Autopsy 2025 Late flourish doesn't mask embarrassment

[Gethelred]

Who cares. Anyone is better than Voss. How about no coach? That would work better

Would you accept Teague, Bolton or Malthouse back?

 

[BlueTongue]

Wright is definitely no Meddi

Wright wont be a Messiah, he had dream drafts at the Hawks, an at the Pies he had a lot of guys like Derek Hine to help him and advise him.. He cannot rig the draft either. At best he can tinker at the edges. Just saying.

Well, he can cut the rot out of our club and then move on if need be. Have a bunch of passive onlookers running the club while focussing more on their own businesses outside of the club is killing us anyway.

 

[branedotorg]

Would you accept Teague, Bolton or Malthouse back?

As a sugar hit I think any of them would provide better results for the rest of the year tbh.

Not sold as long term options although I think Bolton would be the most likely out of that group

 

[Lukeblueboy]

First time in a couple of years that I haven’t sat and watched us play.

Went out and continued building my deck out the front.

Just sad with the result!

 

[4flagsin5yrs]

The comments about gutting the list are silly. However difficult decisions have to be made. G.W. was the best man available

and he does have a vey impressive resume. He will be having sleepless nights, planning what he wants to do with our list.

TDK leaves, no brainer. One of H or Charlie, my preference is now C.C. be traded as well. Would prefer to keep Walshy,

but he could be shopped around. Trading two, maybe three of our stars, would open up enough cap space to recruit four or

five quality player's. I trust G.W. will take us in the Right direction.

i'm fine with losing Charlie, Walsh and TDK.

Would allow us to acquire (minimum) two top end players (Butters one ideally) plus a couple of establish b graders (Bergman).... 4 or 5 ready made established types changes our profile drastically.

TDK yesterday was close to embarrassing (unless he was hurt?). Cripps likewise (is he carrying an injury?). Ditto Charlie...

Still have top end talent of Cripps, Big H, Weiters, Cerra, Hewett (Cripps, Cerra and George had truly shocking games yesterday) plus JSOS, Newy, Guv, Kemp...

Kids - Smith, HOF, Carroll, O. Hollands (pls. back on the wing), Lord. The Campos, Moir, Lemmey (would be giving game time rest of the year).

Is E. Hollands a write off?

Priority needs - a competitive ruck (who can mark and go forward a bit), mids - speed and ball use), HFF/SF - blokes with hard edged ticker and skill. A key forward....

Marginal blokes - Saad, Acres, the whole SF brigade.... Voss and his entire crew. Austin.

Doc must retire.

Terminate without blinking - Lloyd.

 

[Shambolic]

Took my boy along and was very disappointed.

• Very slow
• lame first quarter
• very few positive handball and kicks. lots of side kicks in the first 3/4 when a fast kick would work
• Cerra's holding the ball against the slowest man in the comp was heartbreaking
• yet again 3 to 4 players just cant touch the ball
• Pitto is a liability at this level

All up my hopes are to transition 3-4 players out for players with pace and can kick. Smith is one such player but we have morphed in to a very slow list without dare

 

[Sweet Seventeen]

I’m spooked by the fear of us drafting another group of Dow, OBrien and Petreski-Seton with a pinch of Stocker. How many first round midfield picks can you torch?

Draft kids this year are reportedly underwhelming. Would prefer we target free agents, mature age recruits.

 

[myblueroan]

Would you accept Teague, Bolton or Malthouse back?

 

[Faucon Bleu]

Eight players eating up the salary cap getting paid millions, they don't give a shit about Carlton or the supporters. The coach can't coach, no game plan other than win the center clearance's and then wish upon a star our forwards can capitalize by some miracle.

We have a ton of dumb, one paced, no skills, conditional shit kickers in the the team. Need to gut the list, we have no draft picks as well, maybe getting rid of the "superstars" will give us some draft picks and salary cap room.

I would put Curnow, McKay, Walsh, Cripps, Cerra on the table, get something for them no one player is bigger than the club, 23 prem final was an abnormally. TDK is gone better he ****s off, no way he is worth 1.7 mil. Williams, McGovern, Saad can pack their bags as well.

Need to gut the list, Voss and his assistants can leave as well, need to start afresh, another 5 years of rebuilding, we have turned into a shit club with no soul, or heart. And we are being led by so called leaders that just don't care, SOS should be the captain of this club, as least he bleed for Carlton.

Going to be very painful for us, but ****ed if I am going to waster my hard earned money of this shit club.

 

[BlueTongue]

Draft kids this year are reportedly underwhelming. Would prefer we target free agents, mature age recruits.

Im not against this, because we should have offloaded our injury prone and hitting the draft years bfore we did, but for the sake of list balance, we need to target players who will be useful for a few years to come, not sugar hits hoping to jag a flag in the next year or two.

 

[gbatman]

McRae turned it around quickly. Can happen

They had been rebuilding leading up to his arrival. They lost 2018, failed in 2019 and began refreshing the list. He's a good coach but their direction and recruiting leading up to his arrival were on point.

We haven't begun yet. Still don't value pace and kicking skills. Brought in one superstar and a couple of youngsters who can't kick and not a lot of pace last draft.

We haven't begun yet. We have 2-4 years of very solid work to do. It's not a complete rebuild. It's what Collingwood did between 2019-2021 that lead to them turning back up as a contender again in 2022 onwards.

It can happen quickly but not one or two years quickly.

 

[gbatman]

We are bad but our entire best 22 forward line is also out so things will look worse than they are.

Curnow unfit
Cottrell
Hollands
McKay
Kemp
Smith

They would be our best 22 forward line if everyone was fit. Only really Williams is up and going from our best 7 forwards.

 

[DirtyLeeds]

I don't ever disagree but your tone is just too over the top "..this shit club..." go a barrack for some other team like Collingwood!

 

[4flagsin5yrs]

Took my boy along and was very disappointed.

• Very slow
• lame first quarter
• very few positive handball and kicks. lots of side kicks in the first 3/4 when a fast kick would work
• Cerra's holding the ball against the slowest man in the comp was heartbreaking
• yet again 3 to 4 players just cant touch the ball
• Pitto is a liability at this level

All up my hopes are to transition 3-4 players out for players with pace and can kick. Smith is one such player but we have morphed in to a very slow list without dare

Doc has become one of the worst offenders.

 

[TheReal99prelim]

What if it's not just Voss?

What if it's not just the playing group?

What if it's BOTH being equally awful?

(I still maintain we should have worked 'thrubbing' into the autopsy thread title.)

I would love to run a hypothetical survey with the following question:

With EVERYTHING EXACTLY THE SAME (playing list, trades, picks, injuries, fixture, circumstances, assistants, staff, EVERYTHING) do you believe we would be in the same position today if either McRae or Kingsley were our coach from the beginning of 2022?

Now I understand people will say that if Mcrae/Kingsley were our coach, they would've changed things but that's not what I'm saying

The ONLY change is Mcrae or Kingsley. Everything else remains EXACTLY EXACTLY EXACTLY the same

I'll start off...my answer is an EMPHATIC NO...we would be in a better position. I can't say how much better, but BETTER

 

[myblueroan]

Im not against this, because we should have offloaded our injury prone and hitting the draft years bfore we did, but for the sake of list balance, we need to target players who will be useful for a few years to come, not sugar hits hoping to jag a flag in the next year or two.

Although... I could cop a sugar hit tbh.

We aren't finals bound if we don't make

 

[TheReal99prelim]

Doc has become one of the worst offenders.

Is that the same Doc who selfishly convinced gullible Voss to play him in a final after an ACL and without match practice for 6 months???

 

[myblueroan]

I would love to run a hypothetical survey with the following question:

With EVERYTHING EXACTLY THE SAME (playing list, trades, picks, injuries, fixture, circumstances, assistants, staff, EVERYTHING) do you believe we would be in the same position today if either McRae or Kingsley were our coach from the beginning of 2022?

Now I understand people will say that if Mcrae/Kingsley were our coach, they would've changed things but that's not what I'm saying

The ONLY change is Mcrae or Kingsley. Everything else remains EXACTLY EXACTLY EXACTLY the same

I'll start off...my answer is an EMPHATIC NO...we would be in a better position. I can't say how much better, but BETTER

Or Chris Scott or Sam Mitchell or ...

 

[TheReal99prelim]

I think he's probably as fed up as the supporters after busting a gut and seeing us regressing. It's not like he's recruiting or strategizing. We backed our coach in and this is payday.

He's a great player (2 brownlows)
He's not a leader's bootlace
Set the tone in the first 30 seconds when he did what he always does...try and do it all himself, not bring his teammates along or trust them and then gets caught holding the ball

 

[TheReal99prelim]

If memory serves in the match that got Bolts sacked, he was completely nullified by an Essendon first gamer...

He then played arguably his best game ever the next week under Teague against Brisbane

Not a good look

I rest my case

 

[Blue_Fusion]

Wasn’t it 2023. Mostly same group. Need to look at reasons why

I'll die on this hill... it all started with bs selections last year...

Cottrell and Cerra straight back in after lengthy spells and dropping players who were performing their role well to make room for them... then the EF was the nail in the coffin...

Doc who hadn't played all year, straight in for that fairy tale feel good story, TDK sub... subbing MK off after the bloke just had his kid and still made the journey for the team... Cincotta got dropped...

You can't try and instill squad mentality and then do shit like that.

 

[4flagsin5yrs]

I’m spooked by the fear of us drafting another group of Dow, OBrien and Petreski-Seton with a pinch of Stocker. How many first round midfield picks can you torch?

we need to buy a bunch of well established players - guys in the 23-30yo bracket.... guys with a track record.

 

[Gethelred]

I would love to run a hypothetical survey with the following question:

With EVERYTHING EXACTLY THE SAME (playing list, trades, picks, injuries, fixture, circumstances, assistants, staff, EVERYTHING) do you believe we would be in the same position today if either McRae or Kingsley were our coach from the beginning of 2022?

Now I understand people will say that if Mcrae/Kingsley were our coach, they would've changed things but that's not what I'm saying

The ONLY change is Mcrae or Kingsley. Everything else remains EXACTLY EXACTLY EXACTLY the same

I'll start off...my answer is an EMPHATIC NO...we would be in a better position. I can't say how much better, but BETTER

I would like to take issue with your question.

If we reran this season with all of the same variables in place - injuries occurring when they have, opposition form, etc - we would get different results without changing a single thing. Footy's a weird game; the ball bounces in weird ways, and sometimes it bounces for you.

So, if I think that just rerunning this season with everything exactly the same might result in a different series of outcomes, then I am compelled to answer no to your question regardless; no two versions of this experiment with all the variables being as close to the same as they can be made to be by human hands would result in an identical outcome, so when you change any of the variables things might fluctuate further.

A better question might be:

With EVERYTHING EXACTLY THE SAME (playing list, trades, picks, injuries, fixture, circumstances, assistants, staff, EVERYTHING) do you believe we would be in a similar position today if either McRae or Kingsley were our coach from the beginning of 2022?

... because it accounts for those minute differences in fortune that cannot be accounted for.

And my answer to that question would be, probably, yes. A coach cannot implement their plans with one hand tied behind their back. A coach cannot prevent injuries.

People seem to think an aspect of the problem is related to buy in, despite multiple ex Carlton players going public with the pressure to perform placed on them here forcing them into mistakes out of fear of ****ing up. Those players - in particular, Lachie Henderson, David Gowers and Zac Tuohy - all stated that at their new club they were much more relaxed, given time away and the pressure was significantly less.

When are you more likely to make a mistake: when you are under no pressure, or when you are under considerable pressure?

Look at the leaders right now, and seriously tell me they're not playing as though they feel the weight of the world is on them; as though each fumble, each missed shot might be the end of the season, their career? For all the comparisons to Collingwood people make, it weirds me out how frustrated people get at someone like Motts or Acres when they screw up. A feature of Fly's leadership has been a cavalier position on errors; they laugh at missed shots, they giggle when they hit one out of bounds on the full. I don't know about you, but I reckon if we had Fly coaching us there'd be more than a few discontents fuming at the sight of one of our players laughing when they missed a shot on goal.

I dunno. I still really just dunno. I don't know what will fix it, and I don't know what will pacify the hordes of dissatisfied and angry Blues. But I cannot help feeling as though an awful lot of this is not logical, and very explicitly emotionally driven.

And people are entitled to feel these things, but making decisions based on them is not a good idea.

 

[Blue_Fusion]

I’m spooked by the fear of us drafting another group of Dow, OBrien and Petreski-Seton with a pinch of Stocker. How many first round midfield picks can you torch?

Well, we don't have Silvagni making those picks this time...

 

[dumb]

hard to envision wright being very enthused about voss continuing in 2026 after this loss, and the performance of the team in general. all of our regular loss markers were there. on top of some injury of course.
if he doesn't run the broom through voss, he'll have to run the broom through his methods. maybe remind recruiting folk of a few things.

maybe someone like binns won't make it, who knows. but at least we've given ourselves a chance to make an informed choice. time to see what else is in the cupboard.