List Mgmt. 2022 GWS GIANTS List Management (Trade/ Free Agency/ Draft/ Academy)

Remove this Banner Ad

Giant Strides

Moderator
Nov 23, 2015
9,237
12,895
AFL Club
GWS
Only issue with Sheezel is the go home stuff and I have no idea what type of flight risk he is, I don't lean either way to him being more or less of a flight risk just because there's nothing glaringly obvious about him leaving and he's of course said all the right things but ultimately talk is cheap. It doesn't seem like he's obviously more of a flight risk then other vic prospects. Think he'd be my top pick out of the 3 in our range.
My view would be that most Vics, SA & WA are flight risks, whether they say it outright or not. You can get your Bailey Smiths & Archie Perkins who outright tell you not to pick them, or you get your Tanner Bruhns & Jye Caldwells who simply lie to your face. Yes, I am concerned that he might go home in 2 years, and we've wasted another pick. But I'm also afraid that Aaron Cadman may do just the same (as fellow Vic Country draftee Caleb Marchbank did) or that George Wardlaw might do the same (and he also has the hamstring issue). And on and on down the list of potential draftees. While I am concerned about it, apart from VFL House actually stepping up and doing something concrete to mitigate the issue, I can only trust the club to do as much due diligence on the risk as they can.

If we select him, I'd expect he'll play from early in season 2023, possibly from round 1. Hopefully, that would be a massive fillip that helps keep him. Having said all that, I would love Aaron Cadman to slip to #3, because we do need that tall forward to develop for the next 15 years. (Then we can worry about his go-home-itis.)
 

Giant Strides

Moderator
Nov 23, 2015
9,237
12,895
AFL Club
GWS
Exactly it, everyone's a risk but as long as the club do all the work before hand and they're satisfied with the security then we can't do much else
I get very frustrated by the lazy trope of "should have done more due diligence on their go-home-factor" thrown out by mainly Vic but more broadly heartland AFL supporters when someone like Bruhn leaves. As if our draft team walk around with their heads up their arses not thinking about that. Unfortunately, almost all players drafted by GWS are interstaters, so they all carry that risk. If we hadn't got Bruhn, we might have got player B or player C, either of whom might also have gone home. Just because player B remained with Essendon and player C with Carlton in no way says they would have stayed with GWS. Local vs interstate location.

FMD, it just shows the limited thinking of those who say that stuff.
 

Log in to remove this ad.

PMBangers

@Headless approved!
Nov 7, 2017
25,608
48,332
Melbourne
AFL Club
GWS
Other Teams
Manchester City, Collingwood AFLW
@PMBangers why has everyone gone so cold on Harry Lemmey (200cm Key forward)? I understand he didn't have a great championships but he has played 2 years of League football in the SANFL. What do you think about grabbing him with say our pick #30 if we don't take Cadman? He won't be expecting early games as he is not a first round selection and that will give him say 2 more years to spend building himself up in the VFL.
He's s**t










Nah that's harsh, just hasn't had any moment of domination this year, granted early on lack of consistency in playing games due to covid complications, even with an extended run of games in the second half of the year he's just been horribly out of form. Hasn't had the same speed on the lead, goal kicking or marking impact he did last year at all and to be honest, comes across as soft recently. Without knowing too much about what's going on behind the scenes, I have my doubts about whether he'll find that confidence/ form again in a high pressure environment, so no I wouldn't touch him at #30, I'd probably completely let him go through the ND and take our chances on him with a rookie contract.

I do believe that you don't lose ability though, so if someone picks him up and gets him confident again they'll have a gun, whether or not we can do that is another question.
 

GWS Goose

Brownlow Medallist
Nov 14, 2011
11,761
20,157
Blue Mountains
AFL Club
GWS
My issue with pushing the draft year back is you holding the kids back a year from getting on with their life.
They'll chase the dream a little bit longer.
The fact is only 22 players run out for 18 sides. Most kids don't make it, that doesn't change if you push it back a year.
The same amount of players will leave the game, just a year later with for many greater impact on their life
 

PaythePerryman

Team Captain
Oct 13, 2020
364
549
AFL Club
GWS
My issue with pushing the draft year back is you holding the kids back a year from getting on with their life.
They'll chase the dream a little bit longer.
The fact is only 22 players run out for 18 sides. Most kids don't make it, that doesn't change if you push it back a year.
The same amount of players will leave the game, just a year later with for many greater impact on their life
Yeah without a 'college' system or anywhere international to go and play it doesn't make a lot of sense.
I think the main point was the longer first contract. 3 years...is not a long first contract. Or that long to be interstate. Like going and doing an arts degree at a uni but with way more money and running.
 

Brave New World

Senior List
Oct 31, 2009
206
153
AFL Club
GWS
With all the recent postings on whether top young draft picks will stay or not; this is a relevant article on how the most successful clubs have gone about doing just that (I have bolded some interesting bits):

Report reveals surprising insights that have the AFLPA open to increasing the draft age beyond 18 years

The most relevant part of this article for GWS IMHO was the part about retaining players rather than extending the draft age. This part:

"The majority of AFL players told the report they feel their senior coach is unsupportive of them pursuing off-field interests, while AFLPA chief executive Paul Marsh said clubs who choose empowerment over control have become destination clubs.

“The workplace culture measures correlate very, very closely with what’s happening on the field,” Marsh said.

“In this particular report, and this is not a once-off, the top four clubs on the ladder are within the top six clubs on our workplace culture measures.

“We’re seeing some real clear themes here, and the key words I’d probably use are trust, care, respecting the players’ time and empowering players is what we’ve seen as the big shift in the industry.

“The clubs who are having on-field success are getting those points. Trust both ways (and) not seeking to control everything that the players do is having a big impact on players’ enjoyment, and the players are repaying that trust.

“Players have more leave now than they’ve ever had, yet they’ll come back from their leave periods ready to go.

“Players are repaying the trust and the clubs that are giving it to them are becoming clubs of choice.

“Players are gravitating towards those clubs. The work we do and players talking to each other, there is a movement towards those types of clubs.”

It’s believed the report, which covered the 2021 AFL season, read favourably for Melbourne, Port Adelaide, Geelong and Brisbane Lions.
 

Hendo_21

Club Legend
Aug 14, 2021
1,408
1,767
AFL Club
GWS
Yeah I don't think we need to push the draft age back, think the only thing I'd change is to add more years to the inital contract whether that be 3 or 4 years. Maybe some type of option system in which a team can pick up a 2 year option to add on to the exisiting 2 years of the initial contract at an obviously increased salary maybe something like that could work. This gives the team 4 years of contract control but the player also gets the increased salary after the first 2 years.
 

dlanod

Moderator
Sep 14, 2006
49,465
73,940
Sydney
AFL Club
Brisbane Lions
Other Teams
GWS; CCMariners; NQCowboys; Ravens
The majority of AFL players told the report they feel their senior coach is unsupportive of them pursuing off-field interests, while AFLPA chief executive Paul Marsh said clubs who choose empowerment over control have become destination clubs.
Interesting, the Lions have a semi-mandate for continuing education or something similar for years now (even pre-Fagan). There have been dozens of players at UQ while playing, and I know others did trade training, etc as well. I wonder if that's part of why the report was considered "favourable" for them.
 

Hendo_21

Club Legend
Aug 14, 2021
1,408
1,767
AFL Club
GWS
Hey PMBangers whats the story with Anthony Munkara, seems a consensus elite talent but some question marks off the field, what sort of issues are we looking at here. On field seems to be exactly what we need, is he someone you'd steer clear of or are you a fan?
 
Last edited:

PMBangers

@Headless approved!
Nov 7, 2017
25,608
48,332
Melbourne
AFL Club
GWS
Other Teams
Manchester City, Collingwood AFLW
Hey PMBangers whats the story with Anthony Munkara, seems a consensus elite talent but some question marks off the field, what sort of issues are we looking at here. On field seems to be exactly what we need, is he someone you'd steet clear of or are you a fan?
Can't fully go into it, but I'd steer clear personally, on field is good yes but similar to Hill he phases in and out, doesn't really impact when it's not going his sides way, and lacks a real defensive game
 

BarryAglett

Orange Army Commissar General
Sep 24, 2014
975
1,321
Western Sydney
AFL Club
GWS
Other Teams
A-Team
I think in the NFL first round rookies get 4 year deals with a fixed pay rate.
The teams get a bit of ROI if the player meets expectations.

Something worth considering.
It always feels like there's speculation if an AFL draftee hasn't extended by the end of his first 12 months.
A 4 year commitment means that players should be more honest in interviews.
 

Hendo_21

Club Legend
Aug 14, 2021
1,408
1,767
AFL Club
GWS
I think in the NFL first round rookies get 4 year deals with a fixed pay rate.
The teams get a bit of ROI if the player meets expectations.

Something worth considering.
It always feels like there's speculation if an AFL draftee hasn't extended by the end of his first 12 months.
A 4 year commitment means that players should be more honest in interviews.
4 years plus the team has the option of picking up a 5th year option which is normally pretty lucrative and if the team chooses to not pick up the 5th year then the player goes to free agency and can sign with whoever they want
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

Hendo_21

Club Legend
Aug 14, 2021
1,408
1,767
AFL Club
GWS
A good sign that Kingsley's game plan can convince a guy, who apparently wanted to stay at the Dees, to make the move.
Not gonna lie, I am a bit worried about the size of the contract we've given him. Can't imagine it's anything crazy but if he's already got a 3 year deal on the table from the Dees he's probably got some leverage to get a good deal for himself plus you're always paying a bit more to get a guy to move clubs. Still does take some level of convincing and vision salesmenship to get it over the line but there's a pretty obvious path forward for him to play pretty much every game.
 

captainMyCaptain

Norm Smith Medallist
Apr 30, 2011
7,927
6,830
Wollongong
AFL Club
GWS
Not gonna lie, I am a bit worried about the size of the contract we've given him. Can't imagine it's anything crazy but if he's already got a 3 year deal on the table from the Dees he's probably got some leverage to get a good deal for himself plus you're always paying a bit more to get a guy to move clubs.

Should find out in a few days' time but imagine a major draw in coming to us is regular role in the 22 rather than being the sub every week
 

Remove this Banner Ad