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ScragCity

Brownlow Medallist
Sep 7, 2015
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I will put it this way:
Not even The Greens policies (implemented in ALL countries worldwide) are enough to prevent our Climate Crisis. As even IF all countries get to ‘Net Zero’ emissions tomorrow….. it won’t stop the planet from warming.

That's kind of like saying that there's no point living a healthy lifestyle because you'll still die eventually. Two degrees of warming this century is better than four degrees. Of course we can't stop the climate from warming. It would have warmed even if humans never existed. It's the rate and the extent of the warming that matters. The organisms and ecosystems that inhabit the Earth can evolve and adapt to new climates. But when the climate changes too quickly those things don't have a chance. Mass extinction is guaranteed but we still have a chance to limit the damage and to give our species and others a fighting chance.
 

D Mitchell

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Agree, I have immense respect for Howard‘s response to gun laws.
Respect East Timor and Indonesia, too. Our military were brilliant in East Timor.
That's kind of like saying that there's no point living a healthy lifestyle because you'll still die eventually. Two degrees of warming this century is better than four degrees. Of course we can't stop the climate from warming. It would have warmed even if humans never existed. It's the rate and the extent of the warming that matters. The organisms and ecosystems that inhabit the Earth can evolve and adapt to new climates. But when the climate changes too quickly those things don't have a chance. Mass extinction is guaranteed but we still have a chance to limit the damage and to give our species and others a fighting chance.
Fair response, Scrag but you have to go micro and look at comparative contributions. Tiny (I love that, don't you ?) Australia has no impact upon human carbon emissions, we could go back to pre 1788, forbid the indigenous from burning off and it wouldn't make the slightest difference. I'm looking forward to LittleG's "dog ate me homework" excuse or, in his case, brilliant paper.
 
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LittleG

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That's kind of like saying that there's no point living a healthy lifestyle because you'll still die eventually. Two degrees of warming this century is better than four degrees. Of course we can't stop the climate from warming. It would have warmed even if humans never existed. It's the rate and the extent of the warming that matters. The organisms and ecosystems that inhabit the Earth can evolve and adapt to new climates. But when the climate changes too quickly those things don't have a chance. Mass extinction is guaranteed but we still have a chance to limit the damage and to give our species and others a fighting chance.

What I am saying is that we aren’t tackling the actual issue. The Greens and their policies will do almost nothing.

I am not saying we are completely screwed and things aren’t fixable. BUT if our only response is to grow more trees & use less fossil fuels; then yes we are screwed.

When a tree gets old and dies/harvested, it is either burnt (back to CO2) or decomposes (back to CO2)…. How does that help us?
 

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ScragCity

Brownlow Medallist
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When a tree gets old and dies/harvested, it is either burnt (back to CO2) or decomposes (back to CO2)…. How does that help us?

Imagine if you just doubled the amount of tree mass currently on earth. Then as trees die, they regrow at a replacement rate. Now you have double the amount of carbon stored in trees, as long as you sustain that number.

I'm not saying that growing trees is the answer, just that you're missing the logic.
 
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D Mitchell

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What I am saying is that we aren’t tackling the actual issue. The Greens and their policies will do almost nothing.

I am not saying we are completely screwed and things aren’t fixable. BUT if our only response is to grow more trees & use less fossil fuels; then yes we are screwed.

When a tree gets old and dies/harvested, it is either burnt (back to CO2) or decomposes (back to CO2)…. How does that help us?
So, where do we go, LittleG ? If nowhere, why not burn coal and export to CCP China, India, vote coalition, enjoy the tax breaks and let the Great (x 100) generation descendants, technology will have solved the problem generations before anyone has pay the bill.
 
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D Mitchell

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Imagine if you just doubled the amount of trees currently on earth. Then as they die, they regrow at a replacement rate. Now you have double the amount of carbon stored in trees, as long as you sustain that number.

I'm not saying that growing trees is the answer, just that you're missing the logic.
It's the number of trees, not the amount. Let's leave the dying planet with dignity.
 

ScragCity

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I am not saying we are completely screwed and things aren’t fixable. BUT if our only response is to grow more trees & use less fossil fuels; then yes we are screwed.

Neither of those will be the answer. There won't just be one thing. It will need to be a combination of the following:

Stop burning fossil fuels - replace with renewables
End animal agriculture - replace with lab grown animal protein
Stop burning trees - plant more trees, carbon sequestering algae farms, new technology for capturing carbon and storing underground
Stop increasing the human population - change our economic structure from a growth economy to a circular economy

Whether or not any of that is actually achievable is anyone's guess. But I think a combination of all of the above is what we would need to accomplish at a minimum to survive on earth in the long term.
 

LittleG

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Imagine if you just doubled the amount of trees currently on earth. Then as they die, they regrow at a replacement rate. Now you have double the amount of carbon stored in trees, as long as you sustain that number.

I'm not saying that growing trees is the answer, just that you're missing the logic.

I love trees. Planted hundreds myself BUT planting forests isn’t going to solve our crisis. I walk in rainforests up here every weekend but due to a change in climate, they are drying out and dying. Soon, they will burn up in a bushfire and maybe be gone for decades. But this is besides the point….

My point:
Let’s call our crisis what it actually is: a Carbon Crisis. As in, we have too much carbon on the surface of the planet…. Too much carbon for us to be able to plant trees and make much difference to the warming of the planet…. As the trees just temporarily store the carbon. Each day we add so much additional Carbon to the surface, that planting trees is not going to make a difference. There are much better uses of the land (& sea) to solve the Carbon Crisis than planting forests.


It would be better to wait about 4 weeks. I am building a step by step explanation of my position and the science behind it. This will be publicly available and you can read my reasoning.
 

D Mitchell

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CCP China, Russia, USA, India and Old MacDonald's cows will be relieved, as long a few greenies on the east coast of Australia plant a few trees, they won't have to worry about their energy origins.
 

D Mitchell

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He didn't lead.... that's the problem
Cute. He lead, just not as you approve. If you are right, it's a judgment on the coalition, it was up to the party room to do something about it. The oalition has served 3 terms, this time. A break doesn't hurt as long as you don't let the temps muck it up completely. In 3 years time, you might look back and think "What was I thinking ?"
 

BrisDog

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Neither of those will be the answer. There won't just be one thing. It will need to be a combination of the following:

Stop burning fossil fuels - replace with renewables
End animal agriculture - replace with lab grown animal protein
Stop burning trees - plant more trees, carbon sequestering algae farms, new technology for capturing carbon and storing underground
Stop increasing the human population - change our economic structure from a growth economy to a circular economy

Whether or not any of that is actually achievable is anyone's guess. But I think a combination of all of the above is what we would need to accomplish at a minimum to survive on earth in the long term.
We should all just jerk-off more and stop procreating - this is the key
 

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D Mitchell

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We should all just jerk-off more and stop procreating - this is the key
Hoping you mean CCP China, India, Africa and the Middle East in your "we", BD. Sleep easy, Russia, Europe and the Anglosphere are all declining at a faster rate that your....................
 

D Mitchell

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Yes the Tampa scandal was a disgrace ,
and yes the gun issue was his responsibility to lead , but he did and was unwavering . So good on him for that !
Personally I was never a great fan either.
Why do you say the Tampa "scandal" was a disgrace ? All sides of politics are now falling over themselves to prove they could do better than Howard's government. Offshore is the norm, now. Toss in 150 exported to NZ and an excuse to get rid of Sydney Maori bikie gangs and Dusty's old man. If he was interested, he'd make a good President for the Club.
 
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jaxie1

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But , give him credit , he led the gun reforms with courage and great common sense.
Shame other‘s in other parts of the world lack the same ticker.
That is the only thing he did worthwhile though hasn’t stopped crims from getting all the guns they want and has no doubt saved lives in domestic violence situations or maybe only delayed the suffering
 

D Mitchell

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I...

It would be better to wait about 4 weeks. I am building a step by step explanation of my position and the science behind it. This will be publicly available and you can read my reasoning.
I'm patient, LittleG. Your stuff is usually pretty good, look forward to it.
 

NBates

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Cute. He lead, just not as you approve. If you are right, it's a judgment on the coalition, it was up to the party room to do something about it. The oalition has served 3 terms, this time. A break doesn't hurt as long as you don't let the temps muck it up completely. In 3 years time, you might look back and think "What was I thinking ?"

What legacy did he leave?
 

ScragCity

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CCP China, Russia, USA, India and Old MacDonald's cows will be relieved, as long a few greenies on the east coast of Australia plant a few trees, they won't have to worry about their energy origins.

Before you save the world, make sure that your own house is in order

MJ said it best:

 
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BrisDog

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Here is a interesting article re Morrison, including the following quote from a unnamed Liberal MP:

“I think it took people three years to realise what a horrible person (Morrison) he is,” a Liberal Party insider says.

 
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Mick F

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Dec 26, 2013
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Here is a interesting article re Morrison, including the following quote from a unnamed Liberal MP:

“I think it took people three years to realise what a horrible person (Morrison) he is,” a Liberal Party insider says.

They didn’t miss him.

Morrison was “the kind of clever who believes his genius can never be decoded by someone else.” If questioned: “Everything else was wrong and he was right.”

“He’s not the messiah,” another MP said. “He’s just a very naughty boy.”

He was still as vindictive as ever. “His office hated me and they consistently briefed against me during the campaign.”

“He ****ed us and his fingerprints are absolutely ****in’ everywhere on that. The bloke thinks he is a master strategist. He is a ****wit.”
 

LittleG

Norm Smith Medallist
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Here is a interesting article re Morrison, including the following quote from a unnamed Liberal MP:

“I think it took people three years to realise what a horrible person (Morrison) he is,” a Liberal Party insider says.


Morrison thought he won the last election due to himself… rather than Brown & Shorten losing it.
 

D Mitchell

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What legacy did he leave?
I can think of 3
1. Stop the Boats. Abbott gets the credit but Morrison was boots on the ground.
2. Win the unwinnable election 2019. He was good on the hustings.
3. Call for probe into the Wuhan virus.
 

D Mitchell

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Before you save the world, make sure that your own house is in order

MJ said it best:


Subject to what might be in LittleG's treatise, it's not only not up to Aus to save the world, it's well beyond our ability. Until storage is available, ask South Australia and Germany, renewables remain an impractical solution. If the Government can come up with the touted renewables exportable bonanza, great and is anyone not in favour of cleaning up the environment ? You have to be practical in your thinking and voting.
 

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