List Mgmt. 2023 List Management thread

[Snuffaluphagus]

Mod notice after Mr Bob did a lot of annoying work in moving days of posts out of here. As we are heading into offseason, this thread is for 2023 list management only. Getting upset on previous trades can be taken to the vent thread. Lets keep this thread on track in the part of the year it's actually relevant

 

[Redgum]

I started watching gettable and they were looking at Collingwood and Brisbane and how they got to their teams. They were saying that both obviously got players through the draft to built up their team but made the point that you cannot rely on that alone to get to the big dance and win the premiership these days. You have to bring in quality established players to make it complete. Looking below you can see what the lions have got, no wonder we have no show to attract the calibre of those sorts of players, we make be lucky to get one maybe two at the most.

 

[Purple Suit]

I started watching gettable and they were looking at Collingwood and Brisbane and how they got to their teams. They were saying that both obviously got players through the draft to built up their team but made the point that you cannot rely on that alone to get to the big dance and win the premiership these days. You have to bring in quality established players to make it complete. Looking below you can see what the lions have got, no wonder we have no show to attract the calibre of those sorts of players, we make be lucky to get one maybe two at the most.

View attachment 1815431

We’ve got currently.

Jackson
Clark
O’Mera
Aish

It’s a start.

 

[Cobbler]

I'd be fine with getting Ruscoe if he's essentially a free hit, I don't see any downside to taking him on as depth if we pay * all for him.

The downside is in the potential of someone better with the spot Ruscoe would take. There would be literally 100+ guys we would rather take on as a ‘free hit.’

To use a stupid analogy… because that’s what I do.

Would you rather $2 cash or a $2 scratchie? Sure, history will tell you you’re unlikely to hit with your $2 scratchie BUT I’d be amazed if any sane person would take the known $2 over a gamble.

There’s free hits and then there’s free hits.

 

[Paracleet]

Zorko is not really a trade. He was a zone selection that was on traded like the Gu. It's really no different from picking someone with an on traded pick in the draft. Put another way pretty sure no AFL club has ever held Daynes registration other than Brisbane. He would have just been pre-listed by GC.

 

[Joao]

I started watching gettable and they were looking at Collingwood and Brisbane and how they got to their teams. They were saying that both obviously got players through the draft to built up their team but made the point that you cannot rely on that alone to get to the big dance and win the premiership these days. You have to bring in quality established players to make it complete. Looking below you can see what the lions have got, no wonder we have no show to attract the calibre of those sorts of players, we make be lucky to get one maybe two at the most.

View attachment 1815431

The argument that you must trade in players to be successful is just a hypothesis because the alternative has literally never been tested. Not one club has tried getting 100% (or even 95%) of their players from the draft. Until several clubs try and fail we don't know whether trading is essential.

I still posit that minimal trading is the optimum strategy over the long term and hope that we do it next time we bottom out.

 

[MadMundy]

The downside is in the potential of someone better with the spot Ruscoe would take. There would be literally 100+ guys we would rather take on as a ‘free hit.’

To use a stupid analogy… because that’s what I do.

Would you rather $2 cash or a $2 scratchie? Sure, history will tell you you’re unlikely to hit with your $2 scratchie BUT I’d be amazed if any sane person would take the known $2 over a gamble.

There’s free hits and then there’s free hits.

Fair enough, I'm just looking at the free agents and targets for this off-season, I'm not seeing anybody else that would really be worth the free hit.

 

[Ge3ks]

I'm not seeing anybody else that would really be worth the free hit.

But Cobbler just said there are literally over 100 others, and he talked about $2 scratchies. So... case closed.

 

[CaseySibosadoHOF]

The downside is in the potential of someone better with the spot Ruscoe would take. There would be literally 100+ guys we would rather take on as a ‘free hit.’

To use a stupid analogy… because that’s what I do.

Would you rather $2 cash or a $2 scratchie? Sure, history will tell you you’re unlikely to hit with your $2 scratchie BUT I’d be amazed if any sane person would take the known $2 over a gamble.

There’s free hits and then there’s free hits.

I'm relatively pro-Ruscoe (in the sense that I think he's better than Ethan Hughes and fills a list need: a dearth of mediums who can play 3rd tall and can both defend and move the ball), but what you've articulated is probably the strongest argument against doing that. He possesses no elite attributes and no especially glaring weaknesses, making him an ideal role player but someone who can never be a real difference maker.

By contrast, if they go to the draft with that sort of list need in mind, they could probably find someone with more glaring weaknesses (coz they're rookies) but more elite attributes. Arie Schoenmaker as an example has an absolute superboot and, if he makes it, could facilitate real slingshot footy off half back (not the best example tho because as a Tasmanian we probably risk losing him to that new team just as he starts getting good).

 

[Vimal Anand]

We’ve got currently.

Jackson
Clark
O’Mera
Aish

It’s a start.

Jackson better than any one in Brisbane's above list purely on potential and impact?

On SM-A205YN using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Vimal Anand]

The argument that you must trade in players to be successful is just a hypothesis because the alternative has literally never been tested. Not one club has tried getting 100% (or even 95%) of their players from the draft. Until several clubs try and fail we don't know whether trading is essential.

I still posit that minimal trading is the optimum strategy over the long term and hope that we do it next time we bottom out.

May be no one tried 100 % drafting as it will narrow the window? The longer the window higher the chance of flag?

On SM-A205YN using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

Jackson better than any one in Brisbane's above list purely on potential and impact?

On SM-A205YN using BigFooty.com mobile app

I love Jackson but Neale is a two time brownlow medallist ()and Daniher, Dunkley and Cameron go alright. Its a crazy group of imports and I have no idea how they manage to bring in a new big name every couple of years

 

[DragoDelph]

I love Jackson but Neale is a two time brownlow medallist ()and Daniher, Dunkley and Cameron go alright. Its a crazy group of imports and I have no idea how they manage to bring in a new big name every couple of years

Nope. Me neither

 

[Purple Suit]

I love Jackson but Neale is a two time brownlow medallist ()and Daniher, Dunkley and Cameron go alright. Its a crazy group of imports and I have no idea how they manage to bring in a new big name every couple of years

It’s because they have been top of the table for an extended time. It’ll happen to us too when we hit our prime. WC being crap will also mean the Jackson’s only have 1 choice if coming back to WA.

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

It’s because they have been top of the table for an extended time. It’ll happen to us too when we hit our prime. WC being crap will also mean the Jackson’s only have 1 choice if coming back to WA.

Doubt it, we dont have the promise of playing AFL while being anonymous and also still close to Vic

 

[greatgatsby]

Doubt it, we dont have the promise of playing AFL while being anonymous and also still close to Vic

This is the challenge. GWS and Brisbane can attract the types who want football success but don't want to be celebrities. It's why we had to forego Hogan ... Henry apparently wants to be a (bigger) celebrity but not necessarily a successful footballer.

 

[Purple Suit]

Doubt it, we dont have the promise of playing AFL while being anonymous and also still close to Vic

No one goes to the Gold Coast for that reason. It’s 90% success, it’s what drives the best players.

Once the worm starts turning, the trades start happening at a more regular occurrence. Jackson is a sign that things have improved already.

 

[Joao]

May be no one tried 100 % drafting as it will narrow the window? The longer the window higher the chance of flag?

On SM-A205YN using BigFooty.com mobile app

It would be the opposite, because your list would always be diverse in age with players from 18 to retirement in every season.

The biggest issue would be finding key players with later picks if you are perennially successful. I think you'd still have down years where your bottom 5 even if only because of injury or the retirement of key players.

 

[s_wd6]

Anyone listen to Garlick on 6pr? Anything re Darcy?

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

No one goes to the Gold Coast for that reason. It’s 90% success, it’s what drives the best players.

Once the worm starts turning, the trades start happening at a more regular occurrence. Jackson is a sign that things have improved already.

No one goes to the Gold Coast, they go to Brisbane though. I would guarantee we never ever bring in a Vic player like Dunkley or Daniher

 

[s_wd6]

No one goes to the Gold Coast, they go to Brisbane though. I would guarantee we never ever bring in a Vic player like Dunkley or Daniher

There's literally no appeal to Perth. Isolated from the rest of the country, massive footy state where you will likely get recognised at least once every time you go out. Compared to Brisbane with their seamingly endless war chest and promises of anonymity, with the added bonus of being a lot closer to the rest of the country.

Corbett, Brodie, and Aish the only vic guys we've recuruited, and they all came here as sort of a last resort.

 

[The Feeder Club]

It’s because they have been top of the table for an extended time. It’ll happen to us too when we hit our prime. WC being crap will also mean the Jackson’s only have 1 choice if coming back to WA.

Yeah they came flocking to us in 2012-14 when we were a realistic premiership contender. Scott Gumbleton and, um, who?

 

[The Feeder Club]

If we can improve our trading and get a new coach that can actually convince the players to execute the ideas he or she has, we might actually take advantage of having one of the best (if not the best) drafting teams in the comp

 

[BringBackTheAnchor]

Yeah they came flocking to us in 2012-14 when we were a realistic premiership contender. Scott Gumbleton and, um, who?

Danyle Pearce and Colin Sylvia!

 

[Purple Suit]

No one goes to the Gold Coast, they go to Brisbane though. I would guarantee we never ever bring in a Vic player like Dunkley or Daniher

Maybe, Dunks is a gun. Daniher was broken at the time.

Jackson as good as Dunks but we had to pay full price due to WC.

If we can improve our trading and get a new coach that can actually convince the players to execute the ideas he or she has, we might actually take advantage of having one of the best (if not the best) drafting teams in the comp

Free agency had just started and no trading future picks, we dropped before we could capitalise. The landscape has now changed.

 

[greatgatsby]

There's literally no appeal to Perth. Isolated from the rest of the country, massive footy state where you will likely get recognised at least once every time you go out. Compared to Brisbane with their seamingly endless war chest and promises of anonymity, with the added bonus of being a lot closer to the rest of the country.

Corbett, Brodie, and Aish the only vic guys we've recuruited, and they all came here as sort of a last resort.

Agree with your point, although Aish‘s a South Australian and a straight out trooper.