List Mgmt. 2022 Trade & List Management Thread

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Shinboner1

Premiership Player
Aug 13, 2020
4,829
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North Melbourne
This $1m+ argument that keeps on being brought up is a bit of a strawman.

Is anyone actually proposing $1m+ offers? By contrast, $700k would be comparable to what Ziebell is on... and would still not be anywhere near what Darcy Moore is currently getting paid.

Hall is 31. Ziebell will be 31 when the next season starts.

I'm open minded to the possibility that Perez et al will impress this year but time is running out to bring the defence up to speed with where the rest of our ground is at. The equilibrium between where our defensive talent is tracking is out of whack with the great progress elsewhere on the ground.

So a serious investment in one proven elite KPD and one proven elite rebounding defender in the prime of their careers shouldn't be dismissed out of hand just because we all want our kids to have every opportunity to succeed.
clubs setting themselves up to have ready made replacements when hall and ziebel retire in 2-3 years.
 

the Ziebull

Brownlow Medallist
Nov 14, 2010
26,798
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Well I for one wouldn't wince at the prospect of offering Jayden Short $700k average per season for four years to bolster our ageing half-back line.
100% especially since polec got 750

happily give Short or Maynard 700k a year
 

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Shinboner1

Premiership Player
Aug 13, 2020
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how long were shorts and maynards previous contracts?
Short start playing well what 3 years ago?
Just as he finished his rookie contract and onto the first full one he's had.
Sure Richmond has had a bargain but its not like he was a gun and then got paid peanuts.
 

the Ziebull

Brownlow Medallist
Nov 14, 2010
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Do richmond have cap space to offer that to Short now? Lynch has a backended contract which makes their cap tight

likewise if pies have to fork out say 900k for Moore can they give Maynard 700k
 

Shinboner1

Premiership Player
Aug 13, 2020
4,829
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Short and Stewart just prove how good mature agers are.
Reckon we invest in 1-2 over the next couple of years.
There's some state league guns that would improve the side immensely.
 

Shinboner1

Premiership Player
Aug 13, 2020
4,829
8,787
AFL Club
North Melbourne
Do richmond have cap space to offer that to Short now? Lynch has a backended contract which makes their cap tight

likewise if pies have to fork out say 900k for Moore can they give Maynard 700k
whos offering darcy moore 900k?
 

Makeshift Park

Senior List
Aug 6, 2021
293
567
AFL Club
North Melbourne
Do richmond have cap space to offer that to Short now? Lynch has a backended contract which makes their cap tight

likewise if pies have to fork out say 900k for Moore can they give Maynard 700k
Don't forget Grundy is on basically a million a year until 2027 and then there's DeGoey on $750k.
Something's going to have to give at Collingwood eventually.
Maybe they'll pay us to take one of Moore or Maynard off their books!
 

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Makeshift Park

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Here is a theory for you guys,
Collingwood reluctantly give De Gonads the flick sighting his off field behaviour and solve their salary cap issues.
Yes, I would have thought last month was the perfect opportunity to do that. But, should Collingwood find themselves in an hour of need, I'd like to think it wouldn't be below us to offer a charitable hand in offloading one of their finest defenders for a reasonable price.
 
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Heaps of fun

Goatered on the sticks
Sep 13, 2013
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If Hall and Ziebell retire this year then McDonald and pick 22 Goater will be our 2023 halfbacks. Powell and Stephenson wings.
 

Makeshift Park

Senior List
Aug 6, 2021
293
567
AFL Club
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I mean, we just recruited 3 x medium defenders in Goater, Bergman and Archer.

Then there's McDonald, Perez, Bonar, P.Walker, Hayden, Young and Atu.

When you add Hall and Ziebell, thats about 30% of our list who are medium defenders next year.

At some point you have to back the investment.

I will flip if we go after a half back on serious coin $$$.

I've only been on this site for a little while now, but since I joined I've found quite a lot of your posts pretty incisive Sphynx. This case you're making here stuck in my head a bit as I was cooking dinner.

Maybe I was wrong? I wouldn't make the starting 22 of the most knowledgeable Shinboners on this forum, and I'm willing to correct myself when people demonstrate I've been talking bullshit. But hear me out.

Here's what I feel I do know:

By 2024, we should be seriously competitive. Like top 4 competitive. Three years from now (and pending any undesirable trade-outs) there'll be a decent portion of our players who will be in their absolute prime: Zurhaar, Larkey, Simpkin, Sleevo, CCJ, LDU and McKay will all be 25-26.* We all think Ben is incredible, but we need to remember that he's the ONLY defender of those seven.

I suspect that by 2024, Ziebell, Hall, Cunnington, Polec, Greenwood, Goldstein, and Josh Walker will all be retired. (When it comes to list management, I think it pays to be pessimistic about retirement ages, and I'll be pleasantly surprised if even one or two of them are still competing for us by then) ie I suspect three of our six or seven current best defenders will be gone by the time we're truly competitive.

McDonald is a club champion, but I'd prefer to watch him spend his last five or so years with us more on the wing than in defense (where he's seems to be filling in gaps because we couldn't hire age-appropriate competent defenders because we needed to focus on our midfield core). So I'm excluding him from my core defensive squad for the perspective of a 2024 forecast.

From the archive I've watched, Goater I agree will be a likely entry in our senior defensive structure in the not-too-distant future. But Archer appears to require more development and he'll still only be 21 in 2024. He could be our fulltime back pocket by then - but this seems like a massive gamble when we have the benefit of our best-in-the-AFL salary cap position to building some serious depth?

I'm not Victorian so I haven't seen enough of Bergman to consider him to be a bona fide defensive unit. Perhaps someone can correct me here?

Perez and Hayden are on one year contracts until the end of 2022. They could turn into key personnel for our seniors team, and lord I hope they do. But their contract status doesn't exactly suggest the club management are willing to make a serious investment in them yet, and so I'm not sure why we would assume they'll still be here in 3 years. Likewise for Lachie Young - is anyone here convinced he's going to be here in 2024? What's Atu's contract status?

So if we take the rose-tinted glasses off for a second, in all likelihood our backline in 2024 consists of McKay, Corr, Turner, Goater and then... a whole bunch of guys we like who are either too young or currently lack the confidence of management to be on serious contracts... who may or may not be around when our Cohort of Key Era-Defining Players are ready to compete late into the finals. Harsh but true.

Seems to me that if we want to be top 4 in 2024, opening our minds to paying 650-700k for someone of Short's caliber in 2022 makes a whole lot of sense. Especially if we do the same the following year, and bring home someone like Luke Ryan as a KPD (who's contract will have just expired) for about the same. That provides real and necessary defensive depth to our team. And I suspect that by 2024, the likes of Simpkin will be on a comparable wage.

I really could see that as a plausible premiership team.

*I suspect TT and JHF will have well and truly hit elite status by 2024 too, but humour me on the age demographic argument.
 
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shinboner magic

Brownlow Medallist
Apr 17, 2007
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If we’ve got a gun midfield in 2-3 years , it’ll count for nought if our backline has more holes than Swiss cheese.
Offering a deal to get someone in won’t cost us a player - with our salary cap we’d be front loading contracts big time.
 

Shagga is all Class

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If we want to predict this, I'd be thinking a little bit out of the box on this one.

Did anyone expect CCJ to be brought in as our KPF/R 12 months ago?

I'd be looking at any u24 KPP at other clubs that can play at either end, who hasn't established themselves as best 22.

Well, I would also not have predicted we would pick up Greenwood and was shocked when Aliir Allir left Sydney to go to Port last year.

If we were in contention right now, Tarrant would have signed his 2 year deal and Walker would be our 4th KPD. We only picked up Walker as Durdin, EVW and the like did not come on.

So yeah, if we were in contention I am sure the club would be looking at all options to fill any immediate deficiencies we might have and we would be a destination club.

Does anyone even remember who the Dogs KPD were when they won a flag? All I remember is one bloke took his medal and left.

Build the midfield and they will come once there is proof.
 

Shermanator

2 + 9 + 12 + 24 + 26 + 29 + 40 + JHF = The future
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With COVID playing havoc in the development leagues around the country over the past 48 months, it wouldn’t surprise me if a 20/21 year old CHB bolted in the State leagues in 2022 that might be a mid-season draft option.

There was over 800 nominated players that got overlooked last week, surely there’s a dour 198cm bloke with enough athletic traits to keep up on a lead, put a fist through the footy when needed and take the occasional intercept grab floating across the pack in the country somewhere?..
 

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