List Mgmt. 2025 Draft & Trade Hypotheticals

[The King!]

If you are second you are last…just with a worse draft pick

But you actually aren’t, you are close to the ultimate. yes you can get stuck in mid pack or not quite good enough middling around the ladder, but making grand finals isn’t a list management issue imo. We need to win one more ****en game, that’s something that need tweaks.

I will bag the club and whine with the best of them, I get maybe some picks were shit, and some are academy players , but regardless we still are in a good spot.

If we go oh second is just last then we won’t ever achieve Jack shit imo, because you would blow things up for no reason.

 

[The King!]

Yes we can. Look at our depth vs other contenders. Talented list for sure but zero depth. Making a GF is an outpeform - fact is we can’t even point to any senior guy under pressure from the ressies. Florent discussion confirms this.

Where is our Darcy Jones, Finn Callaghan etc etc.

But is this an actual selection issue and about giving guys a chance, look at Heeney, Mills, Campbell played out of position.

other guys we let go like a Cameron , became a premiership ruckman , Nankervis we didn’t exactly pick every week.

Do we actually fail at times to give players a decent run, maybe it was Mitchell last year, or getting more time into Corey Warner, or why did we let the other young ruck McAndrew go?

I think we tend to get out 24 and run the, into the ground and don’t even check our depth.


Regardless our results indicate to me a decent list build.


right now the fact is 6-7 players are out so the depth is being pushed like it would anywhere else.


That’s just my view , but if you all disagree and want to roast the team that’s ok that your choice of course.

 

[The King!]

I think JHWF’s comment is more that we have a big cliff coming if we can’t do better at:

(a) the draft; and
(b) developing drafted players

I think our VFL leadership has been awful in recent years. Nobody is really developing in our VFL side - they’d be better off playing and learning at one of the non-affiliated VFL clubs.

As for the draft, we’ve been saved by later round picks. You can’t keep busting in the first round and expecting it won’t eventually come back to bite.

I remember hearing many times over 2 decades the cliff was coming, and maybe it finally will, but they deserve a little faith in the ability to compete.

if this is about selections and using depth, yep that’s a discussion and managing players, if it’s about coaching and mental application again I am listening

 

[JackHiscoxWasFast]

I remember hearing many times over 2 decades the cliff was coming, and maybe it finally will, but they deserve a little faith in the ability to compete.

if this is about selections and using depth, yep that’s a discussion and managing players, if it’s about coaching and mental application again I am listening

For me kingy it’s about our recruiters/ draft performance. We carried on like KB was the best thing ever, but was he really. I seriously can not think of a first round / in top 10 pick we’ve nailed excluding academies.

Developing the players is the job of the coaches but recruiters only have 1 job. Magic 8 ball would do just as good a job. Lawyers, psychologists and recruiters - each as good as each other.

I’m not discounting our success, but our recruiters must do better.
GWS depth is fathoms deeper than ours.

Maybe I get a day off like bedders.

I love fast players.

 

[The King!]

For me kingy it’s about our recruiters/ draft performance. We carried on like KB was the best thing ever, but was he really. I seriously can not think of a first round / in top 10 pick we’ve nailed excluding academies.

Developing the players is the job of the coaches but recruiters only have 1 job. Magic 8 ball would do just as good a job. Lawyers, psychologists and recruiters - each as good as each other.

I’m not discounting our success, but our recruiters must do better.
GWS depth is fathoms deeper than ours.

Maybe I get a day off like bedders.

I love fast players.

Now the mods put me in the draft thread, I will hunt you all down !!*



* joke

 

[Kbroome]

How are you measuring it? Gulden, Campbell and Stephens all played inside in their draft year.

While we have had players who played on the wing in their draft year (like Roberts, Mitchell and Vickery) however plenty of times players don't end up in their positions they do as kids. Serong was a small forward when drafted, now he's a brilliant inside mid

I was measuring it by players that spent more time than not in the middle.

I'd say most of the players you mentioned are 40% on ball 60% on the outside.

You are right that players can change position but we have changed what like 1 guy in Heeney over the course of 5 years compared to other sides that just draft on ballers

 

[SydneyBlood]

If you look back im pretty sure Mills is the 5th more recent complete inside midfielder we drafted and he was a decade ago.

• Caiden Cleary
• Angus Sheldrick
• Chad Warner
• James Rowbottom
• Callum Mills
• George Hewett
• Tom Mitchell
• Luke Parker

I may have missed a couple of players that didn't kick on (as I am a youngster) but thats it for pure on ballers in the last 17 years, 8 players across 17 years is pathetic

Roberts though playing defence now was more so seen as an inside mid when drafted perhaps?

 

[Del198236]

Yes we can. Look at our depth vs other contenders. Talented list for sure but zero depth. Making a GF is an outpeform - fact is we can’t even point to any senior guy under pressure from the ressies. Florent discussion confirms this.

Where is our Darcy Jones, Finn Callaghan etc etc.

have you seen the injury list? Its loooooong
Do you understand its actually hard (and over expensive) to trade players interstate? Do you understand that the cost of living in east Sydney compounds this??

If all you want to do is complain and criticise - go buy some shit from BCF

ps.. Florent is very fast

 

[JackHiscoxWasFast]

have you seen the injury list? Its loooooong
Do you understand its actually hard (and over expensive) to trade players interstate? Do you understand that the cost of living in east Sydney compounds this??

If all you want to do is complain and criticise - go buy some shit from BCF

ps.. Florent is very fast

GWS players live in the East as well. Just look at their list, even their injured guys. Youngsters like Fonti etc. they are miles ahead.

No excuses for us. The wilderness beckons, KB is responsible for a lot of it.

Acceptance is the first stage of meaningful change. Just get better recruiters.

And yes, I haven’t been much BCFing fun of late.

But I love your post SG

 

[Del198236]

For me kingy it’s about our recruiters/ draft performance. We carried on like KB was the best thing ever, but was he really. I seriously can not think of a first round / in top 10 pick we’ve nailed excluding academies.

Developing the players is the job of the coaches but recruiters only have 1 job. Magic 8 ball would do just as good a job. Lawyers, psychologists and recruiters - each as good as each other.

I’m not discounting our success, but our recruiters must do better.
GWS depth is fathoms deeper than ours.

Maybe I get a day off like bedders.

I love fast players.

From 2020 - 2023 it was regularly stated from all media that we had the best young list in the comp.
That very young list made (completely unexpectedly) finals in 2021 and the granny in 2022.
KB was proven to be an excellent list manager
The coaching staff did an excellent job at developing players - this is proven by our success and the fact that we've had 2 x top 10 picks at the draft in 20 years!

A few years ago, I counted 27.. yes 27! first round picks on the giants list. The fact that we beat them 3 times last year is simply more proof that the Swans have recruited and developed players extremely well.

Again.. go to BCF if all you want to do is whinge

 

[JackHiscoxWasFast]

From 2020 - 2023 it was regularly stated from all media that we had the best young list in the comp.
That very young list made (completely unexpectedly) finals in 2021 and the granny in 2022.
KB was proven to be an excellent list manager
The coaching staff did an excellent job at developing players - this is proven by our success and the fact that we've had 2 x top 10 picks at the draft in 20 years!

A few years ago, I counted 27.. yes 27! first round picks on the giants list. The fact that we beat them 3 times last year is simply more proof that the Swans have recruited and developed players extremely well.

Again.. go to BCF if all you want to do is whinge

You may have a different view after this week. Not whinging - my view of the facts.

 

[Kbroome]

Roberts though playing defence now was more so seen as an inside mid when drafted perhaps?

Yes Roberts could technically qualify but i'd scratch him off the list as he looks a lot better at half back than the mid/HFF that he was drafted as. Also would say Sydney seemed to view him as a winger early

 

[Kiama Chris]

For me kingy it’s about our recruiters/ draft performance. We carried on like KB was the best thing ever, but was he really. I seriously can not think of a first round / in top 10 pick we’ve nailed excluding academies.

Developing the players is the job of the coaches but recruiters only have 1 job. Magic 8 ball would do just as good a job. Lawyers, psychologists and recruiters - each as good as each other.

I’m not discounting our success, but our recruiters must do better.
GWS depth is fathoms deeper than ours.

Maybe I get a day off like bedders.

I love fast players.

I've had an issue with our recruiters for a long time (that many have shared) where they seem to draft for skills over body size and shape and appetite for the contest. I'm with them about trying to draft character. That includes work ethic and determination.
If you look back at who have been delisted it's often been a lack of those characteristics.
Trading you just do the best you can.

 

[Del198236]

You may have a different view after this week. Not whinging - my view of the facts.

I reckon the Lions will smash us.. but that won't change my view.. its a long season and with all the injuries we have (most in the AFL), to judge after two weeks is what angry, arrogant supporters do (and second rate media personalities).
If we win, will you have a different view?

As you view the facts, do you see Mills and Gulden injured? Do you see the midfield depth in Adams and Cleary also injured?
Do you see Logan, McLean unavailable? do you see the depth players Francis, Fox, Edwards, Snell, Riak unavailable?
Do you see Cunningham unavailable? At least we've got Paton..
Paton and Bice are examples of trying to find depth players that are both cheap (draft capital and Salary cap) and ready to play. Maybe, who's knows - just guessing, the Swans are trying to save money to try and keep this list together? next in line is Warner, who West Coast will be offering truckloads for

 

[JackHiscoxWasFast]

I reckon the Lions will smash us.. but that won't change my view.. its a long season and with all the injuries we have (most in the AFL), to judge after two weeks is what angry, arrogant supporters do (and second rate media personalities).
If we win, will you have a different view?

As you view the facts, do you see Mills and Gulden injured? Do you see the midfield depth in Adams and Cleary also injured?
Do you see Logan, McLean unavailable? do you see the depth players Francis, Fox, Edwards, Snell, Riak unavailable?
Do you see Cunningham unavailable? At least we've got Paton..
Paton and Bice are examples of trying to find depth players that are both cheap (draft capital and Salary cap) and ready to play. Maybe, who's knows - just guessing, the Swans are trying to save money to try and keep this list together? next in line is Warner, who West Coast will be offering truckloads for

Think you are still missing my point so I will be clearer - this is about our recruiters - specifically their performance in the draft over many years- not the club, not the supporters and not injuries.

1. are you satisfied with our recruiters ?
2. Are you satisfied with non academy draft picks ?
3. Who has come on of our first round picks in the past few years.

You can’t keep fluking talent from second / third rounders.

Calling this out is fact based not anger or arrogance as you presume.

If you are satisfied, fine, that’s up to you. I will continue to call out areas where I see imprivement needed ( eg lawyers, psychologists) because if we don’t recognise the problem we won’t seek to improve.

I like fast players.

 

[Del198236]

Think you are still missing my point so I will be clearer - this is about our recruiters - specifically their performance in the draft over many years- not the club, not the supporters and not injuries.

1. are you satisfied with our recruiters ?
2. Are you satisfied with non academy draft picks ?
3. Who has come on of our first round picks in the past few years.

You can’t keep fluking talent from second / third rounders.

Calling this out is fact based not anger or arrogance as you presume.

If you are satisfied, fine, that’s up to you. I will continue to call out areas where I see imprivement needed ( eg lawyers, psychologists) because if we don’t recognise the problem we won’t seek to improve.

I like fast players.

1.. yes
2.. yes
3.. please note that our recent 1st round picks have been - p22, p16, p20, p18. Not exactly good 1st round picks.
Snell looks likely to be a good pickup. Im a bigger fan of Datolli (injured) than I ever was of Sheldrick (injuries have stunted his development) or Konstanty.
Its worth acknowledging that theres been a lack of senior game time (and therefore development) for these players and our 2nd rounders, due to already having a very young b23 from 2020-2023, often the youngest team of the round. How many U22's in one team is too many? Ive heard many coaches talk about this.

There are so many important details that you simply haven't acknowledged. Things like which 18yo's want to get away from their home state, List needs, team harmony, (no dickhead policy), psychology, etc etc.
It shits me when posters state 'Facts', when these 'Facts' are based on bugger all evidence, or at least a tiny fraction of the information that our recruiters and coaches have - so they're not factual at all

Theres a reason we only spent two years near the bottom (please compare to other clubs rebuilds), theres a reason we made 2 grand finals in the last 4 years. Its not because we simply trade in Gun players each year to fill holes, Its not because we have an endless stream of high draft picks, Its because we draft and develop extremely well with what's available

You dont like Florent, Campbell and now Sheldrick - they're fast

 

[RedBloodBlackSwan]

have you seen the injury list? Its loooooong
Do you understand its actually hard (and over expensive) to trade players interstate? Do you understand that the cost of living in east Sydney compounds this??

If all you want to do is complain and criticise - go buy some shit from BCF

ps.. Florent is very fast

I wonder which teams list best resembles BCF. Looks good in the packet but in reality is poor quality.

You’d think maybe Essendon for the past decade or so, with Swans being GF specialists!

Edit: you could call it the BCF’ing fun award

 

[rustycrate]

I wonder which teams list best resembles BCF. Looks good in the packet but in reality is poor quality.

You’d think maybe Essendon for the past decade or so, with Swans being GF specialists!

Edit: you could call it the BCF’ing fun award

 

[rustycrate]

Sydney could be a candidate for the GF Solo Award

Lite on the fizz so you can Slam it down fast.

 

[JackHiscoxWasFast]

1.. yes
2.. yes
3.. please note that our recent 1st round picks have been - p22, p16, p20, p18. Not exactly good 1st round picks.
Snell looks likely to be a good pickup. Im a bigger fan of Datolli (injured) than I ever was of Sheldrick (injuries have stunted his development) or Konstanty.
Its worth acknowledging that theres been a lack of senior game time (and therefore development) for these players and our 2nd rounders, due to already having a very young b23 from 2020-2023, often the youngest team of the round. How many U22's in one team is too many? Ive heard many coaches talk about this.

There are so many important details that you simply haven't acknowledged. Things like which 18yo's want to get away from their home state, List needs, team harmony, (no dickhead policy), psychology, etc etc.
It shits me when posters state 'Facts', when these 'Facts' are based on bugger all evidence, or at least a tiny fraction of the information that our recruiters and coaches have - so they're not factual at all

Theres a reason we only spent two years near the bottom (please compare to other clubs rebuilds), theres a reason we made 2 grand finals in the last 4 years. Its not because we simply trade in Gun players each year to fill holes, Its not because we have an endless stream of high draft picks, Its because we draft and develop extremely well with what's available

You dont like Florent, Campbell and now Sheldrick - they're fast

Stephens - should have been fired for that. Logan was an awesome pick at the time, only cos North are idiots.

Only Florent annoys me - never said a bad word on gus and Campbell ok. Florent shops at BCF so you’re no chance of bumping into him lol.

 

[Kiama Chris]

Stephens - should have been fired for that. Logan was an awesome pick at the time, only cos North are idiots.

Only Florent annoys me - never said a bad word on gus and Campbell ok. Florent shops at BCF so you’re no chance of bumping into him lol.

Florent is an example of what I boringly talk about. Took almost 3 years to develop a body that could compete.

 

[TasSixer]

We need a key forward badly. I don't know what's going on with JUH but we should be looking at him, Oscar Allen would be the dream but we probably don't have the cash unless Warner leaves and he probably wouldn't choose us. Which is why JUH may be our best option as a player that needs a change of scenery.

 

[bedford]

We need a key forward badly. I don't know what's going on with JUH but we should be looking at him, Oscar Allen would be the dream but we probably don't have the cash unless Warner leaves and he probably wouldn't choose us. Which is why JUH may be our best option as a player that needs a change of scenery.

Could've and should've taken Harry Armstrong and he told me that the swans never had any interest in him . Mind boggling with his performances for Vic Metro and Dragons , absolutely staggering

 

[LukeParkerno1]

We need a key forward badly. I don't know what's going on with JUH but we should be looking at him, Oscar Allen would be the dream but we probably don't have the cash unless Warner leaves and he probably wouldn't choose us. Which is why JUH may be our best option as a player that needs a change of scenery.

Too expensive and way too much a risk. JUH is asking for trouble.

If you want to keep Warner we are not going to have ANY picks to play with this year, we need more not less for our matching

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Could've and should've taken Harry Armstrong and he told me that the swans never had any interest in him . Mind boggling with his performances for Vic Metro and Dragons , absolutely staggering

Was the hardest one to pick a range, clubs may regret it however he was one dimensional and that would scare clubs taking him early. Probably went the right range looking back, I just thought a club would have punted on him earlier