in the Macrae year...they also took Stringer that year from memory.
GoDees have had a fair bit a help too....how'd they get Petracca and Brayshaw back 2 back in that draft?

Also, I know he is a flog but how is Stringer for Schache any sort of win? (Apart from getting rid of Stringer.)