Position 2022 Fantasy Rucks

juddy_Like

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With a lot of teams I'm seeing having very similar players, the R2 is going to make or break a lot of sides early on IMO.

Do you go cheap and take a Pruess, Witts or Draper and use the cash elsewhere. Or do you take ROB, Darcy or Marshall who all do have an element of risk but are more likely to be a premo.

I've currently got ROB just to be somewhat unique but that'll probably change as I got burnt big time last year.
 

Shadow89

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With a lot of teams I'm seeing having very similar players, the R2 is going to make or break a lot of sides early on IMO.

Do you go cheap and take a Pruess, Witts or Draper and use the cash elsewhere. Or do you take ROB, Darcy or Marshall who all do have an element of risk but are more likely to be a premo.

I've currently got ROB just to be somewhat unique but that'll probably change as I got burnt big time last year.

I've gone over this a million times too, and I've finally settled on my strategy from last year for the rucks - low risk high reward.

I know I want Preuss in my team for the cash gen, and everytime I looked at Witts, Reeves or Draper, I tried to get Preuss onto my bench. Everytime I looked at Darcy, Marshall or ROB, I couldn't see a big enough difference between them and the cheaper guys, to justify the 200-400K difference.

Preuss is also priced at 43, and only needs to score at least 60 to justify his selection - which he should have no trouble with if he gets the 1st ruck gig as touted.

I've also got guns and cheap mid-pricers, so I can go down from say Hall for example, to Sicily or Day if need be, if Preuss doesn't work out and I need to get him up to one of Darcy or ROB (I like others also don't trust Marshall's foot).

As with every year, fantasy is more about the trades you make, than the starting squad - so I've designed the rest of my squad in such a way that I can trade down to the riskier guys if they work out - rather than the other way around. I've gone the inverse of this for Preuss, as he's just too good a cash cow not to have IMO, but too expensive to have on your bench (also balanced by having Grundy at R1 rather than another cheap ruck). I also had Witts since teams basically opened, but his first couple of games which are tough matchups, along with returning from an ACL, made me decide to go with the guy who was 200K cheaper and who could just as easily get injured too - but not cost me anywhere near as much if he does.

Like you say, rucks are always a huge point of difference, but I think the best thing you can do is to minimize the risk as much as possible if you're going with a riskier strategy. Will definitely be interesting to see at season's end what strategy wins out, as set and forget looks much tougher this year now that Gawn is probably going to come back to the pack, and Darcy could be 2nd in line come the end of the season.

As with all things fantasy though, nothing is certain. Gonna be an interesting season I reckon!

:)
 

WaynesWorld19

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I know I want Preuss in my team for the cash gen, and everytime I looked at Witts, Reeves or Draper, I tried to get Preuss onto my bench. Everytime I looked at Darcy, Marshall or ROB, I couldn't see a big enough difference between them and the cheaper guys, to justify the 200-400K difference.
This ! .....It's different in SC with limited trades ...Ruck set & forget is the way to go .....but the Fantasy scoring of Rucks does not mean set & forget is the only strategy

I haven't even considered set & forget .....I'll take a premium R1, but R2 I'm happy to go value ....ROB who I think will have a good season ...but he's an 86 - 95 ave player

For $723K it's just not a necessity .....I can get a rookie give me a 60+ ave ...most ruckmen are in the same boat

Grundy is a 110+ ave player .....costing $893K
ROB is 90+ ave .......................costing $723K
Witts is 86+ ave ......................costing $572K

For the cost difference, I'll take Witts for $150K less ....and I'm still only giving up 24 points on Grundy, but able to utlize the $320K price differential to surpass my lost points
 
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JDWCE

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I've gone over this a million times too, and I've finally settled on my strategy from last year for the rucks - low risk high reward.

I know I want Preuss in my team for the cash gen, and everytime I looked at Witts, Reeves or Draper, I tried to get Preuss onto my bench. Everytime I looked at Darcy, Marshall or ROB, I couldn't see a big enough difference between them and the cheaper guys, to justify the 200-400K difference.

Preuss is also priced at 43, and only needs to score at least 60 to justify his selection - which he should have no trouble with if he gets the 1st ruck gig as touted.

I've also got guns and cheap mid-pricers, so I can go down from say Hall for example, to Sicily or Day if need be, if Preuss doesn't work out and I need to get him up to one of Darcy or ROB (I like others also don't trust Marshall's foot).

As with every year, fantasy is more about the trades you make, than the starting squad - so I've designed the rest of my squad in such a way that I can trade down to the riskier guys if they work out - rather than the other way around. I've gone the inverse of this for Preuss, as he's just too good a cash cow not to have IMO, but too expensive to have on your bench (also balanced by having Grundy at R1 rather than another cheap ruck). I also had Witts since teams basically opened, but his first couple of games which are tough matchups, along with returning from an ACL, made me decide to go with the guy who was 200K cheaper and who could just as easily get injured too - but not cost me anywhere near as much if he does.

Like you say, rucks are always a huge point of difference, but I think the best thing you can do is to minimize the risk as much as possible if you're going with a riskier strategy. Will definitely be interesting to see at season's end what strategy wins out, as set and forget looks much tougher this year now that Gawn is probably going to come back to the pack, and Darcy could be 2nd in line come the end of the season.

As with all things fantasy though, nothing is certain. Gonna be an interesting season I reckon!

:)
Do you think Preuss is low risk high reward though? I would argue that he’s high risk high reward as he really hasn’t shown anything at AFL level bar a couple games for North and honestly who knows what ruck merry go round Leon will play this year. I guess he’s a pre season watch but man I honestly find it about the riskiest ruck move you could make starting with him


This ! .....It's different in SC with limited trades ...Ruck set & forget is the way to go .....but the Fantasy scoring of Rucks does not mean set & forget is the only strategy

I haven't even considered set & forget .....I'll take a premium R1, but R2 I'm happy to go value ....ROB who I think will have a good season ...but he's an 86 - 95 ave player

For $723K it's just not a necessity .....I can get a rookie give me a 60+ ave ...most ruckmen are in the same boat

Grundy is a 110+ ave player .....costing $893K
ROB is 90+ ave .......................costing $723K
Witts is 86+ ave ......................costing $572K

For the cost difference, I'll take Witts for $150K less ....and I'm still only giving up 24 points on Grundy, but able to utlize the $320K price differential to surpass my lost points
So not worried at all about Witts coming back from a knee?
 

JDWCE

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Yes ....but the word so far is no issues .....probably more worried about Chol being used & Witts being eased back into it
Yep that’s another issue. I haven’t seen Witts play with a second ruck in his GC career. Generally second rucks in the 22 don’t bode well for fantasy. Witts is a career 90+ guy essentially so represents huge value. But now that he has Chol in the side and is coming back from a knee It’s hard to know what he will hit. 80 kind of feels like a sweet spot IMO which means if someone like ROB goes 95 then is the 150k saved actually worth it?
 

WaynesWorld19

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Yep that’s another issue. I haven’t seen Witts play with a second ruck in his GC career. Generally second rucks in the 22 don’t bode well for fantasy. Witts is a career 90+ guy essentially so represents huge value. But now that he has Chol in the side and is coming back from a knee It’s hard to know what he will hit. 80 kind of feels like a sweet spot IMO which means if someone like ROB goes 95 then is the 150k saved actually worth it?
We know ROB will be sole ruck ....Think it'll be a strong PS game watch on Witts
 

davosowl

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Was also playing around with R2 options today, and I haven't got any closer to deciding.

I'd been pretty happy with Darcy there for some time, since he's got a great shot at ending up as a top 3 across the season, but it's far from a sure thing. But if I'm not going to go with Darcy, I just kept sliding down past ROB and Witts; then if you start looking at OMac, Reeves or Draper etc, I don't see why you wouldn't just go all the way down to Preuss to save $110k+ for probably the same output.

Now I just gotta work out how best to use that extra $420k if I go with Preuss over Darcy...
 

WaynesWorld19

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I don't see why you wouldn't just go all the way down to Preuss to save $110k+ for probably the same output.
Except I can't see Preuss being a regular player ......if he's dropped "you maybe" forced to find the $$$ shortfall to go to another Ruck, when it's the last thing you want ....and that Ruckmen you may not really want, but it's all you can afford

That's the real threat with Preuss
 

davosowl

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Except I can't see Preuss being a regular player ......if he's dropped "you maybe" forced to find the $$$ shortfall to go to another Ruck, when it's the last thing you want ....and that Ruckmen you may not really want, but it's all you can afford

That's the real threat with Preuss
This is true, he hasn't had the chance to cement his spot. Though Flynn and Briggs didn't really seem to have done much to gain Leon's trust in the role last year either. But would Reeves or Draper really have that much more JS than Preuss?
 

WaynesWorld19

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This is true, he hasn't had the chance to cement his spot. Though Flynn and Briggs didn't really seem to have done much to gain Leon's trust in the role last year either. But would Reeves or Draper really have that much more JS than Preuss?
17 games in total over 6 years .....who thinks he'll play more than 6-8 games, when Flynn is clearly a better Ruck
 

JDWCE

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This is true, he hasn't had the chance to cement his spot. Though Flynn and Briggs didn't really seem to have done much to gain Leon's trust in the role last year either. But would Reeves or Draper really have that much more JS than Preuss?
All of them should be their teams main rucks but they all lack a body of work showing that their up to it in fantasy. Draper has probably shown the highest scoring capabilities of the three and I would argue he’s got the best job security of all three as well. Reeves doesn’t really have anyone knocking on the door behind him but I guess McEvoy is still at the club and could always be moved into the ruck if Reeves is out of form? No clue with Preuss. GWS have shown they’re not afraid to play two rucks at once and switch the rucks around a lot. Too hard to say
 

davosowl

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All of them should be their teams main rucks but they all lack a body of work showing that their up to it in fantasy. Draper has probably shown the highest scoring capabilities of the three and I would argue he’s got the best job security of all three as well. Reeves doesn’t really have anyone knocking on the door behind him but I guess McEvoy is still at the club and could always be moved into the ruck if Reeves is out of form? No clue with Preuss. GWS have shown they’re not afraid to play two rucks at once and switch the rucks around a lot. Too hard to say
It all just makes me more inclined to stick with Darcy at this stage. Lots of variables with all the R2 options, at least he's got the best chance at being set and forget (injury permitting of course!)
 

creamPIES

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Is anyone considering running gawndy?
Obviously jackson is gonna hurt gawns output but I still think he’s a top 2 ruck. Darcy is the only one I could see outscoring him, but with how much he hobbled off the field and made me sweat last year I can’t do it
worst case scenario gawn and jackson play 50/50 ruck and gawn gets forward status round 6, which would be almost a lock for top 6 forward.
Thoughts?
 

happy_eagle

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Is anyone considering running gawndy?
Obviously jackson is gonna hurt gawns output but I still think he’s a top 2 ruck. Darcy is the only one I could see outscoring him, but with how much he hobbled off the field and made me sweat last year I can’t do it
worst case scenario gawn and jackson play 50/50 ruck and gawn gets forward status round 6, which would be almost a lock for top 6 forward.
Thoughts?
Have to consider the opportunity cost of it though.

Going with Gawn means that you are sacrificing a player of a similar price, likely from the midfield.
I would much rather select someone like Oliver/Walsh in the midfield than Gawn at R1.
 

Shadow89

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Except I can't see Preuss being a regular player ......if he's dropped "you maybe" forced to find the $$$ shortfall to go to another Ruck, when it's the last thing you want ....and that Ruckmen you may not really want, but it's all you can afford

That's the real threat with Preuss

Do you think Preuss is low risk high reward though? I would argue that he’s high risk high reward as he really hasn’t shown anything at AFL level bar a couple games for North and honestly who knows what ruck merry go round Leon will play this year. I guess he’s a pre season watch but man I honestly find it about the riskiest ruck move you could make starting with him

Re: Preuss, I've gone over the different machinations, and I don't find him that risky at all given my contingency plans. When you consider that spending big on an R2 means spending less in other areas, it also means having more questionable choices in your D4-6/M4-M8/F4-F6 positions.

For example, I can go with Darcy or ROB at R2, but I then have to go with an expensive rookie instead of Butters or Heeney. Nearly all the forward rooks are pretty much all permanent forwards, so it's essentially (for example):

Rachele (50-55) and ROB (95-100)

vs

Preuss (60-70) and Heeney/Butters (90-95)

Others ones could be Milera instead of Whitfield, Rayner instead of Dunkley, or Sinn instead of Bowes, but the end result still ends up the same - I'm bringing in questionable rookies/midpricers with so so job security and scoring potential in a different position, so I can bring in a ruck who might not even match the output of the premo I'm sacrificing.

The other point is, is that even when Flynn and Briggs played last year, Leon kept bringing Mummy back over and over again because they lost pretty much every match those two played in. That's what Preuss was brought across for, and that's the role he's been earmarked for while the other two play backup when given the chance.

I had Witts at R2 for ages, but I always went back to trying to get that cash gen with Preuss on my bench too. It also didn't help that Witts is returning from an ACL at 30+, and he's up against Nic Nat and Gawn/Jackson in his first two matches. Draper and Reeves are just as questionable, so the low risk high reward comes from spending very little instead of investing too much, and then being able to fix that up in the first few weeks if need be - by choosing the inevitable premo that doesn't come off, and dropping them to the midpricer/rookie that does if I need to get Preuss up to someone like Darcy or ROB.

Unlike last year, I've gone very guns and rooks, so I have plenty of cash to generate when I figure out who the good midpricers are after the first few weeks. Instead of having to go from say Sicily up to Hall and trying to find that cash, I can just go Hall down to Sicily if I want, and then fix the ruck using that cash - for example.

Obviously could play out differently, but that's how I've assessed it up until this point. It's low risk because it doesn't matter if it doesn't work out because I can see who the right R2 is to select and see who the right premo is to drop down/it's high reward because I'll get a ton of cash gen if it does. Win/win in my eyes :)

P.S. I also just looked at my structure, and I can see that the Preuss move is actually in line with everything else I'm doing too. Currently running with:

(Premos-Midpricers-Rookies)

4-1-1
4-1-3
1-1
4-1-1
 
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WaynesWorld19

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The other point is, is that even when Flynn and Briggs played last year, Leon kept bringing Mummy back over and over again because they lost pretty much every match those two played in. That's what Preuss was brought across for, and that's the role he's been earmarked for while the other two play backup when given the chance.
Granted this was the case mid season ......however Flynn's rate of development was so great as the season progressed that by the end Flynn was actually preferred to Mummy

Now the stats don't show that, but my eye certainly did ;) .....and Flynn's had another PS now to develop further

My view is Flynn could be another option to Witts this year .......Preuss has NEVER shown he has the stamina to be a Ruckman, having played 80% of his 17 career games (over 6 years) as a FWD ......surely the stats must scare you ?

Same things that are being said about Preuss this season, were said last season when he joined GWS ......he bombed again, and has continued to do so .......IMO he's a "hail mary" selection
 

JDWCE

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Re: Preuss, I've gone over the different machinations, and I don't find him that risky at all given my contingency plans. When you consider that spending big on an R2 means spending less in other areas, it also means having more questionable choices in your D4-6/M4-M8/F4-F6 positions.

For example, I can go with Darcy or ROB at R2, but I then have to go with an expensive rookie instead of Butters or Heeney. Nearly all the forward rooks are pretty much all permanent forwards, so it's essentially (for example):

Rachele (50-55) and ROB (95-100)

vs

Preuss (60-70) and Heeney/Butters (90-95)

Others ones could be Milera instead of Whitfield, Rayner instead of Dunkley, or Sinn instead of Bowes, but the end result still ends up the same - I'm bringing in questionable rookies/midpricers with so so job security and scoring potential in a different position, so I can bring in a ruck who might not even match the output of the premo I'm sacrificing.

The other point is, is that even when Flynn and Briggs played last year, Leon kept bringing Mummy back over and over again because they lost pretty much every match those two played in. That's what Preuss was brought across for, and that's the role he's been earmarked for while the other two play backup when given the chance.

I had Witts at R2 for ages, but I always went back to trying to get that cash gen with Preuss on my bench too. It also didn't help that Witts is returning from an ACL at 30+, and he's up against Nic Nat and Gawn/Jackson in his first two matches. Draper and Reeves are just as questionable, so the low risk high reward comes from spending very little instead of investing too much, and then being able to fix that up in the first few weeks if need be - by choosing the inevitable premo that doesn't come off, and dropping them to the midpricer/rookie that does if I need to get Preuss up to someone like Darcy or ROB.

Unlike last year, I've gone very guns and rooks, so I have plenty of cash to generate when I figure out who the good midpricers are after the first few weeks. Instead of having to go from say Sicily up to Hall and trying to find that cash, I can just go Hall down to Sicily if I want, and then fix the ruck using that cash - for example.

Obviously could play out differently, but that's how I've assessed it up until this point. It's low risk because it doesn't matter if it doesn't work out because I can see who the right R2 is to select and see who the right premo is to drop down/it's high reward because I'll get a ton of cash gen if it does. Win/win in my eyes :)

P.S. I also just looked at my structure, and I can see that the Preuss move is actually in line with everything else I'm doing too. Currently running with:

(Premos-Midpricers-Rookies)

4-1-1
4-1-3
1-1
4-1-1
These are your balls:

D4EC4090-C3BE-43BC-AF4C-4E917450871F.jpeg



These are my balls:

DC84E7F5-4B80-4D10-AF9C-09B8F8672888.jpeg
 

powerrrrrrrrrrrr

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I’m leaning towards Draper at the moment for that R2 spot and think he could post similar numbers to Darcy this year as a real breakout.

Coming into his third season holding the ruck position, 23 yrs old and finally completing a full pre season it sounds. This is very similar to Darcy this time last year.

Comparing Darcy 2020 and Draper 2021 looks very similar and they appear to be tracking along a very similar improvement path (Also allowing for Covid impact in 2020).

Darcy started last year priced around 500k after an ave of around 68 after 30 odd career games. Almost a carbon copy of Draper and following his 120 in the EF, I think he’s shown he’s got the ability to go big in matches too and can push a 75-80 minimum average.

A cheaper R2 allows me to go deep in the midfield with an extra premo (2x 800-900k / 3 x 900+) who are more likely to hit 115 most weeks than a premo R2.
 

Maurice Mitchell

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I’m leaning towards Draper at the moment for that R2 spot and think he could post similar numbers to Darcy this year as a real breakout.
That’s who I’ve had since October.

Can’t see him going under 90. If, as you said, he averages 75 - 80 then it will be a fail as far as I’m concerned but I don’t see that happening.

He’s very competitive and ready. It will be a breakout year.

Mind you, that would all change if ROB, Hickey or Nank got injured in the preseason: as solo rucks, Strachan, Ladhams (fwd) and Soldo are the best value out there I reckon.
 

11kgm

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Coaches Panel had an interesting stat only 4 rucks averaged over 30 hitouts Ryder Gawn Grundy and Nic Nat

And given that Witts scores 40 percent of points from hit outs

No one averaged more then 32 hitouts last season

I am avoiding now