List Mgmt. 2025 List Management discussion - part 2

[Sainter62]

Dunno if I'm in the minority but I'm excited if we sign TDK. His form hasn't been great of late but the media talk around his contact, coupled with playing in a side which was expected to challenge (I never saw it) had probably contributed.

• Salary cap space is bank it and use it or lose it. Considering the past 4 years, it's likely that his contact is going to be massively front ended and drop down to a reasonable amount when everyone else is coming up for renewal around the new CBA at the end of 27. Use it now on TDK and Aleer. It's either on them or others unproven on the list. There is more than enough room for him and NWM, windy etc... in the past we have just overpaid spuds, let's take a risk in the chase for the 2nd flag.

• I love Marshall, but he's the wrong side of 30 and no Gawn where he will improve from here. There is no upside. I see Heath as his replacement and Dodson as the understudy. Maybe as a backup is King falls over?

• Greg Swann had made it no secret that he hates the current centre Ruck wrestles and wants change. He was the same at Brisbane. If changes are made to favour tap ruckman with leap, TDK is perfect and RoMa is dead in the water. The 6-6-6 rule makes centre tap work more important than ever, having a leaper putting it down the throat of Garcia, Boxhall, NWM etc... is worth the punt. At the least, the bounce is gone I reckon which will favour tap ruckman.

• TDK is only 26. Using half a season of middling form to determine he will be a bust is as sensible as using half a season to determine that someone is worth 2m a year....

I think Dougs is near gone and Webster will be another yard slower next year so we need to keep churning and getting people in under a fantastic coach. Putting someone like Dodson up against Gawn, Witts etc.. Weekly at this stage of his career is a recipe for disaster.

Where has it been confirmed by the AFL that the bounce is gone??

 

[BrutThough]

The optimist in me thinks this is what they're desperately trying to tell Nas and that he hasn't made a commitment to them.

Optimistically, it could also be read as he's open about talking about it because they feel like long shots to land him. Whereas, if they had a confirmed yes they might be more coy about the situation to keep the pressure off them not having any picks.

But pessimistically, it could just be that they know they are getting him and dont care because they expect SOS to cave to whatever their offer is.

 

[stavro#4]

Chris Davies on ABC Sport.

95K views · 204 reactions | Zak Butters is one of the most talked-about names in footy right now. Port Adelaide’s GM of football Chris Davies gives us the inside word on where contract talks are at, and whether they can make a play for Saints star N

Zak Butters is one of the most talked-about names in footy right now. Port Adelaide’s GM of football Chris Davies gives us the inside word on where contract talks are at, and whether they can make a...

www.facebook.com

Thanks mate.

So there is significantly more context than the tweet.

He was asked about Butters and whether he was staying or going and needing to trade him for currency and then He is talking about structuring deals and involving other clubs to get what is required for a trade and also says it’s not just Nasiah but anyone.


So the context isn’t, here is future picks for NWM or that they are confident in landing him etc.

It’s about the process they will undertake.

 

[CaptainRisky]

I think its actually more a culture thing but also where the team is at.

Parra wont play finals and is already looking to get some experience into the team for 26. You also cant push up a players value in the NRL because they dont trade.

Again, Nas playing in the midfield doesnt mean we know anything about him staying or going, its just not really comparable to the NRL.

Yeah i did get it the first time , You sound like a teacher

 

[ScrappyDo]

Make up your mind, liking both posts ScrappyDo ….
You’re showing you bi-polarity in consecutive posts!

I appreciate the input from other posters so I don't need to agree or disagree with the content. The Nas situation offers that juxtaposition of hope and realism of which both sides can offer solace and comedic value. Nas is the Schroedinger's cat of football.

 

[Joffaboy]

I think its actually more a culture thing but also where the team is at.

Parra wont play finals and is already looking to get some experience into the team for 26. You also cant push up a players value in the NRL because they dont trade.

Again, Nas playing in the midfield doesnt mean we know anything about him staying or going, its just not really comparable to the NRL.

More NRL recruiting structure more than anything.
They tried to introduce a draft years ago and it was defeated in court on restraint of trade.
Since players sign contracts mid year for other clubs and it is announced. The players don't care as many have three or four clubs over their career and supporters are used to it. Players can also be released mid year and be playing for a different club the next week.
Due to our trading rules and draft our players can't do this so TDK and NAZ are in this silly position they can't say what they are doing.
AFL supporters are still not conditioned for this and wouldn't take kindly to it.

 

[stavro#4]

In other news … RTB & AB might be about to have a win.

 

[Diehard Saint]

In other news … RTB & AB might be about to have a win.

Guess we’ll hear more about it tonight.
Hopefully a totally uncompromised first round at the draft is next.

 

[MUFASA12]

In other news … RTB & AB might be about to have a win.

Yeh then players will refuse to play for teams and ask for trades in the first year, completely counterproductive. Also Nick Riewoldt has 3 sons that could well be good players. This isn’t good at all.

 

[Yawkey way]

I love Windy but he was unsighted in the first half playing on ball. If he wants the mega contract he needs to play well on a more consistent basis.

Exactly, drinking our won bath water now.

Nas is a young gun and can be a match winner but I hate the way we’re playing at present, it’s not winning football. Knocking off Melbourne in a freak comeback while ignoring 3 quarters of rubbish is crazy, as is getting pumped about a couple of great plays against a very poor north.


I likened Ross to using Nas like Diacos the problem is he’s not Diacos and we’re not Collingwood but it’s actually worse than that. What it really looks like is an under 12 game where Nas is the teams biggest and best player, Ross is his dad and coach. His only instruction week after week is give the ball to Nas he’ll do the rest.

If we keep playing like this I’ll stop watching, I actually thought Ross was better than this, it’s actually embarrassing. You can expect 2 more weeks of this rubbish then we’ll see what it looks like against a decent team.

 

[jwikked]

Yeh then players will refuse to play for teams and ask for trades in the first year, completely counterproductive. Also Nick Riewoldt has 3 sons that could well be good players. This isn’t good at all.

Nah it'll be great seeing them go to Tasmania to play out their careers

This is what most people here have been begging for

 

[Saint Shags]

In other news … RTB & AB might be about to have a win.

Better hope that none of those Reiwoldt boys take up the game.

Don't need to get rid of it or Academies. You just need to pay a fair price. The set up of using 'points' was doomed to fail. Make clubs have within 5-10 picks of the player. Means clubs need to actually trade up not down.

 

[stavro#4]

Yeh then players will refuse to play for teams and ask for trades in the first year, completely counterproductive. Also Nick Riewoldt has 3 sons that could well be good players. This isn’t good at all.

If a club wants someone who was a father son. They should trade for a pick to acquire one.

Ross made a great point. Let’s see how much clubs care about developing players in academies when the first round freebies stop.

If it’s truly about growing the game. You’ll continue to put the work in and you’ll acquire the talent in the second round onwards.

 

[marcus1232]

If a club wants someone who was a father son. They should trade for a pick to acquire one.

Ross made a great point. Let’s see how much clubs care about developing players in academies when the first round freebies stop.

If it’s truly about growing the game. You’ll continue to put the work in and you’ll acquire the talent in the second round onwards.

You would just learn to hide your talent better

 

[Pakenhamsaint]

RTB, TDK, NWM, MSG.

FMD.

LOL

 

[CaptainRisky]

Exactly, drinking our won bath water now.

Nas is a young gun and can be a match winner but I hate the way we’re playing at present, it’s not winning football. Knocking off Melbourne in a freak comeback while ignoring 3 quarters of rubbish is crazy, as is getting pumped about a couple of great plays against a very poor north.


I likened Ross to using Nas like Diacos the problem is he’s not Diacos and we’re not Collingwood but it’s actually worse than that. What it really looks like is an under 12 game where Nas is the teams biggest and best player, Ross is his dad and coach. His only instruction week after week is give the ball to Nas he’ll do the rest.

If we keep playing like this I’ll stop watching, I actually thought Ross was better than this, it’s actually embarrassing. You can expect 2 more weeks of this rubbish then we’ll see what it looks like against a decent team.

Yep , way too may posters locked themselves in the bathroom with their phone and a box of tissues after watching one decent quarter of footy thinking we are now all of a sudden good team , we are still miles off it as i have said before only to be called negative.
There is a lot of work to be done during the off season or we are just going to see another year like the last two

 

[CaptainRisky]

You would just learn to hide your talent better

Where do you hide talent , its 2025 not 1985 nothing is secret these days

 

[mad-saint-guy]

Just saw the RL presser from after the game - he sounds like he's given up hope on Nas staying. "Good luck to him" isn't a phrase you use for a player who is sticking around

 

[stavro#4]

You would just learn to hide your talent better

Maybe.

But not many father sons or academy listed kids are on the radar and out of traditional pathways.

 

[jwikked]

Where do you hide talent , its 2025 not 1985 nothing is secret these days

No club would tell a 15/16 year old to only play at 80% to hide their power level lol, and any club that would should rightfully be laughed out of the league.

 

[gubby88]

Exactly, drinking our won bath water now.

Nas is a young gun and can be a match winner but I hate the way we’re playing at present, it’s not winning football. Knocking off Melbourne in a freak comeback while ignoring 3 quarters of rubbish is crazy, as is getting pumped about a couple of great plays against a very poor north.


I likened Ross to using Nas like Diacos the problem is he’s not Diacos and we’re not Collingwood but it’s actually worse than that. What it really looks like is an under 12 game where Nas is the teams biggest and best player, Ross is his dad and coach. His only instruction week after week is give the ball to Nas he’ll do the rest.

If we keep playing like this I’ll stop watching, I actually thought Ross was better than this, it’s actually embarrassing. You can expect 2 more weeks of this rubbish then we’ll see what it looks like against a decent team.

to be fair, the game yesterday was exactly the same as the last few games we have played against North. We seem to just make it a slog against the,. But apart from last week, the previous 5 weeks i felt were excellent against top tier teams

 

[hoovinha]

Where has it been confirmed by the AFL that the bounce is gone??

It hasn't. It's my opinion it's gone though. If not next season then the following season in my opinion.

They are looking to reduce dead time to reduce QTR time length and 4+ bounce recalls a game is a quick way to do this.

The incoming footy CEO also spoke on it on SEN a couple of weeks ago. He also mentioned it's an impediment to umpires and can often leave them in vulnerable positions to collisions as opposed to a consistent known in throwing the ball up.

Just my opinion. Play on.

 

[jwikked]

Where has it been confirmed by the AFL that the bounce is gone??

Hasn't been confirmed officially, but it seems clear from Swanns interviews that it's likely gone. Personally, I like the bounce, and wish they'd keep it. I like the variability it brings. I'd get rid of recalling a bad bounce. Just play on, doesn't matter if it bounces 20 meters in one direction, it's still random

But if removing the bounce will save the current length of quarters, fine.

 

[Sainter62]

It hasn't. It's my opinion it's gone though. If not next season then the following season in my opinion.

They are looking to reduce dead time to reduce QTR time length and 4+ bounce recalls a game is a quick way to do this.

The incoming footy CEO also spoke on it on SEN a couple of weeks ago. He also mentioned it's an impediment to umpires and can often leave them in vulnerable positions to collisions as opposed to a consistent known in throwing the ball up.

Just my opinion. Play on.

Fair enough. As an ex-umpire in Brisbane, I can attest to the difficulties of bouncing

 

[The Punter]

New thread (part 2) so I'll restate my case:

• the father-son rule adds nothing to the game. No one watches because of it. No other league in the world worth anything has it. It only entrenches disadvantage (better teams are more likely to have 100 game players). All based on dumb, stupid luck: the ability for past players to sire sons. It's ridiculous on face value.
• The only fair price is the cost of acquiring the draft pick necessary in a mutually agreeable trade. Richmond couldn't pick Ashcroft last year under any circumstance. North couldn't pick Sam Darcy in 2021 under any circumstance. A team that had just made the grand final had exclusive access to one of the best two players in the draft. If the club wants a player, they should have to trade for that draft pick.
• The NGA academies never added anything. Abolish.
• The northern academies do benefit the league as the game needs to grow and those clubs need homegrown heroes. But the cost can't be made fair. So a compromise: one pick each year outside the draft for those four clubs.
• I would make these changes along with a significant further increase in the salary cap, a percentage cut in the salary floor, a reduction in years for free agency rights to kick in, and a removal of the prohibition on players vetoing trades.