List Mgmt. 2022 List Management and trading thread

[Scorpus]

I saw this format on the West Coast board and thought it might help understand our current list position

 

[1970crow]

This is definitely not true

Dew is apparently a massive fan for what he’s doing at GC , nothing to do with money - yet

I’m a huge rankine fan and think he’s only scratching the surface just now and he’s started polling well in coaches votes

Sky is the limit

It's a contract year, they're negotiating as we speak. He was performing to a high standard prion to extending last time too.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

I don’t mind recruiting some decent sub 184cm players in the draft or trade as long as we delist some of the average ones we’ve got

Definitely need another >185cm one to partner Hately

IMO the club is simply looking for a "Franchise" player ....a matchwinner, in the vein of a Dangerfield, McLeod, Goodwin

Every club needs 1-2 .....does Rachelle or Thilthorpe fit the bill .....hopefully, this Draft is successful

 

[Jeffcrowe]

and yet he's happy to have his agent apply pressure publicly to get his contract extended 6 games into a season whilst his form is holding. No problem doing that behind closed doors, but going public shows entitlement. They know how weak the club is on these matters. Club should go public themselves and say that over 30s get only 1 year extensions again and deals wont be agreed to until the season has concluded. The good players like Sloane, Tex et al sign their final long deal to 31/32 anyway, if we lose one or 2 along the way due to the policy, no biggie.

woudn't begrudge Tex getting a good deal for himself and family , he also has a huge interest in fogartys career and probably thinks he can help players like him and rachele as much, if not more as our development coaches

also don't believe everything you read and hear from the outside

 

[Danger in Texas]

IMO the club is simply looking for a "Franchise" player ....a matchwinner, in the vein of a Dangerfield, McLeod, Goodwin

Every club needs 1-2 .....does Rachelle or Thilthorpe fit the bill .....hopefully, this Draft is successful

Yep, spot on. Think that franchise player needs to be a midfielder, and we need to find them sometime in the next two drafts (probably with our first pick)

It’s why I’m not a huge fan of trading for Dunkley (who will cost a first), he’s an immediate talent upgrade but I think we need to aim higher

 

[WaynesWorld19]

OK ....for those ripping this clubs performance apart ....let me say, your expectations are completely over the top

This list is so inexperienced, with maybe 1 x "A" grader in Tex .....19+ players who will form the basis of this future side, have so little game experience, if you subscribe to the 50 game rule, B4 (A) players feel like AFL footballers B) the club knows how much future development, there is in the player .....and I subscribe to that theory

The other consideration is a Rookie develops much quicker in a winning side, than a side in complete rebuild ....where connection is difficult, because there's not enough games played with the players around you ....as every player is developing their game simultaneously, so there's no established player behaviours

So don't lambast 10 & 20 game players .....or 40+ game KPP ....it just shows your ignorance of the game

 

[WaynesWorld19]

It’s why I’m not a huge fan of trading for Dunkley (who will cost a first), he’s an immediate talent upgrade but I think we need to aim higher

Spot on !!! .....as good a player Dunkley is ...he's not the class, or possessing the finishing skills we're chasing

Clubs make the huge mistake, of chasing good players, simply because they're available .....not because of team need / balance

Did WBD need Treloar .....did ESS need Shiel ? ......answer is an obvious no

 

[FullyBigKPro]

The problem is the typical arrogance of the AFC trying to reinvent the wheel with drafting and picking hybrid mid/fwd midget types in the 20's/30s etc

You look at most, if not all top 8 teams, and they have a minimum of 2 x top 10 pick pure mids.

Freo (Brayshaw/Serong)
Carlton (Cripps/Walsh)
Melb (Oliver/Trac)
Dogs(Bont/Treloar/Macrae etc)
Sydney (Parker/ Academy kids)
Richmond (Dusty/Cotchin)
Geelong (Danger/Selwood)

Brisbane maybe the exception with Neale/Lyon but they have Rayner coming through in midfield and McCluggage was a top 5 pick

Lets get fair dinkum and start drafting our midfield stars in the top 10 PLEASE.

 

[Truck25]

OK ....for those ripping this clubs performance apart ....let me say, your expectations are completely over the top

This list is so inexperienced, with maybe 1 x "A" grader in Tex .....19+ players who will form the basis of this future side, have so little game experience, if you subscribe to the 50 game rule, B4 (A) players feel like AFL footballers B) the club knows how much future development, there is in the player .....and I subscribe to that theory

The other consideration is a Rookie develops much quicker in a winning side, than a side in complete rebuild ....where connection is difficult, because there's not enough games played with the players around you ....as every player is developing their game simultaneously, so there's no established player behaviours

So don't lambast 10 & 20 game players .....or 40+ game KPP ....it just shows your ignorance of the game

View attachment 1432123

Spot on, All the negative is way over the top, some are writing players off before they have even played 10 games. Recognise where we are at, but know it is going to take a couple of years to get this groups full measure. There is no magic bullet.
I can also remember 5-6 years ago calls for the club to bottom out to get top picks, well guess what! this is what it looks like.

 

[Crow till I die]

IMO the club is simply looking for a "Franchise" player ....a matchwinner, in the vein of a Dangerfield, McLeod, Goodwin

Every club needs 1-2 .....does Rachelle or Thilthorpe fit the bill .....hopefully, this Draft is successful

Aye..agree with you here. If JHF is not a real option, then our 1st to go on the best mid we can get in the draft. It would be great to try and upgrade our 2nd into the back end of the 1st to grab a keeler of phillipou if possible before a michalanney bid. Keep going to the well and it will turn

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Aye..agree with you here. If JHF is not a real option, then our 1st to go on the best mid we can get in the draft. It would be great to try and upgrade our 2nd into the back end of the 1st to grab a keeler of phillipou if possible before a michalanney bid. Keep going to the well and it will turn

It's also why you must go all-in for JHF .....so hard to find a "Franchise" player at your Draft Pick

 

[Danger_zone]

“Get out”: Gibbs urges Crows midfielder to seek trade

“He’s only 27… he’s still got a lot of good footy in him.”

www.sen.com.au

 

[Crow till I die]

“Get out”: Gibbs urges Crows midfielder to seek trade

“He’s only 27… he’s still got a lot of good footy in him.”

www.sen.com.au

Wise words..can he pull some strings at carlton..crouch and sholl for their 1st

 

[Rory Walkerfield]

OK ....for those ripping this clubs performance apart ....let me say, your expectations are completely over the top

This list is so inexperienced, with maybe 1 x "A" grader in Tex .....19+ players who will form the basis of this future side, have so little game experience, if you subscribe to the 50 game rule, B4 (A) players feel like AFL footballers B) the club knows how much future development, there is in the player .....and I subscribe to that theory

The other consideration is a Rookie develops much quicker in a winning side, than a side in complete rebuild ....where connection is difficult, because there's not enough games played with the players around you ....as every player is developing their game simultaneously, so there's no established player behaviours

So don't lambast 10 & 20 game players .....or 40+ game KPP ....it just shows your ignorance of the game

View attachment 1432123

It’s funny, most of the complaints I hear on this forum are more aimed at lambasting the coaches for yo-yo’ing those guys you highlight in and out of the side whilst guys like Brown, Crouch and Mackay were auto selections. There should have been a youth first policy for years, not having guys who add zero to the development of others.

 

[1970crow]

woudn't begrudge Tex getting a good deal for himself and family , he also has a huge interest in fogartys career and probably thinks he can help players like him and rachele as much, if not more as our development coaches

also don't believe everything you read and hear from the outside

Tex himself said it was frustrating that he hadn’t been offered a new contract. Am I allowed to believe that? I know what you want to believe is going on behind closed doors, but I prefer to use the information that actually comes out.

And I don’t begrudge Tex getting what he deserves, I do begrudge a so called ‘heart and soul’ player using public pressure to try and force LM into doing something that they don’t yet want to do. You obviously think it’s ok and suggests a good senior player culture, but I think the opposite.

 

[1970crow]

OK ....for those ripping this clubs performance apart ....let me say, your expectations are completely over the top

This list is so inexperienced, with maybe 1 x "A" grader in Tex .....19+ players who will form the basis of this future side, have so little game experience, if you subscribe to the 50 game rule, B4 (A) players feel like AFL footballers B) the club knows how much future development, there is in the player .....and I subscribe to that theory

The other consideration is a Rookie develops much quicker in a winning side, than a side in complete rebuild ....where connection is difficult, because there's not enough games played with the players around you ....as every player is developing their game simultaneously, so there's no established player behaviours

So don't lambast 10 & 20 game players .....or 40+ game KPP ....it just shows your ignorance of the game

View attachment 1432123

My complaint isn’t that we’re not performing well enough, in fact, I’ve been saying all year that I reckon we’ve been going pretty well in large parts of the game. My complaint has been that sticking with the 4 man midfield strategy and the 3 key mids sentences this rebuild to abject failure. If we think the midfield we’ve wedded ourselves to is going to drive our charge back into contention, then we’ve got the wrong people driving the bus.

Dropping Crouch is a start. Next is rotating Laird and Keays through other roles and deepening our rotation and developing the kids via limited minutes. If they don’t do this, let’s hope the next coaching group that is tasked with our rebuild is prepared to.

 

[whattagun07]

Tex himself said it was frustrating that he hadn’t been offered a new contract. Am I allowed to believe that? I know what you want to believe is going on behind closed doors, but I prefer to use the information that actually comes out.

And I don’t begrudge Tex getting what he deserves, I do begrudge ask called ‘heart and soul’ player using public pressure to try and force LM into doing something that they don’t yet want to do. You obviously think it’s ok and suggests a good senior player culture and I think the opposite.

Kind of agree with you. Smells a bit like the D Talia situation

 

[WaynesWorld19]

My complaint has been that sticking with the 4 man midfield strategy and the 3 key mids sentences this rebuild to abject failure. If we think the midfield we’ve wedded ourselves to is going to drive our charge back into contention, then we’ve got the wrong people driving the bus.

I don't disagree with this ....Crouch out a good step ....I was also against Sloane being in the midfield this year, again most pundits realised his midfield days were over

Having Crouch & Sloane in the midfield, was counter-productive to our development

That said, Schoenberg took a step backwards .....and I expected Milera to come back in better form & go thru the midfield, adding that class we're clearly missing

 

[1970crow]

I don't disagree with this ....Crouch out a good step ....I was also against Sloane being in the midfield this year, again most pundits realised his midfield days were over

Having Crouch & Sloane in the midfield, was counter-productive to our development

That said, Schoenberg took a step backwards .....and I expected Milera to come back in better form & go thru the midfield, adding that class we're clearly missing

Schoey is still developing though, he should never have been dropped. Our coaches are not prepared to ride out the peaks and troughs of developing players but embrace the consistency of a long running trough from senior players. It’s been like this for years.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Schoey is still developing though, he should never have been dropped. Our coaches are not prepared to ride out the peaks and troughs of developing players but embrace the consistency of a long running trough from senior players. It’s been like this for years.

It's a no win situation for Coach's .....keep Schoenberg in, and they cop the bullets for the mediocrity and flow-on affects across the team

Does Schoenberg learn, by persevered with
Does Schoenberg learn more by being dropped
Team selection integrity maintained by dropping Schoenberg

The last point is singularly so important in any footy club .....all players know, if selections are unwarranted & resent it

 

[Danger in Texas]

It's a no win situation for Coach's .....keep Schoenberg in, and they cop the bullets for the mediocrity and flow-on affects across the team

Does Schoenberg learn, by persevered with
Does Schoenberg learn more by being dropped
Team selection integrity maintained by dropping Schoenberg

The last point is singularly so important in any footy club .....all players know, if selections are unwarranted & resent it

Particularly as his issues (kicking and chasing) weren’t ‘young player that needs games into them’ issues. They were genuine issues that needed to be ironed out by teaching him an extended lesson

Hopefully they’re ironed out now

 

[Rory Walkerfield]

It's a no win situation for Coach's .....keep Schoenberg in, and they cop the bullets for the mediocrity and flow-on affects across the team

Does Schoenberg learn, by persevered with
Does Schoenberg learn more by being dropped
Team selection integrity maintained by dropping Schoenberg

The last point is singularly so important in any footy club .....all players know, if selections are unwarranted & resent it

What a crock of s**t.

Team selection integrity. There has been none at the AFC for years. Basically senior players are inked into preferred positions regardless of persistent average form with kids yo-yo’d in and out of the team playing in their non-preferred position.

There has been a massive entitlement culture at AFC for years.

Team selection integrity my arse.

 

[1970crow]

It's a no win situation for Coach's .....keep Schoenberg in, and they cop the bullets for the mediocrity and flow-on affects across the team

Does Schoenberg learn, by persevered with
Does Schoenberg learn more by being dropped
Team selection integrity maintained by dropping Schoenberg

The last point is singularly so important in any footy club .....all players know, if selections are unwarranted & resent it

Why do those only apply to the kids though? Remember ‘non-statistical roles’ and ‘we need their experience out there’? Why didn’t we drop Sloane or Brown and why did it take so long to drop ROB? And why hasn’t he been dropped again after reverting to droppable form the last 2 weeks? Why is it just kids that get the selection axe so quickly after losing some form?

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Why do those only apply to the kids though? Remember ‘non-statistical roles’ and ‘we need their experience out there’? Why didn’t we drop Sloane or Brown and why did it take so long to drop ROB? And why hasn’t he been dropped again after reverting to droppable form the last 2 weeks? Why is it just kids that get the selection axe so quickly after losing some form?

Obviously seniority carries extra brownie points ....and of course, the need to surround the kids with senior players

But all up, Tex excluded, most of our senior players have been worse than the kids this year .....can't drop your Capt, but would have no qualms dropping the others .....including Brodie Smith

 

[Gtowncrow]

On the post playing Tex Walker...
-Do you think he has a role at the club?
-Doing what?
-When?
-Why do you think that?

 

[Gtowncrow]

Obviously seniority carries extra brownie points ....and of course, the need to surround the kids with senior players

But all up, Tex excluded, most of our senior players have been worse than the kids this year .....can't drop your Capt, but would have no qualms dropping the others .....including Brodie Smith

It's a negative thought but with a positive outcome. Some deliberate (well done list management) and some good fortune.

The injuries to Sloane and Seedsman on top of our 2021 transfers out/retirements has provided our youngsters with a years experience we were all crying out for this time last year.

Irrespective of contract status, Brown, Crouch and Smith are all close to Kelly and dDmac territory.