2021 Whats going Right, Whats going wrong so far?

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Davo-27

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 9, 2006
5,493
7,279
Melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Box Hill Hawks
so we're at the early stages of 2021 and the win/loss record is 1-3 with some good efforts, but frustratingly similar results to last year, even though the change in personnel is massively different, here we can talk about the pros and cons that we can see within the team and what we think we could do better.

The Good:
The emergence of new players starting to show that they are worthy of being starting 22 players, CJ is one that has taken his Box Hill form and brought it to the AFL and has been a great inclusion, Tyler Brockman has played good footy and kicked 6 goals in 4 games and has looked like he belongs in the AFL, Mitchell Lewis is back to the 2019 form that we all got excited about, too bad he clipped Serong and got a week, but hoping we persist with Lewis as our FF for the rest of the year at least, Harry Morrison has finally arrived, he showed some promise previously, but has not stepped up to being a regular, this season he has taken a step up to potentially being a starting 22, Dylan Moore has also taken a massive step up looking like a Richmond small in recent weeks, playing for his career has given him motivation to step it up.

Tom Mitchell is getting a lot of possession once again, Wingard is dangerous when given space, JOM has stepped up his game to finally playing at a really good level, Frost is always a mixed bag, but i love his efforts and his counter attacks, Day started in great form until injured, Hardwick finding some of his old form, playing well again.

The youngsters who are knocking the door down in Ned Reeves, Connor Downie, Damon Greaves, Emerson Jeka, James Cousins, Denver Grainger-Barrass(when not injured) - Increasing our depth for the future.

The Bad:
our game plan has been the same but with players who dont fit the old game plan, our game plan relies on high pressure, high end skill and high end fitness and the players we have now are not high pressure or high end skill at all, we do have a good fitness base this year, but our switch kicking uncontested footy isnt as sharp or as effective as it used to be, teams are making us turn over too often for us to continue with this tactic imo, maybe change it up a little or improve our contested game in the middle to get clean centre clearances which most teams are now getting against us.

injuries to some of our best players - Gunston, Sicily, Day

poor form of our Rucks, especially Ceglar who has had a poor 18 months, Breust not playing as well as he can, Howe has had a good 10 minutes against Richmond and not much else with plenty of turn overs ect, Patton and all the drama surrounding him, Worpel continuing a disappointing run of games since 2020, had a good contest with Brayshaw, but his kicking has gotten worse this year.

Burgoyne, Shiels, Hartigan, Ceglar are all just going through the motions, some we need because we have no other option for the position they play, some are Clarkos favourites, either way they add very little to our game day performances, TOB has had an ok start, but last week was an example of his career as a whole and likely to join these other 4 players as going through the motions once again.

What im looking forward to:
these are the players i think are the future, based on performance and future speculation.

B: Hardwick, DGB, Day
HB: Sicily, Frost, CJ

C: Downie, T.Mitchell, Greaves
R: Reeves, JOM, Phillips

HF: Moore, Gunston, McEvoy
F: Breust, Lewis, Brockman

INT: Cousins, Worpel, Morrison, Scrimshaw

EMER: Jeka, Bramble, Koschitzke, Impey
 
Last edited:

TylerDurden

Premium Platinum
Mar 5, 2007
13,687
39,672
Lou's Tavern
AFL Club
Hawthorn
so we're at the early stages of 2021 and the win/loss record is 1-3 with some good efforts, but frustratingly similar results to last year, even though the change in personnel is massively different, here we can talk about the pros and cons that we can see within the team and what we think we could do better.

The Good:
The emergence of new players starting to show that they are worthy of being starting 22 players, CJ is one that has taken his Box Hill form and brought it to the AFL and has been a great inclusion, Tyler Brockman has played good footy and kicked 6 goals in 4 games and has looked like he belongs in the AFL, Mitchell Lewis is back to the 2019 form that we all got excited about, too bad he clipped Serong and got a week, but hoping we persist with Lewis as our FF for the rest of the year at least, Harry Morrison has finally arrived, he showed some promise previously, but has not stepped up to being a regular, this season he has taken a step up to potentially being a starting 22, Dylan Moore has also taken a massive step up looking like a Richmond small in recent weeks, playing for his career has given him motivation to step it up.

Tom Mitchell is getting a lot of possession once again, Wingard is dangerous when given space, JOM has stepped up his game to finally playing at a really good level, Frost is always a mixed bag, but i love his efforts and his counter attacks, Day started in great form until injured, Hardwick finding some of his old form, playing well again.

The youngsters who are knocking the door down in Ned Reeves, Connor Downie, Damon Greaves, Emerson Jeka, James Cousins, Denver Grainger-Barrass(when not injured) - Increasing our depth for the future.

The Bad:
our game plan has been the same but with players who dont fit the old game plan, our game plan relies on high pressure, high end skill and high end fitness and the players we have now are not high pressure or high end skill at all, we do have a good fitness base this year, but our switch kicking uncontested footy isnt as sharp or as effective as it used to be, teams are making us turn over too often for us to continue with this tactic imo, maybe change it up a little or improve our contested game in the middle to get clean centre clearances which most teams are now getting against us.

injuries to some of our best players - Gunston, Sicily, Day

poor form of our Rucks, especially Ceglar who has had a poor 18 months, Breust not playing as well as he can, Howe has had a good 10 minutes against Richmond and not much else with plenty of turn overs ect, Patton and all the drama surrounding him, Worpel continuing a disappointing run of games since 2020, had a good contest with Brayshaw, but his kicking has gotten worse this year.

What im looking forward to:
these are the players i think are the future, based on performance and future speculation.

B: Hardwick, DGB, Day
HB: Sicily, Frost, CJ

C: Downie, T.Mitchell, Greaves
R: Reeves, JOM, Phillips

HF: Moore, Gunston, McEvoy
F: Breust, Lewis, Brockman

INT: Cousins, Worpel, Morrison, Scrimshaw

EMER: Jeka, Bramble, Koschitzke, Impey
Reckon Impey has been pretty good this year.
 

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Davo-27

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 9, 2006
5,493
7,279
Melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Box Hill Hawks
Reckon Impey has been pretty good this year.
i think he has done a lot of running around getting Handball Receives and providing run only to kick it poorly too often for my liking, i think he has been a mixed bag, but thats my PoV, i understand we all like his running off half back, i just want him to hit a team mate more often when it counts.
 

HawthornHawk

All Australian
Aug 23, 2009
729
1,031
Hawthorn
AFL Club
Hawthorn
i think he has done a lot of running around getting Handball Receives and providing run only to kick it poorly too often for my liking, i think he has been a mixed bag, but thats my PoV, i understand we all like his running off half back, i just want him to hit a team mate more often when it counts.
That's fair, but his intercept work has been pretty good too imo
 

Judd2Sewell

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 31, 2008
13,642
19,707
AFL Club
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Nuggets
Game plan still hasn't changed much from the last few seasons, never mind changing to adapt to the current state of the game. We are years behind in that regard.

Playing two rucks doesn't work.

Worpel has been poor, his 2020 form has carried over into this season.

Positives:
- CJ: what a revelation. Nothing more needs to be said.

- Moore: hitting the scoreboard, putting his body on the line and is coming up with big impactful plays after periods of being out of the game. Another revelation.

- Impey: pace, skill and endeavor. He's back.

- Hardwick: playing some career best footy at the moment and has seemingly over his average form over the last two years.

- Brockman: hitting the scoreboard every game so far. Still is timid, which is understandable. He's class. It's refreshing to see youngsters get a go in what was a very boring and stale team in 2020.

- Wingard: only two games in but he has looked really trim and fit. He's all class and is being allowed to be more involved in the games.

- Morrison: after being an early believer I became a big doubter, there's no hiding from it. But he looks completely refreshed as a player. Also what hasn't been mentioned on here is he's kicked 4 goals, so is using his smarts to get into good scoring positions. Smith leaving has been a huge boon for him.
 
Last edited:

rei154

Club Legend
Jun 13, 2019
1,199
2,411
AFL Club
Hawthorn
the good:
  1. The kids- we've seen successful inclusions into our 22 already in Brockman, Day, Moore and Cj all locking in spots. As far as I'm concerned these lads stay in every game (Brockman to get a rest week at some point to have some time back in WA with family, Day when he comes back from injury). Kosi having an immense impact in the practice match was also very encouraging, I can see him coming back into the side again soon. Notes around some kids below.
    1. Moore- after being moved to the Rookie list he seems to have taken a massive step forward. Arguably our most consisten hff/small forward at this point in time
    2. Cj- playing in AA form currently. Him along with Day have been incredibly important for us structurally and generating our attack. Cj playing like he's been given free range to run and carry before thinking. Love it.
    3. Brockman- I would say at this point in time he is our most important non-injured kid in the team. Had a few fumbly games, but his talent is immense and he fits the perfect mold of a player who can be mercurial around goal but has the ability to run through the midfield as he gets confidence. Beautiful field kick, beautiful kick at goal and has had some of the smartest body positioning and attack I've seen from a Hawks kid since 2008. First year player who will only get better with time and I think he will go on to be something very special for us.
    4. Kosi- I think he has the makings of a bull up forward. Clearly wasn't super confident on the big stage but I think he'll be better for it. His athleticism is something I think we'll be using for a long time up front to generate dynamic movement
    5. Scrimshaw- Contrary to others I think Scrimshaw will grow into a midfielder. I think he offers a lot that we don't necessarily have in there- the only thing lacking is pace. Currently going well, but we need his kicking prowess when going into 50
    6. Worpel- Not had a great start to the season but the Freo game was a real positive. I'm expecting him to slowly break whatever shackles he has on him
    7. Morrison- Going exceptionally well. Had so many doubters for the last couple years as he was being played out of position. Now that he's in his more natural place on field he's looking like he's going to develop into an A-grade winger. His delivery into 50 has been almost unparalleled on our list so far.
  2. The not kids- JOM,Titch, Impey, Frost, Breust, & Hardwick have all had great moments. I think JOM's form has been incredible and is flying under the radar in the wider community because we've not been getting the chocolates each week.
  3. gameplan- when we play attacking, fast paced footy we look incredible. When we don't we look like we're competing with Norf for the spoon. Simple as that.
The bad:
  1. The gameplan- Hasn't been consistent, might rely on more gamesense than the team has currently.
  2. The ruck situation- We are currently receiving arguably the most inconsistent ruck service in the league. Neither BB nor Ceglar are the answer for us currently. BB is going ok when he's in there but looks a shadow of his past, definitely looks like he's better when moving around the ground though as his read of the play is exceptional.
  3. F50 cohesion- feels rough writing this, as arguably it isn't bad, it's just inexperienced. We have a heap of different players moving through this space currently and as such we're not really able to get consistency and build an understanding between players. This is necessary though as we look to build through this area.
  4. the midfield- we need more. Currently we're relying on our back end to generate through the middle of the ground and we need to see more from all midfielders. Pace isn't as much of an issue in my opinion, but entering clear space is something that we're desperate to have and I'm not sure we move effectively to generate this.
  5. Players- not going to single out names. Currently a lot of players playing to stay in the side and keep their careers I think
The unknown:
Here are some questions that I hope we have answered by the end of the season.
  1. what is our brand of footy?
  2. Can Jeka provide at the top level?
  3. Can Reeves show signs at the top level?
  4. Will Downie break into the side and earn his keep based on merit alone as a first year player?
  5. Will DGB be able to play as a lock down defender early or will he rely on intercepting as he builds his frame?
  6. Can Day return to the side without showing nerves around the injury?
  7. Will Clarkson throw the magnets around with who we already have?
  8. Can we sell to the competition an attacking brand that will make others think we're on the fast climb?
  9. Can we see Smitchell progressing the VFL program sufficiently in a single season?
  10. Who are the obvious cuts from the list?
  11. Who can break into our best 22 and stick in based on merit rather than lack of competition?
  12. Can we attract a FA with what we currently have on offer?


All in all I feel like we've had a nothing season so far and that's a good thing. Showing a lot of promise without getting wins is fine by me as it means we will potentially get more top end talent in at the end of the year whilst also selling to the players that what they're building is going to be successful, just in time.
 

Mercy Seat

Premiership Player
Sep 23, 2008
3,415
8,197
melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
This year is going almost exactly as I expected it would, so to be fair I'm not that disappointed.

Not worried about the game plan. I think we are trying to play a brand that can beat Richmond. With cattle that obviously aren't Richmond.

There's changes in the way we are trying to move the ball, and you can see throughout the games, we have slowly got it together, but it's not second nature and we usually start the games completely flat footed. I think as the year progresses, there will be some games where we absolutely nail it and blitz a few opponents, and likewise the opposite, where we get belted.

I'd prefer us to do this, rather than to try play to the strengths of our older players which is the alternative (Carlton anyone..?).

--------

Ruck is probably the most obvious frustration, and hopefully Reeves gets a crack at it soon. Either way, BB has to remain in the team.

Loving what the kids are bringing. Hoping by year's end we have 2-3 more who have pushed out - deservedly so - established players in the team.
 

Simon Crawshay

Club Legend
Jun 4, 2016
1,665
3,923
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Here is my 2 cents for what its worth (not much I know :p)

The Good
1. CJ - AA form of the half back and is a real point of difference with his pace and athleticism
2. JOM - Finally seeing JOM putting together multiple solid games in a row (is his knee better?)
3. Tom Mitchell - He may not be hurting the opposition as much as previously with his disposal but it is still a mighty effort to be racking up 35+ disposals a game
4. Impey - Back to his pre injury best which I had my doubts he could do to be honest
5. Hardwick - Thought he has been ordinary the last two years but probably in career best form at the moment
6. Morrison - Been a critic but can't deny he is playing his role to perfection so far in 2021.
7. The Chad - Looks super fit and is playing more as a mid / forward which to me is more his go than forward / mid.
8. Backline unit - With Day, CJ, Scrimshaw, Impey we have a stacked half back line (maybe too stacked, need to look to move some of these players up the ground in the future)
9. Overall team effort - Feel that the majority of the players are really putting in the effort.


The Bad
1. Inuries to Sicily, Gunners and Day - These have really hurt (especially losing Gunners forward craft)
2. Rucks - Big Boy and Cegs playing together should be giving us an advantage in the ruck but at the moment they are both struggling to jump which means athletic young rucks are dominating us in the throw ups.
3. Bruest - Not sure what is going on with Luke but he looks a long way of the player we know he can be.
4. Game plan - When we play fast attacking football we look really good but we still seem to be falling back to 2020 habits of slow, sideways hesitant movement for large parts of the game. I feel like we would be a hard team to play against at the moment because we bring the effort and defend well but conversly we would be one of the easiest teams to coach against because we rarely try anything different and are very predictable (not in a good way).
5. Forward line / Forward 50 entries - Our forward line is very inexperienced and our forward 50 entries still seem to consist of kicking to a pack 20m in front of goal. This strategy is really looking dated considering the explosion of leading forwards kicking bags of goals from strong leads to space.
6. Midfield mix - Our mids are so similar (mid sized / mid paced) we really need to bring in both some size (190cm plus beasts) and some genuine speed.
7. Lack of scoring - I really, really, really would love to see a game where we kick 100 points. Even if we lose. Pretty please Clarko?

In summary I feel our players are really trying their guts out but I wish we could adapt our gameplan to better suit the way AFL is played in 2021 (fast ball movement is imperative). No use getting 100+ more possessions than the opposition if all you can manage is 6 to 8 goals a game.
 

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Gday1

Senior List
Jan 22, 2015
213
296
AFL Club
Hawthorn
so we're at the early stages of 2021 and the win/loss record is 1-3 with some good efforts, but frustratingly similar results to last year, even though the change in personnel is massively different, here we can talk about the pros and cons that we can see within the team and what we think we could do better.

The Good:
The emergence of new players starting to show that they are worthy of being starting 22 players, CJ is one that has taken his Box Hill form and brought it to the AFL and has been a great inclusion, Tyler Brockman has played good footy and kicked 6 goals in 4 games and has looked like he belongs in the AFL, Mitchell Lewis is back to the 2019 form that we all got excited about, too bad he clipped Serong and got a week, but hoping we persist with Lewis as our FF for the rest of the year at least, Harry Morrison has finally arrived, he showed some promise previously, but has not stepped up to being a regular, this season he has taken a step up to potentially being a starting 22, Dylan Moore has also taken a massive step up looking like a Richmond small in recent weeks, playing for his career has given him motivation to step it up.

Tom Mitchell is getting a lot of possession once again, Wingard is dangerous when given space, JOM has stepped up his game to finally playing at a really good level, Frost is always a mixed bag, but i love his efforts and his counter attacks, Day started in great form until injured, Hardwick finding some of his old form, playing well again.

The youngsters who are knocking the door down in Ned Reeves, Connor Downie, Damon Greaves, Emerson Jeka, James Cousins, Denver Grainger-Barrass(when not injured) - Increasing our depth for the future.

The Bad:
our game plan has been the same but with players who dont fit the old game plan, our game plan relies on high pressure, high end skill and high end fitness and the players we have now are not high pressure or high end skill at all, we do have a good fitness base this year, but our switch kicking uncontested footy isnt as sharp or as effective as it used to be, teams are making us turn over too often for us to continue with this tactic imo, maybe change it up a little or improve our contested game in the middle to get clean centre clearances which most teams are now getting against us.

injuries to some of our best players - Gunston, Sicily, Day

poor form of our Rucks, especially Ceglar who has had a poor 18 months, Breust not playing as well as he can, Howe has had a good 10 minutes against Richmond and not much else with plenty of turn overs ect, Patton and all the drama surrounding him, Worpel continuing a disappointing run of games since 2020, had a good contest with Brayshaw, but his kicking has gotten worse this year.

Burgoyne, Shiels, Hartigan, Ceglar are all just going through the motions, some we need because we have no other option for the position they play, some are Clarkos favourites, either way they add very little to our game day performances, TOB has had an ok start, but last week was an example of his career as a whole and likely to join these other 4 players as going through the motions once again.

What im looking forward to:
these are the players i think are the future, based on performance and future speculation.

B: Hardwick, DGB, Day
HB: Sicily, Frost, CJ

C: Downie, T.Mitchell, Greaves
R: Reeves, JOM, Phillips

HF: Moore, Gunston, McEvoy
F: Breust, Lewis, Brockman

INT: Cousins, Worpel, Morrison, Scrimshaw

EMER: Jeka, Bramble, Koschitzke, Impey
Impey easily in our best 22
 

Cyzzametimbres

Senior List
Oct 10, 2018
191
410
AFL Club
Hawthorn
We need to start putting in 4 qtr efforts. Haven’t turned up for the first qtr each week which puts us too far behind from the get go.

Need to tighten up the simple mistakes that lead to easy goals for the opposition and us missing out on easy goals. Some of the skills have been deplorable at times.

We are getting more game time into new players so the chemistry will take time to grow, but we are getting a bit of a spanking in the ruck and midfield. Worpel worries me a bit with the game moving away from congestion and his kicking needs to be better than it is currently. Mitchell has been good and Jaeger has been better this year but would like to see him step up another level. Shiels has his moments of good and bad as well.

I reckon towards the last 8 games of the year we’ll start surprising some teams barring major injuries.
 

RoughysMullet

Premiership Player
Feb 8, 2017
3,660
5,214
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Burgoyne, Shiels, Hartigan, Ceglar are all just going through the motions, some we need because we have no other option for the position they play, some are Clarkos favourites, either way they add very little to our game day performances, TOB has had an ok start, but last week was an example of his career as a whole and likely to join these other 4 players as going through the motions once again.
Those players you highlighted Burgoyne, Shiels, Hartigan, Ceglar, TOB are all players we need to find replacements for in the 22..
The faster we do that.. the faster we’ll climb back up the ladder..
 

LMGjr

Premium Platinum
Jul 25, 2020
811
1,162
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Injuries is all that's gone wrong. Robs kids of playing time.

What's gone wright, the pivot, and the absolute methodical approach to achieving it.

Just you wait and see.
 

Brant

Premium Platinum
Sep 6, 2009
16,912
26,880
Padbury; WA
AFL Club
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the good:
  1. The kids- we've seen successful inclusions into our 22 already in Brockman, Day, Moore and Cj all locking in spots. As far as I'm concerned these lads stay in every game (Brockman to get a rest week at some point to have some time back in WA with family, Day when he comes back from injury). Kosi having an immense impact in the practice match was also very encouraging, I can see him coming back into the side again soon. Notes around some kids below.
    1. Moore- after being moved to the Rookie list he seems to have taken a massive step forward. Arguably our most consisten hff/small forward at this point in time
    2. Cj- playing in AA form currently. Him along with Day have been incredibly important for us structurally and generating our attack. Cj playing like he's been given free range to run and carry before thinking. Love it.
    3. Brockman- I would say at this point in time he is our most important non-injured kid in the team. Had a few fumbly games, but his talent is immense and he fits the perfect mold of a player who can be mercurial around goal but has the ability to run through the midfield as he gets confidence. Beautiful field kick, beautiful kick at goal and has had some of the smartest body positioning and attack I've seen from a Hawks kid since 2008. First year player who will only get better with time and I think he will go on to be something very special for us.
    4. Kosi- I think he has the makings of a bull up forward. Clearly wasn't super confident on the big stage but I think he'll be better for it. His athleticism is something I think we'll be using for a long time up front to generate dynamic movement
    5. Scrimshaw- Contrary to others I think Scrimshaw will grow into a midfielder. I think he offers a lot that we don't necessarily have in there- the only thing lacking is pace. Currently going well, but we need his kicking prowess when going into 50
    6. Worpel- Not had a great start to the season but the Freo game was a real positive. I'm expecting him to slowly break whatever shackles he has on him
    7. Morrison- Going exceptionally well. Had so many doubters for the last couple years as he was being played out of position. Now that he's in his more natural place on field he's looking like he's going to develop into an A-grade winger. His delivery into 50 has been almost unparalleled on our list so far.
  2. The not kids- JOM,Titch, Impey, Frost, Breust, & Hardwick have all had great moments. I think JOM's form has been incredible and is flying under the radar in the wider community because we've not been getting the chocolates each week.
  3. gameplan- when we play attacking, fast paced footy we look incredible. When we don't we look like we're competing with Norf for the spoon. Simple as that.
The bad:
  1. The gameplan- Hasn't been consistent, might rely on more gamesense than the team has currently.
  2. The ruck situation- We are currently receiving arguably the most inconsistent ruck service in the league. Neither BB nor Ceglar are the answer for us currently. BB is going ok when he's in there but looks a shadow of his past, definitely looks like he's better when moving around the ground though as his read of the play is exceptional.
  3. F50 cohesion- feels rough writing this, as arguably it isn't bad, it's just inexperienced. We have a heap of different players moving through this space currently and as such we're not really able to get consistency and build an understanding between players. This is necessary though as we look to build through this area.
  4. the midfield- we need more. Currently we're relying on our back end to generate through the middle of the ground and we need to see more from all midfielders. Pace isn't as much of an issue in my opinion, but entering clear space is something that we're desperate to have and I'm not sure we move effectively to generate this.
  5. Players- not going to single out names. Currently a lot of players playing to stay in the side and keep their careers I think
The unknown:
Here are some questions that I hope we have answered by the end of the season.
  1. what is our brand of footy?
  2. Can Jeka provide at the top level?
  3. Can Reeves show signs at the top level?
  4. Will Downie break into the side and earn his keep based on merit alone as a first year player?
  5. Will DGB be able to play as a lock down defender early or will he rely on intercepting as he builds his frame?
  6. Can Day return to the side without showing nerves around the injury?
  7. Will Clarkson throw the magnets around with who we already have?
  8. Can we sell to the competition an attacking brand that will make others think we're on the fast climb?
  9. Can we see Smitchell progressing the VFL program sufficiently in a single season?
  10. Who are the obvious cuts from the list?
  11. Who can break into our best 22 and stick in based on merit rather than lack of competition?
  12. Can we attract a FA with what we currently have on offer?


All in all I feel like we've had a nothing season so far and that's a good thing. Showing a lot of promise without getting wins is fine by me as it means we will potentially get more top end talent in at the end of the year whilst also selling to the players that what they're building is going to be successful, just in time.
Easily the best formatted post of the year; maybe, the last decade.
 

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