Autopsy 2025 AFL Round 6: A Dog day afternoon

[AirWinmar]

Questions have to be asked why is there such a huge gap between our wins and losses?

We've had 3 x good wins 2 against quality opposition and the other a stat builder. The 3 x losses have all been floggings. We only lost to GWS by 28 points but generally they dominated the game and we were bullied all over the ground.

It seems when we dont show up with 110% effort we open ourselves up for disastrous results. Its mostly the result of our injury list and inexperienced team, but that doesnt excuse the senior leaders in the team. Lyon and his team of coaches have some serious work to do to close the gap between the wins and floggings.

In our losses the opposition have picked apart our game plan which resulted in a group of players running around like headless chooks. As a result the effort significantly dropped off as the collective didnt know how to hold up the dam wall. Some of it is the result of unavailable of players but for me playing obviously injured players eg Marshall & Steele has occurred far too often under Lyon. It has to affect the psyche of the team when your captain is going at 70% and cant influence contests like he normally has. Marshall has looked a shell of himself the past few weeks he has been flogged by ruckman he normally plays well against.

Injuries and injury management remain our achillies heal....?

I don't really think it had much to do with effort.

We got smashed in the centre and became so reactive so we were just chasing them. Marshall was nearly like playing a man down as well as Henry. To try and even up the midfield I think we tried to get more numbers to the ball which just opened us up as Doggies had numbers everywhere when they got it out or on the rare occasion we won the ball had no one to kick to and turned it over. Doggies seemed to be able kick through our zone and smashed us on the outside but maybe was that exacerbated by trying to get numbers around the ball?

 

[Teflon]

So they won a premiership a few years ago, that means their culture is great eh? Nice and simple in your world, but I don't want to support a club that thinks deliberately losing enough games in a season is justifiable because your draft picks are slightly better. Play to win, always.

Ok you keep your nice and simple “culture” and I’ll take a flag thanks
Fck me losing a game to Carlton somehow sends us spiralling down a rudderless, uncultured path into doom …
Whose simple ?

 

[Teflon]

Who's suggested we should have tanked, let alone tanked multiple games? The only thing anyone has said is that it would have been handy if Higgins missed that goal. We we're never trying to tank. No one wanted us to tank. We all wanted to beat Carlton. The undisputable fact is we would have had better draft options if we had lost. And our culture wouldn't have changed one little bit.

It is what it is and hopefully the two T's will be superstars, but it was just typical St Kilda that in a game where it would have been handy to lose, our more talented opposition had half their side out injured.

The culture dribble that gets rolled out on here at times is comical.

1000%
Chicken little culture club but anyhoo it wins browny points on the internet!
I’d take the earlier pick over that 1 game any day of the week thanks

 

[Saintbloke]

I don't really think it had much to do with effort.

We got smashed in the centre and became so reactive so we were just chasing them. Marshall was nearly like playing a man down as well as Henry. To try and even up the midfield I think we tried to get more numbers to the ball which just opened us up as Doggies had numbers everywhere when they got it out or on the rare occasion we won the ball had no one to kick to and turned it over. Doggies seemed to be able kick through our zone and smashed us on the outside but maybe was that exacerbated by trying to get numbers around the ball?

I think Lyon will learn a bit from that game- it was a selection and systematic stuff-up

 

[Teflon]

I cant believe the angst over a draft spot 6 games into these kids careers. We dont even know yet what the kids drafted will be as players.

Six rounds into the 2014 season - Luke Dunstan was on track to becoming an A grade midfielder with a rising star nomination under his belt and Brownlow votes is a loss he was that dominate. Bontempelli had played 1 game.

Guess which one is the generational midfielder?

Of course we don’t know that yet no one is saying a top 5 pick was a certainty
What is a certainty was you get to pick and a choice of many better players ahead of others
In a draft where the top end midfield talent was roundly acknowledged for a club who hasn’t had a midfield for a decade …..that’s kinda useful to have
That’s all that’s been flagged
Nothing about player x being a certainty you still gotta develop them …that’s another story

 

[Teflon]

I think Lyon will learn a bit from that game- it was a selection and systematic stuff-up

I agree
I’m a huge Lyon fan but I think they stuffed this at selection
We desperately better have another tall option to halve contests forward this week
As sides will now know….squeeze saints ball use …they panic and bomb line then pick em off… at least give a Collard a chance

 

[Sainttony]

I’ve been thinking for a while that the reason why our losses become blow outs is due to a lack of on field leadership. For over 10 years there has been no Hayes or Goddard who basically say I’ve had enough of this and go that extra hard to turn things around.

Steele is a good leader but is inclined to fall away as much as others. Wilkie looks to be that type but his position does not really allow him to show the way. I’m hoping Matteas or even Hugo develop those traits but until they do we might be in for a blow out or two if things go wrong.

On the weekend I would have thrown Stocker and Mitch into the centre to crash and bash, surprising what a little bit of hurt can do. Perhaps even give Wilkie a run on ball, could not hurt, we were getting smashed and he may just show the way

 

[Nomis2933]

I’ve been thinking for a while that the reason why our losses become blow outs is due to a lack of on field leadership. For over 10 years there has been no Hayes or Goddard who basically say I’ve had enough of this and go that extra hard to turn things around.

Steele is a good leader but is inclined to fall away as much as others. Wilkie looks to be that type but his position does not really allow him to show the way. I’m hoping Matteas or even Hugo develop those traits but until they do we might be in for a blow out or two if things go wrong.

On the weekend I would have thrown Stocker and Mitch into the centre to crash and bash, surprising what a little bit of hurt can do. Perhaps even give Wilkie a run on ball, could not hurt, we were getting smashed and he may just show the way

GWS are likely about to farewell their hardman Callan Ward and its the perfect time for Steele to return to his roots and play that same role in a career full circle. He gets a chance to win a flag and we get Aleer in a straight swap. It might seem lopsided at first (capt for VFL player) but we need to think with our heads and not with our hearts. Steele's inflated money also comes off our books to help with Nas contract.

 

[Sainttony]

GWS are likely about to farewell their hardman Callan Ward and its the perfect time for Steele to return to his roots and play that same role in a career full circle. He gets a chance to win a flag and we get Aleer in a straight swap. It might seem lopsided at first (capt for VFL player) but we need to think with our heads and not with our hearts. Steele's inflated money also comes off our books to help with Nas contract.

I would not be trading Steele as I’d be worried about the impact of doing it on such a young group. What Steely has to find is another string to his bow. Can he go forward and impact or half back or even in the Jimmy role.

 

[Joffaboy]

I don't really think it had much to do with effort.

We got smashed in the centre and became so reactive so we were just chasing them. Marshall was nearly like playing a man down as well as Henry. To try and even up the midfield I think we tried to get more numbers to the ball which just opened us up as Doggies had numbers everywhere when they got it out or on the rare occasion we won the ball had no one to kick to and turned it over. Doggies seemed to be able kick through our zone and smashed us on the outside but maybe was that exacerbated by trying to get numbers around the ball?

There was no effort

 

[The Cobra]

I agree
I’m a huge Lyon fan but I think they stuffed this at selection
We desperately better have another tall option to halve contests forward this week
As sides will now know….squeeze saints ball use …they panic and bomb line then pick em off… at least give a Collard a chance

The first 10 or so minutes we looked dangerous and unpredictable as we moved the ball quickly into F50; in fact with Jones and Lobb they looked too tall and cumbersome HOWEVER after this initial period the Bulldogs midfield and clearance dominance was just so overwhelming (centre bounce clearances 20 to 6 - a smashing; 44 to 23 overall) that the back half was under siege and our forwards were completely starved of ball and got cold.

Our midfield was so poor no matter what combination we tried. The WB midfield has depth and quality we would kill for.

So the only option RTB had was the old favourite of dropping extra players behind the ball - sort of worked for a while in the back half of Q2 but we were unable to move the ball out with any fluency - therefore the only option was the dump kick to a line of outnumbering WB defenders who are good users (Dale/Johannisen etc) & took their time/switched and built again from the back.

The dam wall broke and we lost all confidence and semblance of system.

Anyway, fwiw, just maybe if we had been able to at least be competitive in the midfield and not destroyed that the game would have been a lot closer as we did have dangerous forwards when they got some quick supply. Problem we have is that the current combination of midfielders is probably as good as we have given injuries, noting it looks like maybe Marshall and Steele are playing hurt. Maybe Boxshall gets a go this week but realistically its his first game - he will just be feeling his way & hoping to contribute - he isn’t going to be Bont just yet!

 

[True Believer]

GWS are likely about to farewell their hardman Callan Ward and its the perfect time for Steele to return to his roots and play that same role in a career full circle. He gets a chance to win a flag and we get Aleer in a straight swap. It might seem lopsided at first (capt for VFL player) but we need to think with our heads and not with our hearts. Steele's inflated money also comes off our books to help with Nas contract.

Funny - your profile says St Kilda, yet your post says GWS........

 

[AirWinmar]

There was no effort

We ran further than them, ran further at high speed, had more sprints and nearly double the repeat sprints.

 

[Joffaboy]

We ran further than them, ran further at high speed, had more sprints and nearly double the repeat sprints.

And was beaten by 71 points. No effort.

 

[Saintbloke]

We ran further than them, ran further at high speed, had more sprints and nearly double the repeat sprints.

Sounds like keepings-off, but sometimes you need to play football

 

[SainterinSydney]

Funny - your profile says St Kilda, yet your post says GWS........

We would be the laughing stock of the AFL if we did that trade.

 

[The Cobra]

We ran further than them, ran further at high speed, had more sprints and nearly double the repeat sprints.

Agree there was effort - but probably reflects the fact we lost the clearance, they were then very clean by hand and foot to start a chain and then all you can do is chase - hence those stats.

 

[Ads734]

Honestly that loss is on our mids.

Can’t blame the forwards nor defenders. How are midfield got absolutely pansied.

Like let’s think for a second

Bont yes
Libba
Richards

Then ….

For Steele,Ro McRae , windy etc etc to get their pants pulled down in that manner is just horrific.

Owens or someone different needed to get on the ball a lot earlier and the attitude of te mids needed to shift way quicker. Just completely unacceptable.

The only possitive imo was Camaniti.

 

[Saints TV]

Woody leaves no stone unturned as he breaks down the brutal 71-point smashing by the Dogs on Sunday night.

Watch on YouTube now

 

[Nomis2933]

We would be the laughing stock of the AFL if we did that trade.

Im old enough to have seen multiple 'crazy' list decisions result in premierships. What was Malcolm Blight thinking moving on Chris McDermott and Tony McGuiness. They were his two midfield bulls for goodness sake. Adelaide were ready to riot. B2B flags followed.
Lockett to Sydney resulted in a GF to StKilda shortly thereafter.
Or more recently, Cooney and Griffen leaving resulted in an unexpected flag for the Dogs.
You can have a narrow view or a wider view. Steele is cooked and we would be wasting 2 yrs by letting him see out his juicy contract.

 

[SainterinSydney]

Im old enough to have seen multiple 'crazy' list decisions result in premierships. What was Malcolm Blight thinking moving on Chris McDermott and Tony McGuiness. They were his two midfield bulls for goodness sake. Adelaide were ready to riot. B2B flags followed.
Lockett to Sydney resulted in a GF to StKilda shortly thereafter.
Or more recently, Cooney and Griffen leaving resulted in an unexpected flag for the Dogs.
You can have a narrow view or a wider view. Steele is cooked and we would be wasting 2 yrs by letting him see out his juicy contract.

I'm simply saying if you are trading out your captain who is a former AA, you try and get a better deal than a defender who can't crack a game in the seniors at another team.

You are also assuming Steele is cooked where he may just be carrying an injury

 

[Nutsngum]

I'm simply saying if you are trading out your captain who is a former AA, you try and get a better deal than a defender who can't crack a game in the seniors at another team.

You are also assuming Steele is cooked where he may just be carrying an injury

Steele is obviously hampered by something and perhaps his fitness is lacking at the moment but I agree and would be pushing him into the forward line predominantly then just dropping him. He's not as big bodied as Dangerfield but Steele can absolutely offer a goal a game minimum playing up forward and provide a lot more forward pressure which is something we are lacking.

Just saying that if he is lacking impact in the midfield we would be foolish to disregard someone of his abilities, the captain no less, rather then a positional change that might be fruitful.

 

[SainterinSydney]

Steele is obviously hampered by something and perhaps his fitness is lacking at the moment but I agree and would be pushing him into the forward line predominantly then just dropping him. He's not as big bodied as Dangerfield but Steele can absolutely offer a goal a game minimum playing up forward and provide a lot more forward pressure which is something we are lacking.

Just saying that if he is lacking impact in the midfield we would be foolish to disregard someone of his abilities, the captain no less, rather then a positional change that might be fruitful.

Steele also traditionally has been a very good set shot.

 

[Nutsngum]

Steele also traditionally has been a very good set shot.

66 Goals, 43 Behinds but no idea what are set shots. Still a decent accuracy in front of the sticks.

 

[AirWinmar]

Honestly that loss is on our mids.

Can’t blame the forwards nor defenders. How are midfield got absolutely pansied.

Like let’s think for a second

Bont yes
Libba
Richards

Then ….

For Steele,Ro McRae , windy etc etc to get their pants pulled down in that manner is just horrific.

Owens or someone different needed to get on the ball a lot earlier and the attitude of te mids needed to shift way quicker. Just completely unacceptable.

The only possitive imo was Camaniti.

Yeah still can't understand how our mids got demolished so badly. 20-6 center clearances and 2 were in the 1st quarter. 4 center clearances in 3 quarters of footy..